WIP- Dungeon/Ransacked castle environment
polycounter lvl 12
Hey,
So I've started working on a new environment. I am going for an old dungeon/ransacked castle. I have a few concept ideas in mind, here is the inspiration:
I will be going for a more Oblivion-ish style with this. I've currently started the block-out process. Please keep in mind this was done very quickly, and I'll be refining the block-out more as I go on.
I've yet to decide what will be put in at the far end, at the top of the stairs, but I'll get to that eventually. (Btw, that little red box is a scale reference, 120 unreal units tall). Yes, I know those steps are too small compared to the person, but I'll rearrange that once I'm back from school.
So I've started working on a new environment. I am going for an old dungeon/ransacked castle. I have a few concept ideas in mind, here is the inspiration:
I will be going for a more Oblivion-ish style with this. I've currently started the block-out process. Please keep in mind this was done very quickly, and I'll be refining the block-out more as I go on.
I've yet to decide what will be put in at the far end, at the top of the stairs, but I'll get to that eventually. (Btw, that little red box is a scale reference, 120 unreal units tall). Yes, I know those steps are too small compared to the person, but I'll rearrange that once I'm back from school.
Replies
So I've worked alot on the layout and such. Improved the general look of things. At the far end, the roof/ceiling has collapsed, revealing the outdoors. There will be large boulders, and rubble and vegetation hiding the horizon line. Now, I am aware that thing whole thing is terribly lit, but that's not my focus at the moment.
*Edit*
Small update! Continued working on the blockout! It's getting there
The bird-like thing at the top of the stairs will be a statue. The focal point of the scene. What do you guys think?
@Cholden: Yeah this is the first time I am making an environment this way. It is definitely one of the better methods for sure!
@Marcus: Thanks! I am currently working on the section you mentioned was a little empty, but it's like you said, it's still in block-out phase right now. I'll be getting this into UDK tonight. Once the blockout is done in UDK and I have a good sense of what I want my lighting to look like, then I'll head on into Mudbox an Zbrush for some nice High Poly work.
http://www.warhammeronline.com/conceptart/conceptArt_2008.php
Started working on the base high poly meshes. I will bring these into mudbox and Zbrush later. I will most likely sculpt the pillars , but i've yet to determine their final shape.
Crits appreciated!
The light rays, photoshopped?
http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=all&q=fountains+abbey&m=text
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=rievaulx+abbey
http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=all&q=tintern+abbey&m=text
http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=all&q=whitby+abbey&m=text
Thanks for those yubbie! I was actually looking at something similar! Even though I am going for a fantasy-style look here, those will definitely help with the texturing!
Here is a mini update with COLOR! Thinking of adding some vegetation in there, adds an interesting contrast with the stone.
Here is a mini update with the sculpted arches. I will add some decoration and intricate patterns in them once I get the time.
I really like the mood you have in that paintover! It's looking awesome! Looks very promising!
I haven't had the time to make decent materials yet and not all normal maps are applied in this screenshot. I just need to go to bed before my head dies on me. Clearly, my normal maps should be coming out better than this, but lightmass is playing screwy with me, so we'll see how it goes once I get the hang of it.
Let me know what you all think!
BUT i think your composition isnt great at the moment...your packing ther env with too much medium and fine detail and there are not enough areas to rest the eyes on...its a bit too fussy... i would think about getting rid of those details in the centre of the roof spans for starters they take away from the statue
maybe lighting will help if you make it quite striking
Lightmass can be funky with your normal maps. Once you flip your channels though it'll help greatly.
Loving this!
I'll work on the composition. Thank you for pointing that out. I'll see what I can do.
As for the lighting, the light setup I have now is simply to see what I'm doing. It's nothing compared to what I plan on finishing with.
Thanks alot!
I like the shapes over all, but in my option, the textures/UVs and modeling is wasteful. In an enclosed scene like this, i would put more effort into the in-game modeling and less into the one off bake transfers from high rez zbrushed models. Sure they look good but that process is dependent on large 1k sheets which is wasteful of texture/UV space, forces you to get clever with UV layout, and is time consuming.
Instead, try a more trimmed approach. Try taking the arch patterns and putting them into a tiling trim sheet. Then modify your arch models to accommodate ribbon UV's. You would save texture data and maximize detail. Also, try layers of varied textures. Blend different wear and tear sheets together. Layer grunge sheets on top.
Going this route saves the need to use a clunky 1024 or 2048 and instead lets you use 512's and 256 textures with the same or higher resolution.
For the floor, i think the comments earlier are correct. Too expensive! You can accommodate the same look with less and probably go further. Play God of war 3 and uncharted AT. There are tons of examples of floors in those two games.
Example:
If you don't get good results from geo popping out of the floor, another idea would be to take a rectangle beveled cube, bake a single custom high rez brick to it, (245 x 128?) and use that to create varried popping throughout the room. This is assuming you are keeping an even texel resolution. However, based on the look your trying to achieve, brick popping might be the way to go.
I think you'll be surprised at how much better it looks and how much faster it is to bang out.
Good luck.
However, the technique mentioned for the floor IS very interesting. I'll give it a shot if time allows it. I've got until the end of august to finish my school portfolio.
To clarify, I think one offs limit your UV abilities and confine you to a single pallet. Unless your accounting for close to or exact texel resolution, you may run into optimization issues in a production pipeline when it comes to downsizing textures for memory.
To clarify UV ribbons, if your mesh has an even quad dispersal, and the mesh defines the trimming from the texture, then you can break up your Arch UV's into straight UV ribbons in your UV editor. Maya does this really well. (unitize then move, sew). This allows you to bake out those arch details in a straight line on a texture sheet that tiles end to end. Then you can play with your UV ribbons to line up with the trims in your texture sheet. Does that make since?
Texture trim example: http://www.cgtextures.com/login.php?&texid=25454&destination=texview.php?id=25454&PHPSESSID=3718fac26e71695596b4b5a21e3d86ca
But, it's not all or nothing. If you go the one off route, i would at least incorporate the under arch brick as well. Try and fill the texture sheet as much as possible. This will at least give you some flexibility as far as draw calls.
hope this helps.
As for my student project. This does not need to be playable. It is simply going to be part of a demoreel. And I'll be getting some beauty shots from it. But that's about it. So high framerates aren't that much of an issue. Sure it's nice and I'm going for something that will play well, but it's not the MAIN issue here.
I must say that the way you are suggesting doing the details is interesting... would you then have issues with the extra vertex counts from having to break up the uvs? And how much extra resources does the needed extra polys and vertexes take in comparison to the larger texture sheets? Also if he were to break up the objects into tiles like this how would the increased number (assuming he doesn't have each piece in an individual sheet) of texture sheets affect the performance?
For the grunge layers, were you suggesting making them with alphas and then blending them in the editor or something else? Is it possible to blend normal texture sheets for differing damage?
What makes an enclosed scene special in regards to this method?
I am also still in college and unfortunately don't have enough of this type of information available-_-
check this out (in HD
The floor has a nice realistic bump but the main brick pop is from geo. Notice the stones that are inset? They use geo and a second geo sheet that alpha's out like dirt built up near the cracks.
Given that this is a one time screen shot, I'd go all out man.
Good luck.
Thank you very much for sharing your workflow tips!
Now before I go totally off topic, more work will be coming soon! I've gotten ALOT of texturing work done in very little time, so hopefully I can move on to lighting and post processing soon!
I would pay attention to games like God of war 3, uncharted 2, and Dead Space 2. All of which practice this "trim" method. Vert counts can get high but only if you go crazy with too much strip detail. In my opinion the kind of scene in question is simple enough to accommodate this type of work flow.
@Divi, I plan on making my lighting contain some blueish hues, so that may get the result you may like!
I know my lighting is too dark right now. I'm experimenting with UDKs lighting system for the first time. I'll get there!
But it's nothing you cant fix
No more white blobs of untextured props!
That is it...looking forwards to see the final image!
As a whole, the floor looks like its floating on water. Also, the brick wall consistency seems out of place and not inline with the over all theme. I would enlarge the brick wall pattern and lessen the over all normal map noise. Try and let your broad strokes show through rather than the tiny noisy pocks. I think you'll get a better read. Then go back and slowly bring in the detail noise once the shapes read well.
Same with the over all diffuse quality. It's really noisy at the moment. Try going with solid colors and patterns first, let the forms show through, then bring in the noise little by little.
think you have too much small detail i would maybe change over some of the walls to rough lighter plaster esp the sloping ones as sloping brick/stone is a NONO if not changeing it too plaster maybe white washed stones with less form to them to reduce the impact of the detail, make it weaker so it does not fight with the main forms
also i would be tempted to lighten the tone of your stone or plaster (if you change it) think it would help alot as ATM its all too consistent
a scene should have a nice rhythm IMO with pauses, breaks and detail...