Need to buy a new PC, have no idea what to buy, assistance please!
Hey there all,
It's about time I bought a new PC... in fact it's way overdue. I've ashamedly been using a couple years old MacBook Pro running BootCamp for all my 3D work over the past year or so.
I predominantly did 2D graphics and a lot of music recording when I bought my MacBook, and at the time didn't use 3D apps at home at all.
I've just about managed fine up until now but my recent ventures into character work and ZBrush has left my computer struggling to say the least, I have to decimate sculpts almost beyond recognition to get Max to even move once they're imported and to be honest, it becomes almost useless.
Here's my problem... I have absolutely no idea about PC components. I've been using Macs for about 5 years now and lost track of the PC thing, I don't know what processors, graphics cards etc are even any good for work in 3D.
On top of this lack of knowledge, I'm gonna go for the self-build option just because I want to learn how to build a PC anyway so this would be a good place to start.
So if anyone could gimme a quick rundown on what components to go for etc that would be awesome.
My budget is a max £2000 (probably about $3-3500 taking into account the premium on UK prices / exchange rate) is this gonna get me a system that'll perform well with crazy sculpt polycounts in Max?
I don't need a display or mouse/keyboard so that budget will be purely on the components/case.
Also, could anyone recommend a good component shop site that is based in the UK?
Many thanks
It's about time I bought a new PC... in fact it's way overdue. I've ashamedly been using a couple years old MacBook Pro running BootCamp for all my 3D work over the past year or so.
I predominantly did 2D graphics and a lot of music recording when I bought my MacBook, and at the time didn't use 3D apps at home at all.
I've just about managed fine up until now but my recent ventures into character work and ZBrush has left my computer struggling to say the least, I have to decimate sculpts almost beyond recognition to get Max to even move once they're imported and to be honest, it becomes almost useless.
Here's my problem... I have absolutely no idea about PC components. I've been using Macs for about 5 years now and lost track of the PC thing, I don't know what processors, graphics cards etc are even any good for work in 3D.
On top of this lack of knowledge, I'm gonna go for the self-build option just because I want to learn how to build a PC anyway so this would be a good place to start.
So if anyone could gimme a quick rundown on what components to go for etc that would be awesome.
My budget is a max £2000 (probably about $3-3500 taking into account the premium on UK prices / exchange rate) is this gonna get me a system that'll perform well with crazy sculpt polycounts in Max?
I don't need a display or mouse/keyboard so that budget will be purely on the components/case.
Also, could anyone recommend a good component shop site that is based in the UK?
Many thanks
Replies
You have a nice budget, doubt you need to spend that much really, but if you really wanna go for it there's motherboards with support, for what, 96GB RAM now.
I'd just go for a single Quad CPU system, something like Intel Core i7 940 or 950, that's a 2,93 and 3,066 GHz CPU. A 1366 socket motherboard, 8-16GB DDR3 RAM. Graphics card isn't that big of a deal really, as long as it's decent, I mean, which 3D packages are using the GPU for loading high polgygon meshes, anyway? None? Just grab like a ATI Radeon 5850 - 5870, good price/performance, great for gaming too.
If you really want to spend money you can go for a dual quad CPU system. But how good are most of these programs at utilizing all threads on a CPU anyway, that's the issue... For me that's mostly noticeable on rendering, but if you don't do rendering for animation, only stills/beauty shots, then you don't need that much power...
I'm on a 8GB, Quad CPU system now, and my last sculpt in Zbrush is 32 million, and it's pretty bleh...
I'm concerned I'm gonna get in way over my head here, it seems like I need so many components!
It's refreshing to know I could save a little money too, no point spending it if it's not gonna be necessary.
In terms of other bits and pieces, like cabling and stuff, what do I need to get? If anything?
Thanks again for the help.
Do I need a sound card?
And, how do I know which RAM I need?!
Feel free to /facepalm as much as you like.
Motherboard
CPU
RAM
PSU
- It's important to choose a good power supply, you'd might as well go for some power right away as well, so you don't need a new one when you're buying new parts. If you buy a 500-600W now, it might be just a little bit too weak the next time you're gonna upgrade, but something like 750 should be good. There's a lot of good brands... Silverstone, Corsair, PC P&C (were they bought up by OCZ or something?). I also go for one that is modular, so I can choose exactly which cables I want hooked up, and not have a bunch of cables in my case that's not used.
- GPU
HDDs
- harddrives, I'd go for one for my system disk (operating system), and two for storage, something like 1x500GB, 2x750GB or something? I prefer smaller sized disks, backing up 1000-2000GB disks is a bitch. Well, it's all depending on what you need as well, so, I'm currently at 5TB a running out of diskspace. But go for one disk for system, and one or two for storage. I'd avoid Seagate disks at the moment, they've had some really bad troubles with faulty firmware on the drives locking it in a permanent "busy mode", which means you can't access it. This has affected a lot of their disks, 500GB up to 750GB at least, maybe bigger as well, don't remember off hand. So maybe just go with some Western Digital ones.
Case
- you need a good case, midi tower or maxi tower? You're choice... better space and better ventilation/cooling in a maxi, if it's a good one that is. Check out some reviews, see what you like... I'm currently using a Cooler Master Cosmos S, it's a bit old now though, so there's probably something better around, but I've been very happy with this one. Search for a review and have a look, see if you could fancy something similiar or no. For me a bigger one is just more practical, easier to mount more HDDs and they give off a lot of heat, graphics cards are huge these days, long. I also use third party heat sink and fan for my CPU since I'm overclocking, and it's pretty damn big.
You usually get what you need of cables in the motherboard retail package, but depending on which case you're going to use, and how many HDDs you'll buy, some s-ata cables at proper length might be needed.
Soundcard, you said you did recording, you're not going to use this computer for that are you? If you are, yeah, then you need something better than the onboard motherboard one, but I figured you might have that from before, like a firewire interface or something? But for just regular use, the onboard one should be fine.
As for what RAM, I've been using Mushkin lately, some good stuff: G.SKILL, GeIL, most will do fine, I've even used OCZ and had no problems. Nothing wrong with Kingston, and usually not Crucial, most motherboard manufacturers have a memory compatability list that it'd be wise to check before final purchase.
Say you go with a i7 system, a 1366 socket motherboard, you don't need to buy the fastest DDR3 RAM it supports. You can go lower, and thus lower in price without loosing that much performance.
I just did a quick build on Overclockers and the price for what Clockwork listed in his post came in at around £1500 which is good. I just hope I order the right parts!
With regard to the GPU... (and I don't intend to start a war here) ATI or NVidia?
on the subject of gpu's, gaming cards are fine, you wont need an industrial card (they do have some advantages but I've never felt the price difference was worth it except in a few specific situations). Standard 3D apps rely heavily on the gpu for processing, but zbrush is an exception and is almost completly cpu dependant (the more cores the better it'll run, as it takes full advantage of multi-core and multi-thread architecture). ATI cards are a bit faster then nvidia ones on the whole atm, but ati is also known for having flaky drivers, and Ive seen several posts both here and on different forums where ati users had problems with max or maya using the 5000 series cards. But hen again alot of people dont have any such problems so its sort of up in the air on if ati or nvidia are the 'right' choice for 3d artists atm imo.
For hard drives you'll want a standard magnetic drive for mass storage, used as a secondary drive. And for the primary with the windows partition I'd recommend a solid state drive (ssd), they cost quite a bit but the performace difference can be immense on the higher quality models by comparison to standard hard drives.
but if you're willing to build one yourself for 3d work, per has a very in-depth post on his hardware purchases and the reasons why he chose specific stuff, forgot link http://boards.polycount.net/showthread.php?t=64997
Yep that pre built system does look perfect. Thanks for that!
You're right too, much better idea to go with a ready made one since I don't know what I'm doing with building one, I just assumed I wouldn't find one for a decent price.
A budget of £2000 seems quite high, for that price you should be able to build a very nice workstation, and also a high quality monitor as well.
Also make sure you get yourself a 64 bit OS, either XP64 or windows7 64 if you have more than 3 gigs of ram.
Marine's system with windows ultimate 64bit, + GTX 260 = £1290.43 inc VAT. I think that is a pretty decent price for what will be a very solid computer, and you'll be able to do absolutely everything in the 3d world with ease, spending any more than this you really loose value as you'll spend out the ass for marginally faster equipment, but for a disproportional price increase.
Oh yeah and sound cards, some people hate onboard, and if you do audio record/any sort of audio work you may want to pick up a sound card. I would go for the onboard first as its free, and see how you like it, if it sucks pick up a $50-100 soundcard from creative labs. A sound card is really easy to add, just follow the instructions.
When you say the GTX260, is that adequate do you think? CompanionCube mentioned the 285 which is a bit more expensive... for what I want, would it be worth going for the 285?
Many thanks
I built a new box using this method earlier this month for $325. Brand-new computer, 2 Gigs of RAM, 512 MB 3D card, 2.8 GHz 64-bit processor, 250 GB HDD, wireless network card, DVD-burner, 64-bit distro of Ubuntu Linux. $325.
With regards to the GTX 260 vs 285, I just did some Googling... my resolution won't be exceeding 2 x 1680x1050 displays, and only one of those if gaming, am I right in thinking the GTX260 would be more than adequate? The 285 is like £150 more.
So if you insist on going for the, always superior Nvidia get a cheap hundred quid card for now like an Ati 5770. Wait till march to see whether Nvidias new cards are all that is heralded because if not then they will be in trouble, how much is hard to say.
I'm not trying to start a war but there is no proof that the new Ati cards have any of the past problems(probably all new ones though).
The 285 (and 260) is a DX10 card, you can get a 5870 for the same price, and it's DX11. Not to mention much better performance in several scenarios.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-5870,2422-13.html
...a lot.
I think Z-brush might be the only one that doesn't.
http://techreport.com/system/
I built mine over a year ago, the "sweet spot" i think, and it's still fantastic
Can anyone confirm this with a link to an official document?
Because this is the first I'm ever hearing of it, the GPU being using for things as loading meshes is something people have been asking for, for a long time, and I haven't heard anything about that being here already.
Sure you guys are not confusing this with the GPU being used for viewing the mesh in OpenGL mode?
Just before I hit the buy button though, here's what's in my cart. I have two questions for you, so I don't screw up and order the wrong stuff.
1. Would these components all work together?
2. Am I missing anything to build the entire system?
Ok here's the list:
Case:
CoolerMaster Elite 330 ATX No PSU Black
CPU Fan:
Akasa Intel LGA 1366, 1156, 775, AMD AM2/AM3 Multi Plat 3HP Cooler, 92mm PWM Fan
PSU:
Corsair Memory 650W TX SERIES ATX
GPU:
Zotac GeForce GTX 275 896MB PCI-Express HDMI
RAM:
OCZ Technology DDR3 6GB (3x2) Platinum 1333Mhz
Motherboard:
Gigabyte S1366 Intel X58 DDR3 ATX A L
Processor:
Intel Nehalem i7 920 S1366 2.66GHz
HDD:
Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 500GB 7200RPM S300 16MB
Optical:
Best Value Samsung 22X S-ATA DVD Writer - Black
Extras:
Microsoft Windows 7 Professional OEM 64-bit English DVD
StarTech.com 10G CPU Heatsink Grease
There are a couple bits on there I will upgrade later, extra HDD, and possibly a better optical drive. But bear in mind I'm coming from a MacBook Pro so even the option to upgrade later in itself is a big benefit.
All this comes in at like £900 which is almost £400 less than the pre-built. Admittedly that does have 2x 1TB HDD's but for the sake of £400 I'll add those later.
So is this gonna fit together ok? And work of course
Feel free to recommend alternatives to the components listed although I'd like to keep the price similar!
Many thanks.
One thing to keep in mind is that your CPU will come with a stock fan, which for most people is totally useable. The last couple builds i've done, i've gotten stock intel fans and they have been quiet and cool. As long as you're getting a retail CPU(looks like you are) instead of an OEM.
Often times you'll pay more for an OEM CPU+custom fan, so unless you have plans to overclock it or something, which i dont recommend. I'm sure some people do, but i dont have any desire to decrease the life expectancy/stability of my computer to shave of a few extra MHZ.
In which case, you can get rid of the extra CPU can, it should also come with some heatsink grease as well, so these two things are like redundant. You can always buy them later if you feel the need.
Ok so I'll drop the fan/thermal paste stuff, I was only buying that because I thought the CPU didn't come with one.
Right looks like I'm all set then.
Thanks to all for the help/advice.
DVD/bluray drives are quite annoying, its like the only piece of hardware that you need to *pay* for the drivers.