It's a little hard to see with the screenshots you have but the bakes wont capture the planar changes of your high poly crate very well. Keep in mind that the closer to sharp 90 degree angles your edges are on the high poly, the less it will show up on the bake. Try loosening up your bevels on your edges and making them rounder.
edit: dang you posted at the exact same time! lol
hmm... no idea why it's doing that with your new attempt. are you just winging it or referencing a tutorial?
Like ZacD said, you've got to actually unwrap this thing. All of the side areas are creating a black vortex because that have zero space on your uv sheet. You might be able to get away with an unwrap like that if your edges flared out a bit or relax your uvs, but even still you need to take the time to unwrap properly. Cut your uv edges along the edges of the box, and pack your sheet tight enough to be efficient with your texture space.
With a box, you can usually have opposite sides of the box overlapping uvs to be even more efficient, just make sure if you do that you move one of the overlapping sides out of the 0-1 space, otherwise you will have similar problems.
ok... lets simplify this so you can start to understand the workflow...
1. Make your low poly a cube. That is it. 6 sides...
2. Unwrap it... Flatten all... Should make it nice and quickly
3. Bake your high to this and see the results....
You are getting bake errors, smooth errors, uv errors from not unwrapping, etc.
ok... lets simplify this so you can start to understand the workflow...
1. Make your low poly a cube. That is it. 6 sides...
2. Unwrap it... Flatten all... Should make it nice and quickly
3. Bake your high to this and see the results....
You are getting bake errors, smooth errors, uv errors from not unwrapping, etc.
I get step 1. I get step 2. But what is step 3? I'm sorry but could you explain more. What am I baking to?
I get step 1. I get step 2. But what is step 3? I'm sorry but could you explain more. What am I baking to?
n88tr... I think it would be best to get some tutorial dvds or watch some of the free ones that are out there. The baking stuff is pretty entry level now (baking = projecting your high poly model on to the low poly / game mesh and creating your normal, ao, cavity, height maps)
First of all, make sure your high poly model has nice thick smooth edges so your bake comes out well. The sharper the edges on the high, the less information is transfered to the low and will alias out quick.
Dont know if its any help but my work process atm is as follows.
1. Make the high poly model. (Nice thick smooth edges).
2. Duplicate the high and convert this to the low poly model. (Sometimes this isn't feasible and you're better making an entirley new low model).
3. Unwrap the low. (The step you missed out). You need to unwrap the low before you bake, otherwise your transfering the normal information onto something normally resembling a spiderweb...which is why you have the errors you have. Faces are overlapping and normal information is conflicting, hence the black marks.
4. Once the low is unwrapped make sure your smoothing groups are correct. (I use maya so I harden or soften edges). Max is a little different I think. This will be the tricky part, and its kinda hard to explain. Check out some tutorials on this like Jesse said. A mate is currently folllowing a tutorial on 3DMotive, a briefcase one. He's said its helped him loads for learning high/low baking and smoothing groups. So I reccomend this!
If you didnt know already, you dont need to unwrap the high poly! Just the low.
Once the normals baked, I usually generate a AO map in NDo2, and then go through diffuse, spec and gloss maps, if they're needed.
n88tr, sorry in advance for being harsh, but you've been on this forum for 4yrs and posted over 1,000 times in what, General Discussion? FOUR years and you don't know -eye bleedingly- entry level basics? What exactly is your purpose on coming to this forum if not to gain knowledge as a game artist? All of this information is available on the wiki.
I wish I had that much amassed information when I started out - I'm a self taught artist. Sure, there were some very rough tutorials out there but you know how I learned? PRACTICE. Fiddle, tinker, test. Then do it again. Then, do it again. After that, do it again. Problem solving is a huge part of a game artist's job. If you can't solve the most basic problems, how do you ever expect to get a gig or even to be self reliant in life?
Again, I'm not trying to be mean or make you feel bad, I'm just being honest. That kind of blunt honesty is why most of us came to Polycount to begin with - when people gave strong critique it made better artists.
To me, you're showing no drive or dedication at all. You want your hand held the whole way. Take initiative, practice. Your work is not bad - that sword in particular looks good so far. But dammit man, learn the basics! If you can't get a box to bake and in fact don't know what baking implies, how do expect to do anything??? The information is free and readily available, please do something with it!
I was honestly surprised to read that you were having troubles baking a normal map. I've seen your post's all over polycount!
I swear I've seen models of yours with normals and all.
Idk, straight confusion here.
Anyway, in order for you to actually have a normal map. The lowpoly HAS to have an unwrap before you bake.
You bake the high poly to the unwrapped lowpoly.
Like Joshua said, fiddle with it over and over and over till you get it right! There is plenty of wiki stuff on this. problem solve till your arms fall off.
It always amazes me how much replies threads like that have. Such basic thing and you got ton of good help. Just put all this effort you waste on asking basics into doing basics ;] Aren't they unwraping in this eat3d tutorial ?
It's the same bloody thing, c'mon man, even if the program is different and the way the tools work is different the same basics of high, low and baking apply, seriously dude, go to youtube and search up some basics videos for this stuff if you're being so nit-picky about the program.
Also, I'm feeling like you're not actually learning stuff, simply gliding through it and hoping for the best.
You mention watching the tutorial, yet now you mention now NOT watching it because it's for Max. Which one is it? Did you actually watch the tutorial or not? Or it is another tutorial? Are you actually taking your time in learning it or not?
Also, what is your end goal? I don't mean to put pressure on you, but if you're a 25 year old guy who is till having issues with something as simple as Normal maps, with conflicting statements about a DVD he watched, I would say things aren't looking too hot for you.
wow thanks for all the support
I know i'm an idiot but if I never try to get better I never will. In that process learning I am bound and I always do make a lot of mistakes.
I go back to college in a few days so I'll give it another go and watch that video.
Quick question but are you going to school for game art? If you are then I am really surprised that you haven't been taught this by now. If you're self taught then just keep doing what you're doing, keep watching tutorials and what not.
school never even mentioned texturing or normal mapping.
without PC i never heard of it before then. after getting into games and game art i realized it was everywhere. school taught me maya modeling but i'm way beyond what the class taught me. i could teach that class and I would be a way better teacher.
Ok. You are on polycount. Been a member since December 2008. Have over 1000 posts but you don't know how to bake a normal map, unwrap, what textures are?
What the hell have you been doing for the past 3 going on 4 years here?
Seriously, not to be a dick but dude at this point this is ALL ON YOU.
I've had the desire off and on to learn new things like for instance now normal mapping.
I think you think I've been full-tilt trying to learn this stuff since 2008 which is not true at all.
Mostly lurking around the forums for most of my existence here to be honest. Only recently do i want to become more of a full-fledged 3d artist by learning normal mapping. I've spent a lot of time just making models that never went anywhere. Is that what you wanted to hear?
I don't want to hear anything. I just want to see sexy art.
Listen I know how it is. I have a million and one excuses why my portfolio isn't where it should be. Why I haven't put in the time I would like to or focus on my own skills. My own decisions have held me back and prevented me a lot of amazing opportunities. BUT the only person that can fix that is me. Just like in your case.
Sorry, not trying to sound like a jerk. Just honesty helps more then sugar coating.
if there is one thing i appreciate is people trying their hardest. If there is one thing that bugs me is people killing themselves and not advancing. What exactly are you trying to accomplish with your last axe? Are you trying to make an asset for a game like skyrim? or are you trying to do something for WoW.
I ask because that thing is super high poly, and not just that. It has a more than a few artifacts everywhere. So dont blow up, we are here to help you.
Somethings to help you. Use reference, not concept. Sure real axes are boring, but if u learn how to do realism, stylized becomes a breeze. Go to the polycount wiki. Lots of high poly modeling tutorials there. Remember, your textured low poly, will look as awesome as your high poly. IF you take your time and put love into it. If you dont, nothing will save the low poly. And after that, then follows texturing. I suggest you try to get better one thing at a time.
And dont blame it on the schools..is not their fault.
Is this the high-poly or the low-poly version? Because everything looks pretty much like high-poly except for the blade itself.
If it's a low poly I hope you won't keep the text like it is. You should tell us what you're aiming for, it's realy hard to give good critics without knowing how much is going to be done and how much is actually off.
OK, before someone comes in and has a go lemme say something.
When you unwrap, the checker pattern doesn't have to match up along all the sides, you just do your best to unwrap things without any warping, which on a cube you should have no problems with. Basically just make sure the black and white squares are as "square" as they can be...
Also, you have faces overlapping on your UV map. It looks like you've projected the top/bottom....the left/right....and the front/back sides together. Make sure you offset one of the same sides to -1 if you want that side to repeat OR unwrap each face separately on the same map, otherwise your bake might come out with errors (Black marks) along that face.
If you want to avoid any more harsh crit, please, please follow the all guys advice on here and TRIAL AND ERROR until you get it before you make another post. The post above is literally one of the 1st things you should learn, and you've been posting here for a long time. Keep at it....but Trial and Error and listening to guys on here is the only way you learn stuff...I've learnt more from this site alone than 4 years at University......
EDIT. You also want to have the same texel density on each face. As in you want to unwrap each side with the same"ish" amount of UV space. Right now the top/bottom is huge and the sides are a little smaller. Meaning that the top and bottom (which you might not even see...I dunno) will have a higher res and look more detailed compared with the sides.
OK I'm working on a model and i got a diffuse working and i see my textures are still stretched pretty bad. Is there any way to adjust how my texture fits on the model inside of Maya or do i need to redo my uv? I have it set to 1k square
do i need to have all the objects and nodes set up in hypershade to properly apply normals, etc?
All you really need to do is make sure that youre using either the high quality viewport renderer or viewport 2.0, and that you have your texture set as "tangent space normals" if youre using a normal map.
well my textures looks flat on the model and a bit stretched. not sure why, my uv is laid out all nice and neat. why would my textures stretch on the model?
Have you applied the spec, AO and normal maps you were talking about? If so, post up some more images.
As far as the textures looking stretched on the model, I don't think it has anything to do with your UVs. The texture you created is itself stretched. Whatever sort of brushed metal image you used on the blade looks like it has been stretched in photoshop, and it doesn't look like metal.
Replies
edit: dang you posted at the exact same time! lol
hmm... no idea why it's doing that with your new attempt. are you just winging it or referencing a tutorial?
different angle:
so my bevels should be greater on my high poly?
what about my low poly, can my edges still be sharp like they are now?
With a box, you can usually have opposite sides of the box overlapping uvs to be even more efficient, just make sure if you do that you move one of the overlapping sides out of the 0-1 space, otherwise you will have similar problems.
1. Make your low poly a cube. That is it. 6 sides...
2. Unwrap it... Flatten all... Should make it nice and quickly
3. Bake your high to this and see the results....
You are getting bake errors, smooth errors, uv errors from not unwrapping, etc.
Basically this, you have to actually do some work to get good results, now you are only wasting time trying to stay away from the hard stuff.
okay thanks i'll try that
I get step 1. I get step 2. But what is step 3? I'm sorry but could you explain more. What am I baking to?
n88tr... I think it would be best to get some tutorial dvds or watch some of the free ones that are out there. The baking stuff is pretty entry level now (baking = projecting your high poly model on to the low poly / game mesh and creating your normal, ao, cavity, height maps)
Well a normal map is a texture
Take a look at this when you have the time http://wiki.polycount.com/NormalMap?highlight=%28%5CbCategoryTexturing%5Cb%29
Bunch of links at the end as well.
Dont know if its any help but my work process atm is as follows.
1. Make the high poly model. (Nice thick smooth edges).
2. Duplicate the high and convert this to the low poly model. (Sometimes this isn't feasible and you're better making an entirley new low model).
3. Unwrap the low. (The step you missed out). You need to unwrap the low before you bake, otherwise your transfering the normal information onto something normally resembling a spiderweb...which is why you have the errors you have. Faces are overlapping and normal information is conflicting, hence the black marks.
4. Once the low is unwrapped make sure your smoothing groups are correct. (I use maya so I harden or soften edges). Max is a little different I think. This will be the tricky part, and its kinda hard to explain. Check out some tutorials on this like Jesse said. A mate is currently folllowing a tutorial on 3DMotive, a briefcase one. He's said its helped him loads for learning high/low baking and smoothing groups. So I reccomend this!
If you didnt know already, you dont need to unwrap the high poly! Just the low.
Once the normals baked, I usually generate a AO map in NDo2, and then go through diffuse, spec and gloss maps, if they're needed.
Hope this was some help man. Good luck!
getting near the end of my college winter break. thought by now i'd knock this out. so close lawl
people say i bake my high to my unwrapped normal but I don't see how that helps.
I wish I had that much amassed information when I started out - I'm a self taught artist. Sure, there were some very rough tutorials out there but you know how I learned? PRACTICE. Fiddle, tinker, test. Then do it again. Then, do it again. After that, do it again. Problem solving is a huge part of a game artist's job. If you can't solve the most basic problems, how do you ever expect to get a gig or even to be self reliant in life?
Again, I'm not trying to be mean or make you feel bad, I'm just being honest. That kind of blunt honesty is why most of us came to Polycount to begin with - when people gave strong critique it made better artists.
To me, you're showing no drive or dedication at all. You want your hand held the whole way. Take initiative, practice. Your work is not bad - that sword in particular looks good so far. But dammit man, learn the basics! If you can't get a box to bake and in fact don't know what baking implies, how do expect to do anything??? The information is free and readily available, please do something with it!
Agreed.
You have got plenty of help now, and should be able to work this out
I swear I've seen models of yours with normals and all.
Idk, straight confusion here.
Anyway, in order for you to actually have a normal map. The lowpoly HAS to have an unwrap before you bake.
You bake the high poly to the unwrapped lowpoly.
Like Joshua said, fiddle with it over and over and over till you get it right! There is plenty of wiki stuff on this. problem solve till your arms fall off.
my b-day today so i'm taking it easy and will give this another crack tomorrow
They sure as hell do.
http://www.eat3d.com/pillar
I need to decompress for a bit
Also, I'm feeling like you're not actually learning stuff, simply gliding through it and hoping for the best.
You mention watching the tutorial, yet now you mention now NOT watching it because it's for Max. Which one is it? Did you actually watch the tutorial or not? Or it is another tutorial? Are you actually taking your time in learning it or not?
Also, what is your end goal? I don't mean to put pressure on you, but if you're a 25 year old guy who is till having issues with something as simple as Normal maps, with conflicting statements about a DVD he watched, I would say things aren't looking too hot for you.
I know i'm an idiot but if I never try to get better I never will. In that process learning I am bound and I always do make a lot of mistakes.
I go back to college in a few days so I'll give it another go and watch that video.
without PC i never heard of it before then. after getting into games and game art i realized it was everywhere. school taught me maya modeling but i'm way beyond what the class taught me. i could teach that class and I would be a way better teacher.
anyways
yeah
at school now so i'm unwrapping my low
Not mention normal maps or texturing?
Ok. You are on polycount. Been a member since December 2008. Have over 1000 posts but you don't know how to bake a normal map, unwrap, what textures are?
What the hell have you been doing for the past 3 going on 4 years here?
Seriously, not to be a dick but dude at this point this is ALL ON YOU.
I've had the desire off and on to learn new things like for instance now normal mapping.
I think you think I've been full-tilt trying to learn this stuff since 2008 which is not true at all.
Mostly lurking around the forums for most of my existence here to be honest. Only recently do i want to become more of a full-fledged 3d artist by learning normal mapping. I've spent a lot of time just making models that never went anywhere. Is that what you wanted to hear?
Listen I know how it is. I have a million and one excuses why my portfolio isn't where it should be. Why I haven't put in the time I would like to or focus on my own skills. My own decisions have held me back and prevented me a lot of amazing opportunities. BUT the only person that can fix that is me. Just like in your case.
Sorry, not trying to sound like a jerk. Just honesty helps more then sugar coating.
Will some more soon.
3BladedAxe WORK IN PROGRESS
my base model is near done [the GIFs]
then i do my high which is adding geometry to the base
then i strip down my high to the low and unwrap
then bake high to low and see how it goes
should make good progress tomorrow. 1 class on Mondays, at 6-9 pm
overall blade needs a re-do, horrible geometry not sure how it got there honestly.
class now though
attached
I ask because that thing is super high poly, and not just that. It has a more than a few artifacts everywhere. So dont blow up, we are here to help you.
Somethings to help you. Use reference, not concept. Sure real axes are boring, but if u learn how to do realism, stylized becomes a breeze. Go to the polycount wiki. Lots of high poly modeling tutorials there. Remember, your textured low poly, will look as awesome as your high poly. IF you take your time and put love into it. If you dont, nothing will save the low poly. And after that, then follows texturing. I suggest you try to get better one thing at a time.
And dont blame it on the schools..is not their fault.
So lets see more progress!
If it's a low poly I hope you won't keep the text like it is. You should tell us what you're aiming for, it's realy hard to give good critics without knowing how much is going to be done and how much is actually off.
I will try not to mess up the blade as i make it into high.
checker pattern is a bit off,
how would I fix this? I assume it is important for proper normal map and texture display on the model.
When you unwrap, the checker pattern doesn't have to match up along all the sides, you just do your best to unwrap things without any warping, which on a cube you should have no problems with. Basically just make sure the black and white squares are as "square" as they can be...
Also, you have faces overlapping on your UV map. It looks like you've projected the top/bottom....the left/right....and the front/back sides together. Make sure you offset one of the same sides to -1 if you want that side to repeat OR unwrap each face separately on the same map, otherwise your bake might come out with errors (Black marks) along that face.
If you want to avoid any more harsh crit, please, please follow the all guys advice on here and TRIAL AND ERROR until you get it before you make another post. The post above is literally one of the 1st things you should learn, and you've been posting here for a long time. Keep at it....but Trial and Error and listening to guys on here is the only way you learn stuff...I've learnt more from this site alone than 4 years at University......
EDIT. You also want to have the same texel density on each face. As in you want to unwrap each side with the same"ish" amount of UV space. Right now the top/bottom is huge and the sides are a little smaller. Meaning that the top and bottom (which you might not even see...I dunno) will have a higher res and look more detailed compared with the sides.
uv snapshot
http://tinypic.com/r/20pv8zp/5
diffuse
http://i43.tinypic.com/28l6luv.png
diffuse applied
http://i44.tinypic.com/212tu6v.jpg
watching this video,
http://www.digitaltutors.com/11/training.php?vid=9384&autoplay=1
do i need to have all the objects and nodes set up in hypershade to properly apply normals, etc?
All you really need to do is make sure that youre using either the high quality viewport renderer or viewport 2.0, and that you have your texture set as "tangent space normals" if youre using a normal map.
As far as the textures looking stretched on the model, I don't think it has anything to do with your UVs. The texture you created is itself stretched. Whatever sort of brushed metal image you used on the blade looks like it has been stretched in photoshop, and it doesn't look like metal.