Sugestion for Best way to make leather stitch and seams ?

NAIMA · Mar 2013

Hello , I want to make some leather seams ... last time I did them I used the following technique ...

Manually painted masks all around the places where needed to be the seams , then I used deformation to extrude parts of them ... the result wasn't really trasheable so I used , but I am sure there is a much better and much faster way ... I took a lot of time to paint manually each seam ...

Lets say I have to make a belt full of seams .... How can I do what's the best approach ? I tought of insertmesh curve but I could'nt find any premade mesh to inser and I couln't make a decent one to use , I tought of alpha roll but also there I couln't find any good seams alpha , so last I tought of simple track tool , Altough when I used didn't really come out that great ... so what's your sugestions to make somethig like that:

http://www.zbrushcentral.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=194522

http://www.zbrushcentral.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=196490

http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/llepet/llepet0908/llepet090800031/5401330-brown-leather-decorated-by-zigzag-stitch-on-right.jpg

http://us.123rf.com/400wm/400/400/llepet/llepet0908/llepet090800040/5401335-brown-leather-decorated-by-zigzag-stitch-on-center.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8169/8055903113_4407d60096.jpg

Here is what I need to do instead ....

cryrid · Mar 2013

Julian Kenning has an x-stitch brush that I think comes included with zbrush (lightbox's beta tester brush directory). If not, then I got it from the repo thread. Similar lacing was also handled in the past by using zspheres and flattening them, though the topology/extraction options might be just as fast depending on the shape.

The other stitching shouldn't be hard to make either, and alphas and insert brushes would work just as well. It's just a tube really, some kind of string or strap. Flatten a cube/cylinder/torus and perhaps give it a slight rotation and voila; you have the shape ready and waiting to be turned into an alpha or insert mesh. With an alpha you can go a little bit fancier and try to include the holes and bumps, while with an insert mesh you'd probably be better off inserting the stitching and then mask it off and sculpt such things into the main sculpt.

NAIMA · Mar 2013

I am not sure if I actually Understood well your sugestions, do you think you can post me a visual sample?
You are sugesting to build up a stitch in Photoshop? How can I do stitches that go around a corner or that pass over the leather borders?
I tried my hands with the insert curve mesh but I amn not ending up with anything good , the curves always require me to delete all lower res, then they do not stick really well to the underlying model and I need to make them all around ...

cryrid · Mar 2013

I'm suggesting you build a stitch in any given 3d program, and turn that into an obj for an insert brush, or use zbrush to grab the depth and create an alpha.

The stitching around edges (such as the image of the figure) would be as simple as grabbing the helix3d tool, giving it a uniform radius, adjusting the coverage depending on the desired stitch spacing, deleting the caps and turning it into an IMM brush.

The stitching between different pieces of leather (like in the first two images) is even easier as you're just laying down a single tube and then sculpting around it.

Insert brushes do require a mesh with no lower subdivisions, so the trick is to work on a duplicated subtool. Select the subtool that you want to use as a base to draw on, duplicate it, delete whatever subdivision levels you don't need, draw out your insertions, group them into their own polygroup, and then delete the rest of the subtool.

It's not a 'press-for-stitches' technique. Take advantage of the curve's ability to be modified after the fact, and spend a a few minutes pulling it into and along the surface.

NAIMA · Mar 2013

cryrid wrote: »

I'm suggesting you build a stitch in any given 3d program, and turn that into an obj for an insert brush, or use zbrush to grab the depth and create an alpha.

Ok I can create that but you mean a simple U shaped thing?

cryrid wrote: »

The stitching around edges (such as the image of the figure) would be as simple as grabbing the helix3d tool, giving it a uniform radius, adjusting the coverage depending on the desired stitch spacing, deleting the caps and turning it into an IMM brush.

that I don't know what is the helix3dtool or what you are talking of

cryrid wrote: »

The stitching between different pieces of leather (like in the first two images) is even easier as you're just laying down a single tube and then sculpting around it.

a single tube? What do you mean a ring?

cryrid wrote: »

Insert brushes do require a mesh with no lower subdivisions, so the trick is to work on a duplicated subtool. Select the subtool that you want to use as a base to draw on, duplicate it, delete whatever subdivision levels you don't need, draw out your insertions, group them into their own polygroup, and then delete the rest of the subtool.

Yes I got that ...

cryrid wrote: »

It's not a 'press-for-stitches' technique. Take advantage of the curve's ability to be modified after the fact, and spend a a few minutes pulling it into and along the surface.

Ok but Still didn't understood how to process your first two sentences

are you sugesting so to go straight with the 3d insert mesh? but how ? I didn't understand those two points sorry I am still learning zbrush ...

That's the kind of armor I want to do ...
I have already made the base mesh ... not sure if you have the time or will but in case if You want I can send you a base model and you can show me on that what you mean with some pics?

http://www.heycomputer.com/Conan-The-Barbarian_780c0ccc.jpg

cryrid · Mar 2013

Ok I can create that but you mean a simple U shaped thing?...a single tube? What do you mean a ring?

The basic pattern of the stitch that you want to repeat all across the model.

that I don't know what is the helix3dtool or what you are talking of

A tool inside zbrush.

NAIMA · Mar 2013

thanks , but I can't findthat tool and after I find anyway how do I to to add it to the 3d brush ?

NAIMA · Mar 2013

Ok I fond helix 3d and with the initialize I set up a similar helix ... now I need ot get how to put it into the 3d brush ...

NAIMA · Mar 2013

Thats the best I could get, Doesn't look like the one you did , I am doing something wrong for sure but not sure how to get your results, do you think you have the time to explain more in detail how yu did it ?

...

SnowInChina · Mar 2013

try rotating 90°

NAIMA · Mar 2013

what befour emaking it an insert mesh ? and then how I fix the seams and the distance ?

Edit:
I tried rotate the spiral befoure turning into a mesh insert but it still sticks in vertical position and doesn't follow the flow

...

Is there another way to fix this?

cryrid · Mar 2013

I had mine rotated before creating the brush. Make sure you're rotating it on the right axis.

Also, remember to delete the caps on each end of the spiral so that they can be stitch together seamlessly

NAIMA · Mar 2013

sorry what are the caps ? ALso I am not really practical with the roation and move tools , what I did is ...

.... mmmm you mean by using perhaps the deformation tools? I did rotate with the rotate button and didn't allow for 90 Degrees setting...

Also what you mean by the caps ? and how you deleted them ?

ivanzu · Mar 2013

Caps are faces on ends of the cylinder.

NAIMA · Mar 2013

And .... :poly137:erm how do I delete them ?

Also I tried rotating in 90 x y or z but I can't get it to get align ... what is the actual alignement and how I know what is corresponding to the axial direction of the rope ?

ivanzu · Mar 2013

Use delete hidden tool.

cryrid · Mar 2013

mmmm you mean by using perhaps the deformation tools? I did rotate with the rotate button and didn't allow for 90 Degrees setting...

Open the deformation palette, switch Rotate from Z to X, and type in 90

how do I delete them ?

Use ctrl+shift to hide them, then use tool: geometry: del hidden to delete them

NAIMA · Mar 2013

It still plac3es them vertically ...

This is what I did ..

Created the helix , set initialize to 3 spires and lowered the curve tha tbumped the central part to a flat one ...

then I have used cntrl to mask the whole thing and then cntrl alt to mask out the bottom caps , then created polygroups out of them and hidden , then deleted them ...

then I went to deformation and I turned on x and off z pressed 90 degrees and finally I created the brush insert mesh ...

I then loaded the other tool where I was working with the belt and I set up the curve mode .. drawed and the spirals are still in vertical position ... what did I do htat is wrong?

cryrid · Mar 2013

You have to turn it into a Polymesh3d before you begin rotating and deleting the caps

NAIMA · Mar 2013

oh ok I retry ...

NAIMA · Mar 2013

It still gets vertical , I don't understand I even resetted the brushes befoure doing the whole process again ....!

What can be doing wrong?

I even tried shutting down zbrush and reload ...

pick the helix, fix it with initialize , then turn into a 3d polymesh , delete the caps , rotate in x direction by 90 , make a IMM brsuh , unpload my base model obj and apply on it the curve mesh brush with that helix but are always vertical ...

NAIMA · Mar 2013

Ops ok to fix I just didn't have to rotate the helix ...

but there is a gap between the helix and the next , how can I do to exactly make match the distances so that where one ends the next starts?

Also when I bend the curve they get intersecting ...

cryrid · Mar 2013

adjust the brush and stroke modifiers (enable stretch, decrease the step size... play around with some options and check out the IMM tutorials on the zclassroom / online docs)

NAIMA · Mar 2013

Still trying to fix that , I put the step size to 0.91 and seems quite close but there is still a small minimal gap , not that will be much visible for my purpouse but I wonder how coudl I do to place exactly them to stick one at the other ...

Other than that I dunno for what reason I got a duplicate , as shows the picture , the darker one is the unwanted duplicate that I discovered beeing there after I moved a bit the curve ...

how that created itself ? and how I eliminate?

I wanted to turn then this into a subtool and clone / mirror on theother side and lower adjoust for the other levels , I can't clone and use still the curve to adjoust the position of the new belt rings?
I need to make new curve insert rings for the other levels?

Mark Dygert · Mar 2013

I don't mean to derail what you've got going but couldn't you do that in any number of other 3D apps pretty quickly and import it?

NAIMA · Mar 2013

WellI don't know in other 3d app you have sugestions? I only have 3dsmax as 3rd app ...

But Still I woudl like to know the problem I pointed in my previous post and how to fix it ..

Mark Dygert · Mar 2013

Create a Helix spline.
Select the edges you want it to follow and in edit poly click "create shape".
- This will create a spline, in "Rendering" check on, "Enable in Viewport".
Apply PathDeform(WSM) to the Helix and set it's target to a path spline that you just created.
- In the helix you can adjust the height and number of turns as needed to cover the path.

If for some reason you have a really long path and you can't get enough turns out of the helix, you can shrink its height until you get the right spacing and then convert it to editable spline and copy it a few times and weld them together.

cryrid · Mar 2013

The cause could be any number of things without knowing what you're doing to create the brush (which really should be a quick process). But as it is it looks like the duplicate version is it's own polygroup, and if you're going to split them anyway, just delete it then.

NAIMA · Mar 2013

Cyrid -when I make a polygroup it creates one for each little helix ...

Mark - Dygert I will have to try that too thanks ...

cryrid · Mar 2013

They're already two polygroups on your image, you don't have to touch the polygroup subpalette (nor should you unless you're absolutely sure everything is welded). If the additional helix curve is not it's own polygroup then it means that it's darker because it's masked which means it was created from a previous insertion, and can either way be split.

NAIMA · Mar 2013

This is what I am doing , I preferred to use the Cyrid solution because doing the rings in 3dsmax and then export woudl have probably messed things up when I went to subdivide them .. but in the low poly model I will do if it the stirches will just be visible as normal map bumps ...

What you think I am applying well what I was sugested ?

How's coming ?

NAIMA · Apr 2013

Ok here the final hp model... What are your opinions on the stitching?

Looks good, meh , sucks or what?

Chase · Apr 2013

When you retopologize the for the low poly are you just gonna gave the stitching merge with the body? Or is the stitching going to be retopolized on its own?

NAIMA · Apr 2013

The stitching should only be in the normal maps ...

Sugestion for Best way to make leather stitch and seams ?

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