Game Art Cliches
Hey everyone, I have been pondering this for a while, just want to see what other artists think.
I feel that most game art is pretty cliche. Almost everything has space marines, wizards, etc. Most games can clearly fall under the sci fi/fantasy banner. We get a bitt of contemporary stuff once in a while (gta 4, modern warfare) but for the most part I think games tend to have space marines, wizards, castles, and awesome corridors with robots/zombies.
That whole thing isn't really what I find interesting though. What interests me is the audience AND the creators seem to love this subject matter. Again and again, I see generic sci fi and fantasy scenes and characters made and posted on this site and many others (I do this as well).
My question: is this a healthy activity for us as artists? Should we be trying to be more original? As a side note, for someone who is just starting out (looking for an entry level position) is originality valued? Or is it generally more effective to produce solid work off of someone else's concepts?
I feel that most game art is pretty cliche. Almost everything has space marines, wizards, etc. Most games can clearly fall under the sci fi/fantasy banner. We get a bitt of contemporary stuff once in a while (gta 4, modern warfare) but for the most part I think games tend to have space marines, wizards, castles, and awesome corridors with robots/zombies.
That whole thing isn't really what I find interesting though. What interests me is the audience AND the creators seem to love this subject matter. Again and again, I see generic sci fi and fantasy scenes and characters made and posted on this site and many others (I do this as well).
My question: is this a healthy activity for us as artists? Should we be trying to be more original? As a side note, for someone who is just starting out (looking for an entry level position) is originality valued? Or is it generally more effective to produce solid work off of someone else's concepts?
Replies
Compounding that, the marketplace is generally resistant to new ideas and the rough edges that typically accompany them. You don't usually make back your investment by being the first to do something -- you make it by being the second, or third, etc. Thankfully there are some big exceptions to that, but it usually seems to be the case. Of course, if you look at things in a long-term view, by being the first to do something you put yourself in the best position to exploit that novelty once the lumbering marketplace finally starts to come around.
As far as your last question, YMMV but quality of execution seems generally more important to one's career as a 3D artist than having an original creative vision. To put it simply, unless you establish yourself as the best of the best, studios are looking to bring on board people who can match their style, not people who can establish it. Is that healthy? I wouldn't say it's unhealthy, to be honest. As an analogy, nobody would care to hear your brilliant ideas if you lack the ability to properly express them. Picasso mastered realism before pioneering his own work, and that common foundation is an important thing to establish.
but if you're asking for something that doesn't fit into the extremely broad catagories that are reality/fantasy/scifi, good luck.
I guess its hard to be creative and come up with new stuff but still, the digital medium affords freedoms never seen before, it should encourage deviations(but its the other people that disencourage deviations).
The question is whether they are doing what they want because they want to or because they are afraid to take a risk and get it wrong.
This is why I can't even sort of wait for The Last Guardian to come out.
Yep, as long as Fumito Ueda is alive the industry is safe. Let's hope that The Last Guardian is succesful and many more will follow in Udea's footsteps.
But as an experiment, go out to a department store tonight, swing by their electronics department, and look at all the games they've got on their shelves. Without including sequels or games in the same series (because that would skew the numbers) count how many games include which common themes. They'll look at you funny and ask you if need any help with anything, but if you're feeling saucy, actually write it down as you go.
I haven't done it, but my hypothesis is that the majority of the games (excluding sequels or series) won't have much in common with one another, and space marines/zombies/high fantasy won't be the most highly recurring theme(s).
But even if it was, in answer to your question, no, I don't think it's at all unhealthy to focus on popular things like that. Game art is a commercial art discipline. The healthiest things a commercial artist can strive for artistically are relevance and versatility. It doesn't really matter how much crazy shit you can dream up so much as how well you can make the stuff that needs to be made for the project at hand. It's no different from other areas of commercial art that way. Steaming hamburgers.
I mostly brought this up because I noticed that "game artists" seem to be a bit more prone to doing the same subject matter over and over again. Keep in mind this is just my super unscientific, anecdotal type trend. Just wondering if I was way off base here or whatever.
and this is why its ok that everything is fantasy and or sci fi, because the genres themselves can be completely different. did sotc have trolls? goblins? ANY tolkien stuff? nope. fantasy is a simple way of saying OH SHIT THIS CANT REALLY HAPPEN BUT IT PROBABLY HAS SWORDS N SHIT and sci fi is all like OH MAN WE GOTS FUTURE TECH N SPACE STUFF.
yeah... that's the best I can do.
"Left turn. Left turn! Left!! Crap crap crap crap crap! Well, that's just great."
Mafia looks like a nice change of pace/setting. Same with Red Red Redemption.
but ya, alot of games to fall in those categories.. though, some of my favourites dont. the first Max Payne was brilliant.
What you want now? Being able to ride Indian Camels in the setting they are already present in? Take a trip, d'uh!
I'm doing it right now. I wanted to make a fantasy village, so I started. But does that become a bad habit? Because I know I'm not the only one. Being someone who plays games quite a bit and likes the art in games, I often find myself just thinking "I want to do a room that would fit in with Mass Effect". I'm not really sure if what I'm saying has a point, but I think about it a lot.
I think last years unearthly challenge did it right. Here is a concept art. use it, but change it to make it your own. stuff like that keeps things original, even if the genre is very much the same as everything else.
I love it when games have the Red Barrel or Red Crate..because you know it's sole purpose is to be blown up. When I saw that Red Dead Redemption had explosive crates, I smiled. Granted, yes it doesn't really make sense. But you never question it in a game.
While I love the art direction in Uedas games (it's hardly a typical fantasy, but one heavily influenced by South American, Asian and European aesthetics) their brilliant design is where it's at.
I'm not sure whether you have played ICO or SoTC, but those game are something different than what we have gotten used to; especially ICO.
ICO, despite being a simple mix between a platformer and an overly long escort mission was a brilliant game where emphasis was put on something different than "kill-em-all" gameplay. Its characters feel far more alive than any game-characters I have seen to date; the amount of work put into their movement, idle animations and creating a sense of symbiosis between Ico and Yorda is simply astounding.
ICO used simple, yet clever psychological tricks to increase the immersion; the more you help Yorda (and the more she helps you) the more attached you become to those clumps of pixels on your screen. In the end, I can barely remember any specific puzzles or levels, but my memories of chasing Yorda like an idiot or holding the R2 button whenever something hostile appeared on the screen are extremely vivid.
Damn, I know I sound like a crazy fanboy but Uedas games have some unique magic in them, though I am sure not everyone will appreciate it. Still, hes one of the reasons why Ive decided to pursue a career in this industry and one of the few people who really try to do something different.
Whilst japanese fiction does have a ton load of its own cliches they are more willing to create new worlds.
It's interesting to think about... in the beggining game art was a slave to gameplay and things were evolving all the time so nothing really "stuck" and became cliche, in fact game art was absurd. Just go back 20 years and look at your old game cartridges. Giant centipedes, mushrooms, asteroids, flying cupids, dueling knights on giant birds. Seriously, looking at an old game collection is like a bad acid trip.
But here we are... Are graphics cliche? Hell yes they are. Are they better? YES! Because studios focus on what works. Is it better this way? That's debatable. The quality bar's been raised. 1 person can't make a game any more to the standards that we're now used to, it takes lots of people and as such it takes a lot of money (a corporation) to put it all together.
Do you HAVE to do space marines? No. But that's the kind of art that most studios are looking for. As someone planning a game myself, i'm struggling with where i want to take the art direction. As an artist i want to push the boundaries, as a game designer, i know the art is simply a tool for delivering the gameplay.
In the end the best games will always excel in many areas, both gameplay AND art, they take risks and make mistakes, but in the end craft something you weren't expecting. The problem these days is no one's willing to risk trying to make great groundbreaking games because of the vast amount of resources needed to make it happen, it's very hard to get 40 people all on the same page to do something revolutionary, in fact it's damn near impossible. Game studios have gotten bigger and bigger. Studio execs, advertisers, HR; more and more non gamers have a say in the course of the medium and as it gets bigger, revolutionary game developement becomes less and less possible.
On a personal note I'm stoked for my mod! I've got a couple more quarters before i graduate so i figure F it, this is a unique opportunity to try to push the envelope and try to make something awesome before i'm swept into the machine. Got some good guys on the team, we'll probably crash and burn, but it's gonna be a hell of a ride! The way i see it, if all the professional talent is making space marines and games from 10 years ago, there's gotta be room for something new. I highly encourage you guys to do the same, you just never know what might happen...
If you see it as a job like for example a carpenter its the way to go,
not every carpenter is automatically a furniture designer.
I love Ico & SOTC, but it's 9 years later and we are getting the third game in the same setting.
The east is as mired in cliche's as we are, it's just new to us. I was surprised at how many games are based on "The Journey West" until I realized how many western games are based on "The Lord of the Rings".
If you want a radically different style, you have to be ready to invent a new visual language; one which the players might not wish to learn. That's why concepters have to find a way to make a new language that doesn't alienate anyone. And that usually just means it's a cliche with some extra polish on it. That's why the most creative and original art we see doesn't usually find it's way into mass media, instead hanging out in cult classic comics and such.
I’m going to speak to a few fashion designers at Uni and see what sort of ideas and suggestions they might have for me in terms of design. I noticed that CCP were looking for a fashion designer for their new game which I think should show some interesting styles to their game.
I think its hard to break away from the norm without looking at what’s happening in other areas of art, so I am going to do a study into this kind of wish I had done this for my dissertation as its clearly a good topic of debate in the games industry.
I also think that it’s a bit unfair to just bundle up game art into genres but there is a definite trend towards certain styles.
I shall see what I come up with gonna be hard
A few guys at my uni tried to investigate this from an artistic point of view and what they did was to paint there textures by hand with tradtional paints and then scan them into the computer. Some of the results were good but at the end of the day the results were very similar at a distance. Because the output of the textures was still digital so lost all the quality of the paint. This might have just been because they werent so good at making textures but still felt there wasnt much to be gained from this.
Being original is like being iconic...something is only iconic because of the impact it has already had on our society...would we care about or notice the apple logo if they made boring crossword books? not likely.
A friend of mine once tried to write "original" sounding songs but the more he tried the more he realised he is always going to sound like someone else. So we may as well accept this and embrace the cultural language that Dfacto was speaking of and one day we might be involved in something that people will say "that was original"
As for art cliches in general, now using "you" in a general term, I can appreciate a desire to want to stir things up a bit, but I'd rather you didn't do it with my games. By the sound of things it's going to end up like the equivalent of some pretentious French fashion cinema a tiny cliq of people can "ooh" and "aah" over while the rest of us just shake our heads.
The best change we get is gradual, and subtle, not from someone going, "let's change it all!" Very few of us are receptive to extreme, sudden change. It's just in our nature, and while we're slowly evolving out of it, we're not there quite yet.
Games like Brink take art into a direction that is fresh enough, but not as crazy and over the top as Killer7 or Mad World. Games like those two should be applauded for their big ballsacks, but they aren't, and (as far as I'm concerned) shouldn't be, commercially successful.
While companies like CCP might be looking for fashion designers, I'm sure the art directors have sense enough not to give them too free reins, or they'll end up with some truly inane shit that'll just alienate a majority of their potential consumers.
Anyone who eats can appreciate the classic sugar cookie. It's a fact. It might not be everyone's favorite, and it might be somewhat unimaginative, but we can all appreciate it, right? It is, after all, a classic cookie which has so many delicious variations, ranging from snickerdoodles to peanut butter cookies, and everything in between. The sugar cookie is the archetypal base upon which a large percentage of cookiedom is based, and should, therefore, be respected.
Now apply that same logic to art. Take an archetype - Noir, Eastern Fantasy, Dystopian Sci-Fi - and think of it like a sugar cookie. Taste it, tweak it a bit, then taste it again. It will still be a sugar cookie, of course, but it won't be just a sugar cookie. Instead, it will be your own take on them, which pays homage to it's sugary roots while experimenting with new things like cinnamon chips and cashew butter.
Which is to say, it will still be Noir, but there's a nice comicbook look to it, and a few Dennis Wheatly influences.
to get a nice fresh apple!
Obviously youll risk having people that dont like apples whereass
everyone loves cookies from childhood on.
Does it look like the space can be lived in and is practical? As long as something is well implemented and thought out, I don't think it should be tossed aside because it's the 50th castle in the 50th portfolio you've looked through. Every genre has been done over and over again, I don't see how much more 'original' and 'different' people can get with some stuff.
I mean how many sword designs can you come up with that will be 'new' in terms of what a sword is before it stops being a sword and just this massive spikey silhouette? In practicality it would probably cause more harm to the wielder than it would the enemy.
I hate overly forced design work just for the sake of being different or 'original' which is a term that I think doesn't exist quite that way any more.
That being said, if you have the genius to actually come up with something no one has ever seen before, then I will hump your leg for all eternity.
This is pretty much the problem with everything, nothings original anymore and we are all so used to comparing things, but seriously, I think its all about thinking up something cool for your personal work and making it kick ass, no matter how unoriginal it is.
Id add to that coming up with something no one has ever seen before [ and the public majority enjoys ]
because its pretty easy to come up with something no one has seen before in a game but very hard to make something new that people actually like.
QFT, IMHO, originality is a tad overrated nowadays, who cares if a game has unoriginal content, for me it's usually all about the execution.
I know it's easy to look at someone posting inspiring wires and then wanting to do the same, and I'm hardly a saint here, but there are so much more interesting things you can do. Thank heavens I don't want to be a game artist and will never be forced into making a space marine.
On the subject of fashion though that is also a bit of a cliché look at games like APB its fresh in terms of what its giving the player in terms of freedom to create a specific look for you own character but its still very much a dated look in my eyes the style of art in that game has been around for awhile in the real world. But breaking away from that is probably almost impossible as most fashions arent worldwide. I very much like what they have done with the game.
This also makes it hard for a games company to try to keep up with whats happening in the world of fashion as most games take years to develop and most fashions are over within that time frame.
I dont think CCP have hired a fashion designer to go off the wall but more to try to think of ways to incorporate things like fashion eras.
I think if we look at fantasy art where do most of the influences for this style come from, to my knowledge most fantasy art is a throwback to like Greek, Roman and ancient Asian art styles ect...
So these styles and ideas of creatures and so on will never change because its history, were too aware of these so when you have a game like Assassins Creed the main characters style was unique but was still very much of the time that the game was set. Does this make any sense or is what Im saying a load of waffle, I tend to waffle a lot.
I think as a challenge I'm going to do what Fly_soup said and look at a bunch of games and idetifi the genre that most of the games on the shelfs at this time fit into and see where that goes.
Id agree that nothing is new and it has all been done before but thats one thing fashion trends have shown us that we can take something old and bring it back with new ideas which makes it unique.
what?
What zwebbie sayd. Way to often i see some game art students that
seems to know nothing else than way to large american suburban architecture
and it really shows in scales being way off in everything exept guns maybe.
What I'm trying to say is, just because a concept has been done many times over, doesn't necessarily mean it's clich
You might like that something is fresh but then it will still boil down to wether or not the game is any good or not. Personally ill be impressed with the graphics of a game for around 3 hours of playing a game then after that it dosent matter.
Yes I enjoy seeing clever work but the bottom line is the execution is what sells it, if it looks like trash then it doesnt matter how good the idea was.
I had that with Zeno Clash, the designs, graphics were unique compared to other games, but the gameplay just pissed me off so I quit before I was half way through.
I like graphics that convey something, that arent just noise or a bland bunch of browns, that simplifys things and helps you to understand the environment.