any website that tells wether if an Iphone can withstand these things?
iPhone 4 uses the PowerVR chipset IIRC, which is a decent amount of rendering power. But whether it does detail mapping simply depends on which game engine you're using. If it supports custom shaders, then you can probably make your own.
You mean detail normal maps? It's just a tilling normal map, typically pretty small like 256*256 to give surfaces a more high frequency look, helps getting rid of blurry materials.
If you use the detail texture approach overgrowth uses, it should be fine on iDevices.
Just a litte calculation + some detail textures blended into the original ones tinted in the original color will give relatively good results and should be less costly compared to adding normal maps.
If you're just after a bit of grain and want to save on file-size and performance though, then with the view angle you have in your image there, a simple film grain might do quite well too.. Not sure if it's available in Unity however
A detail normal map is the fancy version, some people go the grey scale multiply route because it costs more to render the detail normal, or so I have been told by my rendering engineer. An interesting topic, I've noticed all the modern fps games have moved away from detail textures in favour of higher res diffuse textures that tile less. I totally expected to see detail maps of some kind in Crysis 2, Rage, and BF3, but there was none. I used these back in 2005 to make our basketball courts have the same texel density as the players when seen up close, this was an issue because the shoe's are often filmed up close during replay cameras and the court surface looked like blurry shit because we wanted each court to have character and actually photographed and then used the exact staining and dirt patterns found at the real location. The court textures did not tile they were unwrapped 1:1 to allow for real world wear patterns captured on site. The game was accurate to about 2-3 feet. A great technique in my opinion, I'm looking forward to seeing how Half Life 3 tackles the issue of blurry textures seen up close, or if they even try to tackle it. Perhaps game reviewers and game players alike are not bothered by this issue any more as the diffuse textures have come up in resolution drastically over the last 5 years.
Halo Reach is still using them, and they go really high in tiling to crank out a ton of texel desity but they do some kind of distance fade to make them less noticably tileable from a distance. Is there any way to emulate this effect in UDK? DepthBiased Alpha perhaps?
Yeah in Gears 1 they used detail normal maps on everything, so I would imagine it's in UDK somewhere. By definition detail maps fade based on distance from the camera, that is the whole point of them. You don't see them when you're far away to avoid noisy shit looking texture, when up close they fade in linearly. Generally it's a global scale, so you determine when they fade starts based on distance.
The detail textures often just mip out after a certain distance anyway.
But with UDK its easy enough to just fade the detail in by getting camera distance from pixel and making that into a falloff range and threshold.
I don't think that mipping them out alone will look good will it? and could you not save on performance if you used a switch to turn off detail normals past a certain point. What Nodes should I use in UDK to make something like what I am describing?
I don't think that mipping them out alone will look good will it? and could you not save on performance if you used a switch to turn off detail normals past a certain point. What Nodes should I use in UDK to make something like what I am describing?
it is pretty easy to remove or add things from the distance, just using the camera position node and comparing it to the world potion of the mesh, which can be done via a lerp to fade out the detail normal, but it wont save you any resources, since the material will still be using the detail normal texture sample, it just wont be visible on screen.
if you could find a way to trigger the state of a static switch paramater that bypasses the whole detail normal part of the network it could be done, but i find static switch parms tend to lag udk out for a sec when there state is changed, and i also dont know how you would trigger one to change state in the material network via distance, since im sure it is olny possible to change the state of a static switch parm, via kismet or uscript
you can do custom mips on it to make it fade out, I guess... But maybe it'd be better to make a lod material?
It's one possibility but more materials mean more drawcalls, and one extra material just to fade out on a detail map sounds like pushing it.
I'm not sure about UDK but CE3 does this automatically, you only start to see the detail NM when you're close to it.
From my experience it's more or less the same in udk really. Stand back a few feet and the detail map will be completely washed out/invisible. So, I wouldn't worry about that.. If anything, then it'd only help the main material/shapes pick up the lighting better
I totally expected to see detail maps of some kind in Crysis 2 and BF3, but there was none.
This is untrue, at least on PC. The most noticeable detail normal in BF3 is the tiling finish they have on all of the FP weapons - on some weapons it will visibly repeat when you are using iron-sights.
What you will find, however, is that detail normals are not tossed about on every environment texture, which is something that used to show up a lot more - they are not universally applying detail textures, but they are still using them often.
I was referring to a unified system on the environments, I thought that was implied in my statement, sorry if it wasn't.
Yes you can clearly see detail textures on every single character in BF3, it's how they get that fancy high res cloth pattern on the soldier's cloths. I didn't really notice any on the environments in Crysis 2, Rage, and BF3 which I played all on the pc. If there were some here and there I still see a trend where they are not used at all, or used sparsely.
What I did notice on BF3 though was the cloths looked great because of the detail map, but for up close shots the faces looked blurry by comparison, I wonder if a light noise texture could be used to get some grain/skin pores on the faces without looking like shit to fix this texel density mismatch. Could be a cool experiment.
Replies
details for other people who want to know
http://www.moddb.com/games/overgrowth/news/detail-textures
any website that tells wether if an Iphone can withstand these things?
iPhone 4 uses the PowerVR chipset IIRC, which is a decent amount of rendering power. But whether it does detail mapping simply depends on which game engine you're using. If it supports custom shaders, then you can probably make your own.
Just a litte calculation + some detail textures blended into the original ones tinted in the original color will give relatively good results and should be less costly compared to adding normal maps.
http://www.malcolm341.com/ruckerdlc35big.htm
http://www.malcolm341.com/ruckerdlc04big.htm
But with UDK its easy enough to just fade the detail in by getting camera distance from pixel and making that into a falloff range and threshold.
it is pretty easy to remove or add things from the distance, just using the camera position node and comparing it to the world potion of the mesh, which can be done via a lerp to fade out the detail normal, but it wont save you any resources, since the material will still be using the detail normal texture sample, it just wont be visible on screen.
if you could find a way to trigger the state of a static switch paramater that bypasses the whole detail normal part of the network it could be done, but i find static switch parms tend to lag udk out for a sec when there state is changed, and i also dont know how you would trigger one to change state in the material network via distance, since im sure it is olny possible to change the state of a static switch parm, via kismet or uscript
It's one possibility but more materials mean more drawcalls, and one extra material just to fade out on a detail map sounds like pushing it.
I'm not sure about UDK but CE3 does this automatically, you only start to see the detail NM when you're close to it.
http://www.lumonix.biz/Media/ShaderFX_DetailNormalMapping.wmv
This is untrue, at least on PC. The most noticeable detail normal in BF3 is the tiling finish they have on all of the FP weapons - on some weapons it will visibly repeat when you are using iron-sights.
What you will find, however, is that detail normals are not tossed about on every environment texture, which is something that used to show up a lot more - they are not universally applying detail textures, but they are still using them often.
Yes you can clearly see detail textures on every single character in BF3, it's how they get that fancy high res cloth pattern on the soldier's cloths. I didn't really notice any on the environments in Crysis 2, Rage, and BF3 which I played all on the pc. If there were some here and there I still see a trend where they are not used at all, or used sparsely.
What I did notice on BF3 though was the cloths looked great because of the detail map, but for up close shots the faces looked blurry by comparison, I wonder if a light noise texture could be used to get some grain/skin pores on the faces without looking like shit to fix this texel density mismatch. Could be a cool experiment.