Next gen art tests....80 hours of work?
polycounter lvl 19
I was talking to some people at work about this. When I was looking for a job a few weeks ago I got a few environment tests there were pretty intensive. Some were to model a city alley or block and texture it with next gen specs. I guess what I'm asking is should companies ask for that amount of work out of an art test?
I've seen character tests that take a month to finish. That just doesn't seem proper to ask of someone to me. So what is fair? For an environment I could see some props or a building facade. But for characters that seems much more difficult to determine the right amount of work.
I've seen character tests that take a month to finish. That just doesn't seem proper to ask of someone to me. So what is fair? For an environment I could see some props or a building facade. But for characters that seems much more difficult to determine the right amount of work.
Replies
I think it'd be fair for a test requiring all stages of next-gen art (as opposed to just some cool high-poly models) to keep the subject matter small. Instead of asking applicants to create a city block, ask them to create a single building. That gets the idea across and doesn't turn anyone suicidal.
If you think the test is going to be 80 hours of work, then make all of them count. You only get once chance to blow them away with your skills, so every art test you should give it your absolute best.
Sadly, I never got an email back from the 2nd company. However, I am working on my 2nd interview for the next-gen test, so hard work does pay off
Sean that sounds about rite. Art tests show them your skill level, and your speed. So the faster the quality can be done in the better.
I did an alleyway for my portfolio. 2.5 days of work, more than 8 hrs a day.
*Edit*
They get about 100 requests a week for these damn tests and spam them to tons of applicants, at least TRI did, I dunno what my company does.
If it's a next-gen test be sure to put most of your time in the lighting....cuz that's what makes or breaks next gen scenes. Spec, normal, diffuse are all effected by it. I craft my textures half-way before I start my lighting, then I know where to punch my textures.
-R
My humanlike figs may be somewhat cartooney (see my 'Dragonman' post down in Pimping to see what I mean), but that streetscene just looked utterly HORRID.
For me, figures are easier than terrain or props. It's just a matter of style, like with drawing.
Meanwhile, I've been thinking about trying that Art Test online someone posted a week or so ago...
...when the company has arranged for the ball to be slathered in syphillitic junkie semen.
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You have such a masterful way with words
I hear rumors. What are the chances of companies using these intensive art tests as free methods of outsourcing for additional content? They accept the test, but don't hire the artists.
Any studio silly enough to try this method has never made a successful game before.
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How much of this is to impress and how much is to establish that you can do the work that is in you portfolio and can work within professional deadlines?
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I have seen from an inside perspective how art tests are used, and i've also done them myself. Sometimes they screen with the portfiolio to decide if they will request an art test. In this case it's to see if 'you' made the portfolio, to guage time, and to see if you can fit the style.
The Upside:
-You can target all your effort into one task.
-You have a excellent chance of getting the art test in front of a hiring manager. Exposure to the hiring manager is key.
-You don't have to be a concept artist for many art tests. You will be tested on the job you will be doing. Most portfolio samples suffer from poor concepts and are out of the running before they even start.
The Downside:
Art tests are often used by lazy or inept hiring managers who want to even the playing field because they can't judge a portfolio. You'll know this is the case when 18 polycounters are doing the same art test, or if they will refuse a submission wiothout the completion of an art test before anyone even see's your resume.
-Often art test specs and guidelines are poorly crafted. I have seen quiet a few that had too many variables and offered too much freedom.
-Art tests sometiems serve as the 'only' measurement of an applicants skillset; which I think is unfairly biased and puts too much importance on one sample. Portfolio's aren't given as much weight as the applicants portfolio because of the system-spacific nature of the test.
When I run a studio I won't issue art tests.
-R
edit: I was replying to tgz btw when pak replied before me
and in production, it's more important how reliable you are and that you don't screw milestones and can manage your time well than to have that extra magic in your work that stands out e.g. in online galleries.
Mostly we are finding out how driven then are to work for us, how smart they can work, how fast they can work and what they prioritise first.
It isn't expected that they will match the quality of our inhouse efforts on the same concept because we spent more than 2weeks on it, but it tells us a lot that a resume will not.
I often feel that it's an unfair test and I wonder how I would fare if I had to go through our hiring process and I find it easy to get cynical.
Then, every now and then when someone aces our test and surprises us all and gets hired and I get to know them and respect their abilities and be glad of the chance I have to learn from them, I consider again that there's some worth to setting the bar so high.
r.
just wondering, are you at least allowed to put a rejected art test into your portfolio afterwards?
not to sound overly materialistic, but if it's a huge test - is there a possibility to talk about the job conditions (money!! and the rest, of course) before wasting weeks of your life, just to find out that theres no way in hell you would accept to work at that place?
If a startup with zero shipped titles, lower pay, and in a location I didn't want to move to, asked for a test of the same length, I'd tell them: "Sorry, I don't have time to invest in that right now, but keep my name on file,and if you decide my large portfolio of existing work is good enough for you to judge my abilities, then give me an email".
In some cases it's an employers market, and in others an employees. You just have to decide if you think their expectations are reasonable, if not, don't do it. Pretty simple I think.
I personally am wholly against a "no art test at all" policy, as I've seen way too many "old schoolers" get hired based solely on their longetivity, and their skills are nowhere near current for the sallaries they'd be pulling. If I ever ran a studio, you would not get hired without an art test of some sort, but I'd have varying levels of time requirements based on the person in question. I'd ask for a fairly elaborate test from someone with zero experience, and a much more reasonable one from more experienced vets.
We look for people that are looking to work at Epic, not just looking for a job.
We understand people need to pay the bills but we won't help out with that, the test is very demanding, but unless people are prepared to put in the extra work, the assumption is that they are not of the Epic calibre and wouldn't fit in here.
I don't write the rules here, I am aware of them though!
r.
are you at least allowed to put a rejected art test into your portfolio afterwards?
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I don't know about the one I did, since it was based on their concept. I'd like to show it, I think it one of my better pieces
I mean, there's no real reason to see how they model the hips, if they model the shoulders and hands well.
I'm against 'no art tests' as well. I mean, hell, we've all seen the people that have gotten jobs off of stolen portfolio pieces.
Plus, there's no guarantee how fast and efficient a person is based solely off of the portfolio. He may have badass character models, but it could've taken him double the time it should have in a real work environment.
Plus, most HR people will understand if you let them know that you work full time and may need the deadline extended a bit, though, be prepared for them to find someone else during that time.
That understanding is shared by the people in charge here also, but still, no real accomadation is made for the problem.
One of the lads who got hired a while back had a little baby girl who was a handful of months old when he took on the art test while he had a fulltime job so he took a week off work, to make sure he had extra time to work on the test and he also worked very smart.
It was a good example of working smart I guess!
r.