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[WIP] Portfolio City Scene

polycounter lvl 18
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Postification polycounter lvl 18
Hey all.

I've been diligently putting together a new scene to enhance my portfolio in the hopes of landing an environment artist job. So far this is what I've come up with. I'd love to get some feedback on what I've got started here.

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Here's the main scene. It's sort of a city on the edge of civil unrest as the theme. The armored personnel carriers are there to keep the peace at a recent shop front bombing.

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Here's a nice set of shots for the APC itself, including its flats.

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Here's a piece of furniture from the rubble. I'd love to know how to get rid of that butterfly crease down the middle. Smoothing groups don't seem to solve it and I'm really at a loss.

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Dumpster from the background. Being a dumpster. Doing what dumpsters do.

Oh, and if you know anyone who's looking for a seasoned environment artist in the Austin, TX area, let me know! I'm very eagerly looking for work!

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  • Logithx
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    Logithx polycounter lvl 5
    One thing I notice right away is that the scaling is really off. Notice the handle on the door, it's about as high from the ground as the height of the sidewalk. So either the handle is positioned really low to the ground or you've made the sidewalks way too tall. The 'do not cross' barriers also seem way too large relative to other objects. I suggest you grab a human model, put it inside a game engine and use that as your basic reference. I also suggest you put all your stuff in a proper engine like UDK and start working with some real lighting. At the moment it looks really unrealistic and flat in many places. A bit of magic with Unreal's global illumination lighting would do a lot.
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Thanks Logithx! I'll get on that scale issue immediately.

    I'll also see about trying out UDK for better lighting. Appreciate the feedback!
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Redid the scale throughout the scene, added a bounce-light below the scene to help the normals pop a little better (tweaked the lights in general), redid the UV and texture for the chair to remove a seam, and grimed up the interior of the dumpster because it was too clean.

    One little note on the height of the door knobs on the doors in this scene. I was going off of some photos of the Wooster area of NYC and they had doors like this. They're still a little lower than the above-waist-height of the barricades, but I think they feel a little less low now. Thoughts?

    ujmLY0d.jpg
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    DjvKobv.jpg
  • frizzank
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    I know the look your going for but its a little too dark, you cant see some of the awesome details you put in it.
  • AtlusZMH
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    That dumpster looks a lot better with the rust and scratches now. :)

    I still think your lighting is hurting.. For your single assets, you should look into doing a 3 point lighting setup.

    Check here:

    http://wiki.polycount.com/Model%20Presentation#Lighting

    Theres a ton of tutorials for setting up proper lighting.

    As for your scene, the only interesting lighting is the headlights. The rest of the scene's lighting seems very flat and boring.

    Try getting some contrast in there to add visual interest. Maybe you could make the far end of the scene fade to black? Right now your scene is kinda wide open with a random grey background. Having it fade to darkness would kinda close off your whole scene IMO.
  • J0NNYquid
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    J0NNYquid polycounter lvl 5
    The scene definitely has potential. Obviously it's all WIP, but I think getting a mood pinned down right off the bat could really help you. I'd start with the lighting. It might be cool to have some burning rubble casting a really cool orange/moody glow, and having the headlights of the APC's really focusing on that hole in the building facade. Some more miscellaneous debris/props to really populate the scene would help the mood as well, if it were a storefront bombing/suicide bomb you'd find a ton of things just discarded as people fled the scene. Just some suggestions for you going forward, looking good so far!
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Awesome feedback you guys. Thank you very much. I'll get to work on some more cast off human artifacts (purses? newspapers? a half-eaten giant slice of pizza from down the block?).

    As for fading it to black? I can see about that.

    Thanks for the presentation lighting How-To, it'll be really helpful!
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Here's my attempt at the three point lighting for this scene. Also added more debris to the rubble including metal beams, bricks, and a set of pipes. Edit: Futzed with the lighting a little more, and I think I'm more happy with this. Thoughts?

    ipyS7pR.jpg
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Redid some more of the scene and am continuing to tweak lights, composition and background.

    7W4Y1yb.jpg
  • Jack Ryan
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    It looks like your floor texture near the bottom left of the screen is stretching and distorting in a weird way.

    I'd say give some life to the lights coming from models in your scene to make some nice, harsh contrasts that you otherwise wouldn't have justification for. Such as red glow from the traffic light and lights from the vehicles.

    Also +1 to putting this into UDK. If you're going for this kind of job they want to know you can set up your materials and use an/the engine properly. A lot of your lighting issues would be solved with it being done in UDK, too.
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Started work on another piece as well.

    A mansion interior shot to show off my tiling textures and modular environment art design.

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    All textured and lookin' snazzy.

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    How it's lit.

    Also, currently working on learning how to drop my two scenes into CryEngine 3, since the place I'm aiming at getting employed at uses it. More to follow when I get that working :)
  • paulchen83
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    i love your interior environment. If you don't mind, please share some insight on things you've learned regarding texturing and lighting while you did it as i would like to pick your brain on that. Gonna do an environment piece after i finish a couple of characters.
  • BARDLER
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    BARDLER polycounter lvl 12
    I feel like you should be putting these environments in a full game engine instead of using Marmoset. Marmoset is an awesome tool, but it is not really functional for full environments, and I think it reflects poorly on you as an environment artist. You are avoiding things like vertex painting, post processing, fog, cube map capturing, light map baking, material editors, and stuff like that.

    Having all your environments rendered in Marmoset in your portfolio kind of shows that you are taking the easy way out and avoiding something like UDK or Cryengine. I do not know if that is true or not, but that is the impression I am getting from the work you are posting here. Hope that helps a little bit.
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    @Bardler:

    It's mostly been an issue of learning curve versus wanting to make art and put it out to portfolio so that I can get it seen sooner than later. As I said, I'm also training up on CryEngine 3 now that I've got two solid pieces done and ready for that kind of work.

    I'm looking forward to using the stuff you mentioned, especially light baking and fog.

    No need to make assumptions of laziness though, that kinda comes off rude.

    @Paulchen83:

    Thanks! Glad you like it. As for tips and tricks, well, I must say that picking out a palette beforehand really helps unify a scene. Making sure that your colors all compliment each other and just "fit" right. I used the same wood base for each of the wooden textures and created a widget set for the decorations that made them fit together thematically. Outside of that, I got lighting tips here and from various friends outside of Polycount. It really helps that in this scene there are several very obvious sources of light, so pooling the light where I wanted it was a little easier to sort out. As for colors in the lights, I went with subtle tones that would compliment the textures used. Warmer for below to make the rest of the assumed house feel lived in, and cooler light above to catch some nice reflections off of the rich, red-ish woods.

    Hope that helps! Let me know if you have any particular questions about setting up a tiling texture sheet and a trims page. They're both vital for efficient environment construction.
  • silkroadgame
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    Nice works!
    I like your armored personnel carriers,and textures used are awesome.
  • djgardner
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    DISCLAIMER: Don't take this the wrong way. You asked for feedback, and I'm just providing it from my perspective.

    I'll re-state what the majority of everyone has been suggesting to you since the first reply... Put your environments in an engine. It kills me to see environments rendered inside of marmoset. Marmoset is great for rendering individual props, but not full scenes.

    My suggestion to you would be to slow down on the environment creation and focus more on learning an engine. Like Bardler mentioned, it does look like you're taking the easy way out. Trust me, you'll have so much more control on lighting than in marmoset.

    Side note relating to this; you mentioned above you're looking for work and are a "seasoned environment artist", but it's kind of a false statement considering you have no experience working inside a game engine. I've never personally worked in the games industry yet, but I'm sure 99.9% of industry environment artists use an engine on a daily basis for work.
  • BARDLER
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    BARDLER polycounter lvl 12
    @Bardler:

    It's mostly been an issue of learning curve versus wanting to make art and put it out to portfolio so that I can get it seen sooner than later. As I said, I'm also training up on CryEngine 3 now that I've got two solid pieces done and ready for that kind of work.

    I'm looking forward to using the stuff you mentioned, especially light baking and fog.

    No need to make assumptions of laziness though, that kinda comes off rude.

    Well you asked for critique so anything I said was completely based off of what you posted, not anything personal. Also I never said the word lazy, I said having your environments all in Marmoset reflects poorly on you as an environment artist, and makes it seem like you are avoiding a tool like UDK or Cryengine.

    Every single position for an environment artist is going to list knowledge of Unreal, Source, Cryengine, Radient, and/or any game engine under mandatory requirements. If you don't know an engine than you are not going to be qualified for the job, it is as simple as that. You could get away with it as a prop artist if you wanted to work your portfolio towards that, but otherwise you should be learning an engine.
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Yeah, most studios are just looking for 3D modeling suites specifically and list engine knowledge as secondary (though it IS nice to have under your belt) when it comes to getting in at a place.

    That being said, I am definitely going to start messing with CryEngine more in the coming days. So there's that!
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Anyhow, here's some more artwork before I get up to my eyeballs in CryEngine learning curve:

    zF2XL6Q.jpg
  • VonKoz
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    VonKoz polycounter lvl 8
    Hey everyone, having personally worked on games like Brutal Legend, Uncharted 3, and the upcoming Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze. I can say that having your stuff in a game engine means jack shit UNLESS you applying to a studio that uses said engine. Like UDK, or Cry Engine.

    Naughty Dog, Double Fine, Retro Studios all use their own in house proprietary engines and do not care if you show your work in an engine. Good art is good art. What matters is clean mesh, great textures and an understanding of fundamentals like color theory, form, and composition.

    Know what you're talking about before making judgments.
  • BARDLER
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    BARDLER polycounter lvl 12
    VonKoz wrote: »
    Hey everyone, having personally worked on games like Brutal Legend, Uncharted 3, and the upcoming Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze. I can say that having your stuff in a game engine means jack shit UNLESS you applying to a studio that uses said engine. Like UDK, or Cry Engine.

    Naughty Dog, Double Fine, Retro Studios all use their own in house proprietary engines and do not care if you show your work in an engine. Good art is good art. What matters is clean mesh, great textures and an understanding of fundamentals like color theory, form, and composition.

    Know what you're talking about before making judgments.

    I understand what you are saying and yes good art is the number one priority, and I do not want to take away the focus on that. I also think the OP has some really strong work here which I do not want to overshadow either. However, almost every environment artist position lists knowledge of a game engine as a mandatory requirement, even if the company uses their own propriety one. Prop artists, character artists, animators, ect not so much, but its almost always listed for environment artists.

    I don't think you need to know every little detail and every tool inside the engine, but understanding how to put a scene together in one is extremely important. I just do not agree that you shouldn't learn it because their are some jobs that don't list it as a requirement. With the availability of tutorials out there, documentation, forums like these, ect, it makes learning something like UDK or Cryengine not incredibly difficult either.

    This is my opinion of course, so take it as you will OP.
  • VonKoz
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    VonKoz polycounter lvl 8
    Dude, take my word for it. I've reviewed tons of portfolios and I've been in this industry over 10 years. I can teach a good artist a game engine in less than a week. I can't make a sub par artist who knows UDK a better artist in the same time. I think what the OP is doing here is fine, would his work show better in UDK or CryEngine? Probably. Does not showing it diminish his work at all? Not really. I think OP is well aware that any extra knowledge, be it a game engine, or a different program enhances desirability for a potential employer. No one argues that, it's just not a deal breaker by any stretch of the imagination, nor is it a silver bullet to get into the door.

    But with your EXTENSIVE experience perhaps he should listen to you.
  • BARDLER
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    BARDLER polycounter lvl 12
    VonKoz wrote: »
    Dude, take my word for it. I've reviewed tons of portfolios and I've been in this industry over 10 years. I can teach a good artist a game engine in less than a week. I can't make a sub par artist who knows UDK a better artist in the same time. I think what the OP is doing here is fine, would his work show better in UDK or CryEngine? Probably. Does not showing it diminish his work at all? Not really. I think OP is well aware that any extra knowledge, be it a game engine, or a different program enhances desirability for a potential employer. No one argues that, it's just not a deal breaker by any stretch of the imagination, nor is it a silver bullet to get into the door.

    I see where you are coming from and it makes sense. I think at least familiarizing yourself with an engine is worthwhile time investment before you get a job. I guess I just see it as preparing yourself for the job better and trying to round yourself out. I stand corrected, and admit I was wrong.
    VonKoz wrote: »
    But with your EXTENSIVE experience perhaps he should listen to you.

    This is unnecessary dude.
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Wrapped up my Possum Kingdom scene. Still not totally 100% on the composition, so if you have any feedback regarding that I'd love to hear it!

    EWjZOim.jpg
  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    Re-did the lighting entirely in my city scene and also added a good deal of detail to it. I hope you like it! It's still not into UDK or Crytek yet (I know, I know), but I'm pretty pleased with how these renders have turned out. Big ups to the folks who gave me tips on improving my lighting!

    5ynFAIo.jpg
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  • Postification
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    Postification polycounter lvl 18
    (whoops, doublepost!)
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