I hope you guys don't mind that I write my thoughts on suggested ideas. I am hoping that after analyzing some potential flaws or benefits, a stronger system/idea can arise.
About hosting everything on one site and making artists compete on that one site, this was suggested in the past. It was remarked that the consequence of this would be that artists would not be able to compete in a setting that they are already familiar with, and they would not be surrounded by the friends and buddies they are usually together with. Sure, competiting artists might visit the website to cheer their friends on, but these are mostly the competing artists. It wouldn't feel like your community is there on the lines with you. One of the things forums like about this event is that it makes their communities stronger. The CGLand forum was made just for DW. LeewiArt just recently began, and they are already competing as a heavyweight. Plus, the main challenge is 8 weeks long. Interest will wade if artists would be outside their home forums for soo long, or worse yet, they'd just post their wip work on their home forum and occasically, or just at the end, update their wip thread on the central dw forum. Giving rise to ninjas.
It's true that DW has gotten massive and winning is extremely hard, when pitted against the world. One thing I did like about a specific past challenge was DWII. Each team had a best of their team. Maybe this can be added again if you guys like this? At least this way, regardless of which team you compete on, you have good chances of getting exposure. Then again, a top 75 list might be good enough. Not sure, team best or top 75...
DW had a good run... Thanks Fred for putting everything together and keeping it going as long as you did.
The only way it could work is if we did what pior suggested... but even that has its problems because the cooperation of different forum staff members isn't garaunteed...
Waiting for entries? nah... you set deadlines, and you enforce them... if people don't submit their champions... they don't fight... fin.
But this all sounds wicked complicated and unless you can find a way to make money on it... real money... DW sounds pretty dead... Not forgotten... just ... dead...
Adam - Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously. I am trying to understand things, but I can't. Hearing a comment like that "If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's," plus the whole article posted last week, reminds me of people who go to weddings or something truely special & meaningful, just for the alcohol. They are the loudest in the bunch, and they don't even know the people there:(
If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's. People are welcome to volunteer wherever they please, but the PC team specifically will spend its time getting our Contests running like butter.
Like butter.
Does that mean there will be game-art contests with results?
Adam - Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously.
Because the Polycount Community enjoys the Dominance War and Unearthly Challenge contests?
At least the nature of the very first one where it was PC vs. GA, from there we just stuck with it because it was more tradition than anything and it inspired people to do their best.
Moving forward, if the two contests are consolidated to their own domains where people register and post on those forums individually, then thats great. If people want to volunteer and help run those sites, thats fine too. However, we have our own website to run, and volunteering our time on another website's efforts is unfortunately not possible.
I would expect that all other community heads are going to feel the same way. Their website & community (read: not yours) are within their best interest. If you want to start something that brings other websites together in friendly competition while managing it all yourself/with a team youv'e organized, that'd work and make some communities very happy.
What won't work is expecting the other communities to personally offer their team to manage things on the DW/UC side of things.
With that said, there's nothing stopping the PC staff to volunteer individually, separate from Polycount. If we've learned anything from watching you run these contests over the years its do only take on as much as we can handle. Whether or not you are expecting CGHub, Polycount, CGSocieties and so on to spend their energy and time on managing things from the DW and UC websites I am not sure. But if you are, I'd consider what I have written before moving forward on the idea.
Why is maintaining Domminace War, and its sister competitions, so much more dificult and costly than the running and maintence of a regular high profile art forum or website?
Adam - Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously. I am trying to understand things, but I can't. Hearing a comment like that "If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's," plus the whole article posted last week, reminds me of people who go to weddings or something truely special & meaningful, just for the alcohol. They are the loudest in the bunch, and they don't even know the people there:(
Adam - Yeah, I guess like you said, it has become a tradition more than anything else over here.
Skankerzero - Seriously? Are you suggesting that PC was never welcome to join?
Lenny - It's because more pages are involved and more artists are involved. Plus, since their are more artists, more prizes were needed. But this can be simplified:)
Adam - Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously. I am trying to understand things, but I can't. Hearing a comment like that "If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's," plus the whole article posted last week, reminds me of people who go to weddings or something truely special & meaningful, just for the alcohol. They are the loudest in the bunch, and they don't even know the people there:(
You can look at it that way or you can look at it as people who care about what's happening enough to voice their opinion. They were just trying to understand, but couldn't.
It probably doesn't help to equate those people to loud party crashers during a special event. It wouldn't be special if it weren't for the people who came.
Adam - Yeah, I guess like you said, it has become a tradition more than anything else over here.
Skankerzero - Seriously? Are you suggesting that PC was never welcome to join?
Lenny - It's because more pages are involved and more artists are involved. Plus, since their are more artists, more prizes were needed. But this can be simplified:)
Adam - Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously. I am trying to understand things, but I can't. Hearing a comment like that "If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's," plus the whole article posted last week, reminds me of people who go to weddings or something truely special & meaningful, just for the alcohol. They are the loudest in the bunch, and they don't even know the people there:(
huh. lots of interesting thoughts going around. So does this mean that DWV is going to be put on hold or canceled? I am assuming that its not happing in January?
If one or more forums fails to judge their art, or collect it in time, or if they run into problems, the entire community would suffer and their would be delays all around
Well, it really is just a matter of trust. If a given forum fails to provide on the terms agreed on, then maybe wait a few days but that's it. You don't have to do everything for everybody - just give folks a little trust and responsibility. I feel like you are over complicating things?
I mean if a forum organizes a cool comp, what prevents anyone in the world to join that forum and post stuff there ? I dont think that the DW seal is like a necessity in order to find a job.
Hearing a comment like that "If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's," plus the whole article posted last week, reminds me of people who go to weddings or something truely special & meaningful, just for the alcohol. They are the loudest in the bunch, and they don't even know the people there:(
I'm not sure that adds up. I'm pretty sure in this case, the "wedding" wouldn't even be there to such a degree if not for the participants. And I'm also pretty sure in this case the booze that was supposed to be there wasn't. Or rather, was in short supply. Also everyone who shows up gets pictures taken of them and sold on the side, to help go towards that booze that might show up next year.
You know, there would be no competition without the artist's who participated and, for a guy who apparently does it for "the community", you certainly seem to talk down to one of your more active participants, Fred. Granted, we may not be as willing to pat you on the back as GA is and give you a cuddle - but it's not like we don't appreciate the thought and effort put into the whole deal. Just because we criticize what's going on doesn't mean we're complete assholes, we're just not as accepting as GA may be. Other than tradition, what more should it be? Isn't just supposed to be a fun annual comp?
It just seems like you're making "this side of the tracks" seem like complete douchebags because the mod team, rightfully so, won't put forth effort to support someone's project in fear of spreading too thin and for exposing an issue that may have offended some artists and possibly border on the line of illegal acts.
I'm not trying to be a dick - but - I said this in the other thread that it gets a bit much when you frequently see on GA talking down about this community that, on the surface at least, seems to have it's shit together and follows through on their word. I like the jokes back and forth and can totally get in on the trash talking - i mean, i've posted a penis in the GA logo more times than i can count - but there's a bit of a difference between jokes and disrespect.
Two Listen: You're forgetting that these photos were taken from secret cameras that no one ever knew were there and then, after someone did find the camera, a disclaimer was put in the top corner of the guest book that you may or may not have your photo taken...you're also forgetting that we really only showed up to plow the vulnerable bride's maid.
Pior, hmm, trying to imagine it. seperate forums working privately with their artists. Do you not agree that if there is a system like the one in place now, forums wouldn't need to worry about collecting art. Artists go to the system, submit their work on deadline, and bam, it's judging time. Plus, gotta go through 800+ entries to cut things down for main judges. Even with the system of cropping in place in DW4, it took 5 judges together on msn 3 days to wade through it quickly. Entries were able to be seen quickly, compared with eachother, and cropped or brought back into the mix if needed. 800 entries is a lot to deal with. When you see it on the thumbnails page, it's like a huge wall of color that takes a full minute just to scroll to the bottom of the page. I was not able to check how the team fortress comp did here. How was judging handled? A company did it? Amount of entries? submit how many images per artist?
I understand that the Franchise is popular, and due to the visual nature/multiple views bandwidth requirements must be high. But isn't this a standard double edged sword that defines online business?
I can also see how programming, maintenance and HR are massive time sinks, and as such costly. Which leads me to think you are likely micro managing most every aspect? if so kudos, thats a shit tone of work but consider getting some distance and loosening up the reigns.
As for prizes, i don't think that's something we need to re visit.
Also i want you to know, i enjoy watching the competitions every year. I think they are fucking amazing and i honestly hope yourself and the community are able to find a elegant solution to the current issues.
ah, valve handled it, cool. Judging dw online is a problem for the cropper judges because it must be done on msn all together. Time zones makes things tough. Getting judges in one city can be a solution, but then if they are not of different nationalities, there could be a problem. I know art should be judged for art, but with a chinese, russian, korean etc team, to prevent bias, their teams must be honored. Another solution for croppers is that a company does it, but then this company would have to be significant and must be a sponsor or something special, then we could hand over all the art and have that famous company as a guest cropper team judge type thing. Could be cool.
Lennyagony, thanks. yeah, programming, maintanance, and hr are the big ones. During a challenge, handing off the programming or maintanance to someone else is risky because if one file is accidently overwritten, good bye entire system. Hard to trust someone with this as the more people who are involved, the more chance of human error. However, I did leave it to each different language forum to translate their own rules page (was rather long) this year, and they did pretty well. I think things are well on their way to being entirely run by most forums instead of one person.
If we (PC staff) are going to put in effort to maintain a contest or what have you, it will be for our own Contests held here at Polycount and not someone else's. People are welcome to volunteer wherever they please, but the PC team specifically will spend its time getting our Contests running like butter.
Like butter.
Can't wait! Will be worth bothering with I'm sure.
Fred H - one thing I just don't get in reading all of these posts from you across various forums...It is always thrown back to how difficult or how much you had to sacrifice to initiate and run Dominance War. It almost comes off as you're expecting people to be obligated to thank you or that in some way their lack of charity to help you with the endeavor is a show of being unappreciative. If your words have been true and that you did this to only further community interaction and growth, then even if you receive no thanks it shouldn't matter...if this was truly meant to be a selfless act as portrayed. I don't know you personally but I do know the track record of dominance war from its' inception. It just really was more than it ever needed to be inflated to and with the record of delays and rule changes it really just never was worth bothering with. Like Pior and others have said, the prizes don't matter...it's about the challenge. I don't even see how anyone would want to enter it even were it to continue on. It was a good experiment.
On the note of Polycount based challenges / comps in the future...Can there be more environment full on challenges? Thank you.
Perhaps this year we should have a new challenge. One month to create a detailed proposal for the structure and organization of future Dom Wars?
Synthesize them and create a solid system. Seems like it might be better to have more substantial fleshed out ideas than the little tidbits floating around.
Don't let the french name fool you, folks, Jacque is Asian. That's right...I'll give you a few minutes to digest that information and come to terms with reality.
Anyways, one judging system that is used with a LOT of success is simply what is being used over at 11secondclub.com and hotornot.com
(I sound like a broken record about this).
Each piece is judged on a score from 1-10. The averaged score is the order they are placed in. This way any singular anomalies in judging are averaged out (granted there are enough judges willing to wade through 800 entries).
Although it might sound like a LOT of time to judge, as far as I'm concerned, each artist worked on their entries around 320 hours. I really believe that it deserves to be looked at.
Heck, the contests at 11secondclub don't even have official judges, just open the task to the public, and from what I've seen, there isn't a lot to discredit the integrity of the placements (and I'd imagine it would certainly make things a lot easier if things were more automated).
TelekineticFrog - Yes, we haven't met. Thanks. I don't think someone would go through all the trouble to create something of this size just for a pat on the back? Not being thanked is actually preferred. Like another person said somewhere else, its when a volunteer that does something for free gets picked on severely, that's when it becomes a problem. I am not here on Polycount to answer personal questions about my reputation or why I do stuff. Seems kind of mute. Not sure what you want me to say really??
Dim - Good luck. The system is already solid. Haven't heard anything so far that says working with no system for 800 entries is doable. The only thing that is majorly flawed, is the management - i.e. me. So once the transition from GA to DW is complete, and once a team is assigned to getting things done, it's gonna be awesome. System plus management, with no prizes, it's going to be one for the books:) Like I said in my letter, I am excited for the future. I got it this far, now it's going to only get better in times ahead. Join or do not, it’s up to you. You can always sit on the side lines to see how it does. I know where I'll be, making my entry for GA!
Jacque, I will admit, that is a pretty good idea. Making the whole thing like a public voting type system, similar to the minis, sounds cool. Since I am making an upgraded system anyways, this type of suggestion is now the time and place for it. there would probably have to be two rounds. First round, each team's best are found. Second round, the teams best are pooled together and public votes on them. There'd be no great judges though, so there is a bit of a loss here. But judging would be over in a short time. Perhaps skip the second round and let judges choose instead. Seams more appropriate for a big challenge.
I'd like the judging to be done by professionals of any forum/site/community, personally. Not by one site as it'd be easy for things to get biased. Comicon Challenge had some pretty horrid judging.
Don't let the french name fool you, folks, Jacque is Asian. That's right...I'll give you a few minutes to digest that information and come to terms with reality.
but seriously, Im all for the events being there own forums// no more forums vs forums kinda deal...
I love rivalry amongst forms but I think it got out of hand when people went as far as to post on opposite forms trash talking, and then certain powers that be changing that said persons Icon to a ball sack for over a year
Is the competition going to happen when it was originally scheduled? I'm sad to see all of this drama happening. I'm graduating this week and was REALLY looking forward to getting serious about this year's dominance war challenge.
Firstly, I totally agree with Gav and his views, Pior and his simplification and Adams rock-solid resolve. Im proud to finally be part of a community that has admins like this.
Fredh: Firstly, I can't express in words how much you have blown my mind with your unpology. Even if it is the honest to goodness truth... dude.. just....
Playing the I'm stepping down card all the while everythings buddy buddy and were all friends, and then the I'm poor card and then topping it all off with the 'but nows the time to cough up the $$$ if you want to help out' bomb?!
Do you have any concept of how this may come across to the people you have driven away due to your previous blunder? If not, we are done here.
The only hopefully helpful thing I can say to you is remember back to the days where you were passionate about creating art more than you are passionate about being a middleman and organizer. Remember when you earned mad props and respect from your peers by producing cool art and not by hosting a contest. Remember when you had time for creating art, and it wasnt all spent on organizing things / being a manager. I bet things were simpler back then! Maybe head back to those roots and earn some props back man, just sayin'
You may think but wait! I am doing ALL OF this for the community! And for all I know you may be genuinely trying with all your heart to get this all back up and running ASAP, but dude, take it easy, relax a bit.
All the necessary elements still exist, and will still be there tomorrow. The awesome artists around the world, the plethora of forums that are eager to participate, all the sponsors. I'm betting they all still want to make cool art, and be apart of massive worldwide art competitions if given the right avenue.
Think about whats happened and take some time out to reflect, and seriously think about rebuilding core values that will help the community regain faith in yourself, GA and the running of your contests before jumping over and right up into PC's grill saying things like 'Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously.' No matter how scathing or critical people are being of you right now, this is NOT helping your cause.
Theres always a chance to right wrongs, but right now you're draining drops from an already rapidly draining pool.
I have nothing useful to add regarding the actual execution or future of DW, I would only hope the end result its simple, does not rely on the funds of the community to exist, and allows artists all around the world to continue to jam together and make awesome art!
After reading a lot of stuff, I think adam is right.
Lets keep events in the forum, like the TF2 Pack.
Having awesome events where everyone competes was awesome, but it seems like it was too much? aparently?
If buddy made 50k in 5 years, which isint thaaaat bad... he could have also had a job on the side, the event doesn't last the whole year now...
I just think it was poor decisions and really feel bad for the people who didn't get all the prizes they deserved.
Fred did good stuff for the community, but it seems as if it could have been better, much better. I didn't know things were this bad behind the curtain...
nuff said, lets get started with the unofficial PC project (make it official I say, well doesn't really matter as long as something happens this time) and also start with something spectacular!!
~ This epic size competition thing doesn't really appeal to me anymore. I'd rather just enter a tiny competition as long as people like Gav, Jacque and Hazardous etc are gonna be entering. I basically just go where the quality level is high so I can learn - And where the judging is actually reflective of who is making good art decisions.
~ This epic size competition thing doesn't really appeal to me anymore. I'd rather just enter a tiny competition as long as people like Gav, Jacque and Hazardous etc are gonna be entering. I basically just go where the quality level is high so I can learn - And where the judging is actually reflective of who is making good art decisions.
Yeah, I agree with you. Prizes don't really appeal to me either, it just brings out greed in some people.
Keep em small, and interesting, the DW thing was the same every year, make a character... in the DW universe! Nahhh gime some shit that will blow my mind or something...
Replies
About hosting everything on one site and making artists compete on that one site, this was suggested in the past. It was remarked that the consequence of this would be that artists would not be able to compete in a setting that they are already familiar with, and they would not be surrounded by the friends and buddies they are usually together with. Sure, competiting artists might visit the website to cheer their friends on, but these are mostly the competing artists. It wouldn't feel like your community is there on the lines with you. One of the things forums like about this event is that it makes their communities stronger. The CGLand forum was made just for DW. LeewiArt just recently began, and they are already competing as a heavyweight. Plus, the main challenge is 8 weeks long. Interest will wade if artists would be outside their home forums for soo long, or worse yet, they'd just post their wip work on their home forum and occasically, or just at the end, update their wip thread on the central dw forum. Giving rise to ninjas.
It's true that DW has gotten massive and winning is extremely hard, when pitted against the world. One thing I did like about a specific past challenge was DWII. Each team had a best of their team. Maybe this can be added again if you guys like this? At least this way, regardless of which team you compete on, you have good chances of getting exposure. Then again, a top 75 list might be good enough. Not sure, team best or top 75...
The only way it could work is if we did what pior suggested... but even that has its problems because the cooperation of different forum staff members isn't garaunteed...
Waiting for entries? nah... you set deadlines, and you enforce them... if people don't submit their champions... they don't fight... fin.
But this all sounds wicked complicated and unless you can find a way to make money on it... real money... DW sounds pretty dead... Not forgotten... just ... dead...
Thanks again Fred...
Does that mean there will be game-art contests with results?
Because the Polycount Community enjoys the Dominance War and Unearthly Challenge contests?
At least the nature of the very first one where it was PC vs. GA, from there we just stuck with it because it was more tradition than anything and it inspired people to do their best.
Moving forward, if the two contests are consolidated to their own domains where people register and post on those forums individually, then thats great. If people want to volunteer and help run those sites, thats fine too. However, we have our own website to run, and volunteering our time on another website's efforts is unfortunately not possible.
I would expect that all other community heads are going to feel the same way. Their website & community (read: not yours) are within their best interest. If you want to start something that brings other websites together in friendly competition while managing it all yourself/with a team youv'e organized, that'd work and make some communities very happy.
What won't work is expecting the other communities to personally offer their team to manage things on the DW/UC side of things.
With that said, there's nothing stopping the PC staff to volunteer individually, separate from Polycount. If we've learned anything from watching you run these contests over the years its do only take on as much as we can handle. Whether or not you are expecting CGHub, Polycount, CGSocieties and so on to spend their energy and time on managing things from the DW and UC websites I am not sure. But if you are, I'd consider what I have written before moving forward on the idea.
?
You make it sound like PC wasn't ever invited.
Skankerzero - Seriously? Are you suggesting that PC was never welcome to join?
Lenny - It's because more pages are involved and more artists are involved. Plus, since their are more artists, more prizes were needed. But this can be simplified:)
You can look at it that way or you can look at it as people who care about what's happening enough to voice their opinion. They were just trying to understand, but couldn't.
It probably doesn't help to equate those people to loud party crashers during a special event. It wouldn't be special if it weren't for the people who came.
you did equate us to drunk party crashers.
Your words not mine.
And then you wonder why people might find it difficult to work with? My impression is that there is more frustration about DW than anything else.
I mean if a forum organizes a cool comp, what prevents anyone in the world to join that forum and post stuff there ? I dont think that the DW seal is like a necessity in order to find a job.
Also, backing up Adam. Its just common sense.
I'm not sure that adds up. I'm pretty sure in this case, the "wedding" wouldn't even be there to such a degree if not for the participants. And I'm also pretty sure in this case the booze that was supposed to be there wasn't. Or rather, was in short supply. Also everyone who shows up gets pictures taken of them and sold on the side, to help go towards that booze that might show up next year.
Not that the booze was the important part.
It just seems like you're making "this side of the tracks" seem like complete douchebags because the mod team, rightfully so, won't put forth effort to support someone's project in fear of spreading too thin and for exposing an issue that may have offended some artists and possibly border on the line of illegal acts.
I'm not trying to be a dick - but - I said this in the other thread that it gets a bit much when you frequently see on GA talking down about this community that, on the surface at least, seems to have it's shit together and follows through on their word. I like the jokes back and forth and can totally get in on the trash talking - i mean, i've posted a penis in the GA logo more times than i can count - but there's a bit of a difference between jokes and disrespect.
Two Listen: You're forgetting that these photos were taken from secret cameras that no one ever knew were there and then, after someone did find the camera, a disclaimer was put in the top corner of the guest book that you may or may not have your photo taken...you're also forgetting that we really only showed up to plow the vulnerable bride's maid.
That's the only way to judge true game art.
I understand that the Franchise is popular, and due to the visual nature/multiple views bandwidth requirements must be high. But isn't this a standard double edged sword that defines online business?
I can also see how programming, maintenance and HR are massive time sinks, and as such costly. Which leads me to think you are likely micro managing most every aspect? if so kudos, thats a shit tone of work but consider getting some distance and loosening up the reigns.
As for prizes, i don't think that's something we need to re visit.
Also i want you to know, i enjoy watching the competitions every year. I think they are fucking amazing and i honestly hope yourself and the community are able to find a elegant solution to the current issues.
Lennyagony, thanks. yeah, programming, maintanance, and hr are the big ones. During a challenge, handing off the programming or maintanance to someone else is risky because if one file is accidently overwritten, good bye entire system. Hard to trust someone with this as the more people who are involved, the more chance of human error. However, I did leave it to each different language forum to translate their own rules page (was rather long) this year, and they did pretty well. I think things are well on their way to being entirely run by most forums instead of one person.
Amen.
YA!
And that makes ALL of you RACISTS!!!!
:P
RACISTS I SAY!!!!
Can't wait! Will be worth bothering with I'm sure.
Fred H - one thing I just don't get in reading all of these posts from you across various forums...It is always thrown back to how difficult or how much you had to sacrifice to initiate and run Dominance War. It almost comes off as you're expecting people to be obligated to thank you or that in some way their lack of charity to help you with the endeavor is a show of being unappreciative. If your words have been true and that you did this to only further community interaction and growth, then even if you receive no thanks it shouldn't matter...if this was truly meant to be a selfless act as portrayed. I don't know you personally but I do know the track record of dominance war from its' inception. It just really was more than it ever needed to be inflated to and with the record of delays and rule changes it really just never was worth bothering with. Like Pior and others have said, the prizes don't matter...it's about the challenge. I don't even see how anyone would want to enter it even were it to continue on. It was a good experiment.
On the note of Polycount based challenges / comps in the future...Can there be more environment full on challenges? Thank you.
Synthesize them and create a solid system. Seems like it might be better to have more substantial fleshed out ideas than the little tidbits floating around.
Anyways, one judging system that is used with a LOT of success is simply what is being used over at 11secondclub.com and hotornot.com
(I sound like a broken record about this).
Each piece is judged on a score from 1-10. The averaged score is the order they are placed in. This way any singular anomalies in judging are averaged out (granted there are enough judges willing to wade through 800 entries).
Although it might sound like a LOT of time to judge, as far as I'm concerned, each artist worked on their entries around 320 hours. I really believe that it deserves to be looked at.
Heck, the contests at 11secondclub don't even have official judges, just open the task to the public, and from what I've seen, there isn't a lot to discredit the integrity of the placements (and I'd imagine it would certainly make things a lot easier if things were more automated).
Dim - Good luck. The system is already solid. Haven't heard anything so far that says working with no system for 800 entries is doable. The only thing that is majorly flawed, is the management - i.e. me. So once the transition from GA to DW is complete, and once a team is assigned to getting things done, it's gonna be awesome. System plus management, with no prizes, it's going to be one for the books:) Like I said in my letter, I am excited for the future. I got it this far, now it's going to only get better in times ahead. Join or do not, it’s up to you. You can always sit on the side lines to see how it does. I know where I'll be, making my entry for GA!
Simple fix, limit public voting to registered forum users, with say, 100 post min.
PS: I hit edit instead of quote at first, now your post is stained with my name. HA
Fred - Whats next for DWV? You're out, and entering, so who is in? When can the communities involved expect it to begin?
The Choi part of JacqueChoi kinda gave it away.
I pretend to be asian to pick up chicks.
The same way I pretend to be Spanish right?
but seriously, Im all for the events being there own forums// no more forums vs forums kinda deal...
I love rivalry amongst forms but I think it got out of hand when people went as far as to post on opposite forms trash talking, and then certain powers that be changing that said persons Icon to a ball sack for over a year
(But seriously good times guys !)
This hasn't been working out for me too well. :O
I thought the fahe PC vs whateverthenameofthatsitewas suddenly got out of hand when GA ate their corpse.
Fredh: Firstly, I can't express in words how much you have blown my mind with your unpology. Even if it is the honest to goodness truth... dude.. just....
Playing the I'm stepping down card all the while everythings buddy buddy and were all friends, and then the I'm poor card and then topping it all off with the 'but nows the time to cough up the $$$ if you want to help out' bomb?!
Do you have any concept of how this may come across to the people you have driven away due to your previous blunder? If not, we are done here.
The only hopefully helpful thing I can say to you is remember back to the days where you were passionate about creating art more than you are passionate about being a middleman and organizer. Remember when you earned mad props and respect from your peers by producing cool art and not by hosting a contest. Remember when you had time for creating art, and it wasnt all spent on organizing things / being a manager. I bet things were simpler back then! Maybe head back to those roots and earn some props back man, just sayin'
You may think but wait! I am doing ALL OF this for the community! And for all I know you may be genuinely trying with all your heart to get this all back up and running ASAP, but dude, take it easy, relax a bit.
All the necessary elements still exist, and will still be there tomorrow. The awesome artists around the world, the plethora of forums that are eager to participate, all the sponsors. I'm betting they all still want to make cool art, and be apart of massive worldwide art competitions if given the right avenue.
Think about whats happened and take some time out to reflect, and seriously think about rebuilding core values that will help the community regain faith in yourself, GA and the running of your contests before jumping over and right up into PC's grill saying things like 'Why does polycount even bother with DW? Seriously.' No matter how scathing or critical people are being of you right now, this is NOT helping your cause.
Theres always a chance to right wrongs, but right now you're draining drops from an already rapidly draining pool.
I have nothing useful to add regarding the actual execution or future of DW, I would only hope the end result its simple, does not rely on the funds of the community to exist, and allows artists all around the world to continue to jam together and make awesome art!
Adam, emil and mop were emailed the date already.
Lets keep events in the forum, like the TF2 Pack.
Having awesome events where everyone competes was awesome, but it seems like it was too much? aparently?
If buddy made 50k in 5 years, which isint thaaaat bad... he could have also had a job on the side, the event doesn't last the whole year now...
I just think it was poor decisions and really feel bad for the people who didn't get all the prizes they deserved.
Fred did good stuff for the community, but it seems as if it could have been better, much better. I didn't know things were this bad behind the curtain...
nuff said, lets get started with the unofficial PC project (make it official I say, well doesn't really matter as long as something happens this time) and also start with something spectacular!!
Yeah, I agree with you. Prizes don't really appeal to me either, it just brings out greed in some people.
Keep em small, and interesting, the DW thing was the same every year, make a character... in the DW universe! Nahhh gime some shit that will blow my mind or something...