A 2Ghz dual core mobile chip is seriously old stuff now, and the OS that shipped on those machines was 3 or 4 generations ago (they either shipped with Tiger (10.4) or Leopard (10.5), my white MB 13 C2D shipped with Tiger back in 06'), Now we're on Lion which is 10.7 and it just wasn't built with 5 year old laptops in mind.
Those MacBooks also only use up to 3GB of RAM so you wouldn't have much option to upgrade it either, the new MacBooks/Mac Mini's will use up to 16GB AFAIK.
As for the GPU chip, some programs, especially Windows based games won't run at all on an integrated card, and if they do you'd struggle. For example, native WoW ran on lowest settings at about 15-18fps on my old white MacBook with a 1.8Ghz C2D, 3GB RAM and the same GMA GPU.
Also, it'll be way out of warranty with a fairly high risk of something failing. As I mentioned earlier, if the Logic board goes, I'd guess you'll be looking at £400 or so to get it repaired. The Macs I've had and kept that long have had a habit of being bulletproof until about a month outside of the 3 year warranty.
You could possibly get something that's only a couple years old which would be more than adequate, but due to them holding their value, you probably won't save much money.
Also, if you're a student, or know one, they give like 20% discount on all new Macs (possible refurb'd too) for higher education students which could bring it down to a more affordable level.
For the price of a MBP 15", I could get a business-class laptop from Dell with a professional grade GPU, the same RAM, the same CPU, and probably a bigger hard drive. For the price of any Macbook, I could build a desktop that blows the hell out of them all. So what more do you get over any other brand or home built when you drop the extra cash on a Mac exactly?
having flawless wacom drivers and no bullshit like getting viruses from google image search (just recalling another recent thread here) is enough for me to skip dell and stay with 15" mbpro. 4 months together, still in love.
also seeing my $ 2k toshiba laptop dying a month after its warranty expired due to videocard fault and having no chance to replace it (sorry dude it's discontinued! ) makes me 2x happy with apple extended coverage.
So again, Mac hardware is nothing special and is not worth the price. If I want FreeBSD I'll just hit the torrents and get one of the free distribution versions.
I can't imagine an aritst wanting a freebsd system but maybe you can.
(I still secretly run windows xp via parallels. need painter 6 that's not working on intel macs since it's like 10 years old. but I liked winxp, and it's under 2 gigs with painter installed, colour me happy)
having flawless wacom drivers and no bullshit like getting viruses from google image search (just recalling another recent thread here) is enough for me to skip dell and stay with 15" mbpro. 4 months together, still in love.
also seeing my $ 2k toshiba laptop dying a month after its warranty expired due to videocard fault and having no chance to replace it (sorry dude it's discontinued! ) makes me 2x happy with apple extended coverage.
I can't imagine an aritst wanting a freebsd system but maybe you can.
(I still secretly run windows xp via parallels. need painter 6 that's not working on intel macs since it's like 10 years old. but I liked winxp, and it's under 2 gigs with painter installed, colour me happy)
Sounds to me you're more a victim of poor security practices than flaws in the OS. I do regular scans of my PC. In fact 99% of viruses are the user's fault. All operating systems include adequate tools to help you secure your system, but people just don't utilize them and install risky apps and browser plugins. I don't install software that I don't 100% trust to not put a key logger or bot net on my computer. I've never had trouble with my Wacom drivers on my Windows machine. I always keep my software up to date and secure my devices. I've had more trouble from DRM than malware and viruses. Mac doesn't get many viruses simply due to the fact that almost nobody bothers writing Mac viruses due to their low numbers. Windows is the most popular OS because it comes with every OEM computer for the cost of the machine. There are hundreds of millions of windows user versus millions of Mac users. You tell me who the bigger game is. If you're a virus coder, your goal is maximum propagation and the sheer number of Windows users is the key to that.
I'm glad you brought up Apple's warranties. Apple offers the most horrible warranty you can buy. Apple care is a joke. I've worked in support at a college and we heard stories day after day how the "Geniuses" refuse to fix an Apple Care protected device without a check for the weakest of reasons requiring us to send it off to a certified repair service. Their one best excuse is "external damage". They will refuse to honor the warranty you paid extra for and demand more money if any of your warranty claims accompany the slightest external damage. We're talking small dents and cracks in the case material. Your hard drive is giving you read errors? Oh, there's a small dent on the corner of the cover! You'll have to write a check to fix that! Apple's warranties are shit and a waste of money. You're better off taking out insurance on your laptop, which was what the college had the students do because Apple Care was so habitual in refusing to honor the simplest of warranty claims.
Conversely, Dell offers a very good extended warranty. They have an accidental damage warranty. If you spill your drink on it, the pet uses it as a toilet, you trip and fall on it, you forget it on top of you car and drive off, the display falls off, anything that is accidental and clearly not intentional damage, they will provide you with replacement parts and repair it; in some cases they will replace the entire laptop if deemed necessary. The replacement laptop you get will be as good or better than the laptop you purchased. For example, one claim involved someone who's laptop was crushed. The laptop was totaled. It was a Latitude D800. At the time of the accident, they didn't have anymore D800's, new nor refurbished. So they gave him a refurbished D820 (a business class laptop with an alloy case). To put that in perspective, that's like going from an iBook to a MacBook Pro but with professional graphics (Nvidia quadro NVS). Oh, and this warranty can be good for up to 4 years if you're willing to pay for it.
Greevar, don't bother going to such lengths to 'defend' PC's. Nobody has said outright 'Macs are better than PC's. The OP just asked 'does anyone use one' and some Mac users just chimed in and explained the reasons they like them. You dont need to jump in and say 'yeah bit windows does that better, cheaper, faster, stronger etc'. If people want to buy a Mac, let them by a Mac, nobody is forcing you to.
And as Andreas said, this doesn't need to be one of those threads.
I'm not saying 'PC's suck', I built a PC last year just because it was cheap, £600 in total and blew away any 'off-the shelf Mac'. It ran ok, and as you said, I didn't get any viruses, spyware etc, buy I just didn't like it, and sold it and stuck with Mac. Sure it cost a bunch more money, wasnt as high performance but in my opinion it is 'better' for me, but that doesnt mean 'better' for everyone.
Again, it's just a luxury item that, if people have the money to buy and aren't interested in super performance to cost ratio then they'll buy... Again, like luxury car brands, they don't do anything more than cheaper cars but they look nice and are built well.... You don't argue with a Mercedes owner saying 'um you know this Ford is faster right, it works fine and you coulda saved 30 grand'.
I've noticed that in the PC vs Mac debate, it's always PC users going out of their way to make their points heard, and justifying why PC's are better. Whenever a Mac thread pops up, there's a Greevar in every one. Yet when a PC thread comes up you don't get Mac users jumping in to start explaining why Macs are better.
Also, my experience with AppleCare has been great, some of my friends/colleagues have had good experiences too. Never had a problem getting repairs at all.
Sounds to me you're more a victim of poor security practices than flaws in the OS.
sounds to me you haven't even bothered reading my post, too busy speaking with imaginary mac fanboys in your head
I didn't bother reading your reply either
have a nice day, xoxo
I don't know if the underpowered thing is true anymore, I saw an i7 macbook the other day. Mind you, I could probably buy two decentish second hand cars for the price.
I got one of the first i7 mbps, powerful thing and it could cook an egg too But yeah they're underpowered in relation to their price tag, with the same amount of money you could get a beast of a machine and install hackintosh on that
Greevar, don't bother going to such lengths to 'defend' PC's. Nobody has said outright 'Macs are better than PC's. The OP just asked 'does anyone use one' and some Mac users just chimed in and explained the reasons they like them. You dont need to jump in and say 'yeah bit windows does that better, cheaper, faster, stronger etc'. If people want to buy a Mac, let them by a Mac, nobody is forcing you to.
And as Andreas said, this doesn't need to be one of those threads.
I'm not saying 'PC's suck', I built a PC last year just because it was cheap, £600 in total and blew away any 'off-the shelf Mac'. It ran ok, and as you said, I didn't get any viruses, spyware etc, buy I just didn't like it, and sold it and stuck with Mac. Sure it cost a bunch more money, wasnt as high performance but in my opinion it is 'better' for me, but that doesnt mean 'better' for everyone.
Again, it's just a luxury item that, if people have the money to buy and aren't interested in super performance to cost ratio then they'll buy... Again, like luxury car brands, they don't do anything more than cheaper cars but they look nice and are built well.... You don't argue with a Mercedes owner saying 'um you know this Ford is faster right, it works fine and you coulda saved 30 grand'.
I've noticed that in the PC vs Mac debate, it's always PC users going out of their way to make their points heard, and justifying why PC's are better. Whenever a Mac thread pops up, there's a Greevar in every one. Yet when a PC thread comes up you don't get Mac users jumping in to start explaining why Macs are better.
Also, my experience with AppleCare has been great, some of my friends/colleagues have had good experiences too. Never had a problem getting repairs at all.
This isn't PC vs. Mac, it's not even about Windows vs Mac. It's about dispelling any notion that one is any different, or better, than the other. They aren't different, they're the same. Mac is just an Intel powered PC with a custom distribution of FreeBSD and DRM to prevent it from running on generic hardware. They also overcharge you for an exterior that is, in my opinion, screaming that they just couldn't leave the 60's quasi-futuristic design concepts in the past where they belong. It's boring, bland, and lacking individuality. Most people buy Macs because they have a need to feel smug and superior to others. That's why you see them everyday in Starbucks "writing their novel" so they can be seen being "intellectual" and "trendy". Desperate for attention is more like it.
I have a great deal of respect for what the Mac OS does. It shallows the learning curve for those that are not technologically literate and protects them from their own ignorance. It's made computing more accessible to those that just don't understand technology. They should really let OSX work on generic hardware so people actually have a choice beyond Windows for economical computers. But they don't, so it's all for naught.
To put his in perspective, you're like the guy who buys a Delorean because it's trendy. I'm the kind of guy who builds an Ariel Atom because it's a precision, high performance machine that I can tune to my tastes and needs. You're not buying a computer, you're buying a luxury fashion item. But if it makes you feel good to have that lack of individuality and performance per dollar, then by all means, don't let me stop you. Just don't pretend it's anything but cognitive dissonance.
This isn't PC vs. Mac, it's not even about Windows vs Mac. It's about dispelling any notion that one is any different, or better, than the other. They aren't different, they're the same. Mac is just an Intel powered PC with a custom distribution of FreeBSD and DRM to prevent it from running on generic hardware. They also overcharge you for an exterior that is, in my opinion, screaming that they just couldn't leave the 60's quasi-futuristic design concepts in the past where they belong. It's boring, bland, and lacking individuality. Most people buy Macs because they have a need to feel smug and superior to others. That's why you see them everyday in Starbucks "writing their novel" so they can be seen being "intellectual" and "trendy". Desperate for attention is more like it.
I have a great deal of respect for what the Mac OS does. It shallows the learning curve for those that are not technologically literate and protects them from their own ignorance. It's made computing more accessible to those that just don't understand technology. They should really let OSX work on generic hardware so people actually have a choice beyond Windows for economical computers. But they don't, so it's all for naught.
To put his in perspective, you're like the guy who buys a Delorean because it's trendy. I'm the kind of guy who builds an Ariel Atom because it's a precision, high performance machine that I can tune to my tastes and needs. You're not buying a computer, you're buying a luxury fashion item. But if it makes you feel good to have that lack of individuality and performance per dollar, then by all means, don't let me stop you. Just don't pretend it's anything but cognitive dissonance.
And im the kinda guy that actually likes my laptop to stay on for more then 1,5 hours when its not on a power supply..
Your entire post screams mac/apple hater and you wont at any point look beyond your own values and accept that some people just have different opinions when it comes to hardware purchases.
I've been using PC's for 14 years now, and I still use one. But I've still bought an Apple laptop due to the build quality and the fact everything just works... I still have fix my custom build i7 windows machine every once in a while due to either drivers fucking up or registry bloating.
And im the kinda guy that actually likes my laptop to stay on for more then 1,5 hours when its not on a power supply..
Your entire post screams mac/apple hater and you wont at any point look beyond your own values and accept that some people just have different opinions when it comes to hardware purchases.
I've been using PC's for 14 years now, and I still use one. But I've still bought an Apple laptop due to the build quality and the fact everything just works... I still have fix my custom build i7 windows machine every once in a while due to either drivers fucking up or registry bloating.
I don't hate Mac, I hate Mac users. Macs are machines, nice machines, but not for the money they charge. They represent something important, another choice in computing aside from Windows. But their users act like they're something their not. Some of them think it's "cool" to own a Mac (as TeeJay points out). If you think riding around with training wheels is "cool" TeeJay, then far be it for me to deny you your bliss. I could understand it if you said you use Mac because you like the operating system. I like alternatives to Windows. It's a great to have options, but the OS is the only thing a Mac as over any other computer.
High end laptops, no matter what brand, have shitty battery life. When they're claiming 5-6 hours, that's with a lot of features turned off and the cpu/gpu underclocked. Not to mention they degrade over time, my MBP barely lasts 2 hours these days without being plugged in That's just how it is, battery tech isn't advancing as fast as the things they power.
Keep it on topic guys, this is a do you own a mac thread, if you dont own one I'd say your in the wrong place.
Entity: the latest series has a very nice battery charging system. I wont pretend to know how it works but its definately holding charge much much better than my last MPB. Not to argue your point about battery life in general though.
But their users act like they're something their not. Some of them think it's "cool" to own a Mac (as TeeJay points out). If you think riding around with training wheels is "cool" TeeJay, then far be it for me to deny you your bliss.
I was being sarcastic, of course I don't think 'I'm cool because I use a Mac'. I loathe the Starbucks MacBook jackass as much as you. In fact, I'd even go so far as saying it's almost 'uncool' now because they've become the mainstream, every RayBan wearing hipster has a MacBook and an iPhone.
That said, I own an iPhone too, and wear RayBans... but mine came with a prescription.
But yeah, jokes aside, I use Macs now, and have done for the past 7 or so years simply because I enjoy the OS more than Windows and I'm prepared to forego the excessive pricing and relative underpower. I also like the design, the unibody machines really are something, they're carved from a block of alloy and you can tell they are when you get hold of one, really solid. I didn't care much for the white plastic ones though, but thankfully we're past that.
Replies
Those MacBooks also only use up to 3GB of RAM so you wouldn't have much option to upgrade it either, the new MacBooks/Mac Mini's will use up to 16GB AFAIK.
As for the GPU chip, some programs, especially Windows based games won't run at all on an integrated card, and if they do you'd struggle. For example, native WoW ran on lowest settings at about 15-18fps on my old white MacBook with a 1.8Ghz C2D, 3GB RAM and the same GMA GPU.
Also, it'll be way out of warranty with a fairly high risk of something failing. As I mentioned earlier, if the Logic board goes, I'd guess you'll be looking at £400 or so to get it repaired. The Macs I've had and kept that long have had a habit of being bulletproof until about a month outside of the 3 year warranty.
You could possibly get something that's only a couple years old which would be more than adequate, but due to them holding their value, you probably won't save much money.
Also, if you're a student, or know one, they give like 20% discount on all new Macs (possible refurb'd too) for higher education students which could bring it down to a more affordable level.
also seeing my $ 2k toshiba laptop dying a month after its warranty expired due to videocard fault and having no chance to replace it (sorry dude it's discontinued! ) makes me 2x happy with apple extended coverage.
I can't imagine an aritst wanting a freebsd system but maybe you can.
(I still secretly run windows xp via parallels. need painter 6 that's not working on intel macs since it's like 10 years old. but I liked winxp, and it's under 2 gigs with painter installed, colour me happy)
Sounds to me you're more a victim of poor security practices than flaws in the OS. I do regular scans of my PC. In fact 99% of viruses are the user's fault. All operating systems include adequate tools to help you secure your system, but people just don't utilize them and install risky apps and browser plugins. I don't install software that I don't 100% trust to not put a key logger or bot net on my computer. I've never had trouble with my Wacom drivers on my Windows machine. I always keep my software up to date and secure my devices. I've had more trouble from DRM than malware and viruses. Mac doesn't get many viruses simply due to the fact that almost nobody bothers writing Mac viruses due to their low numbers. Windows is the most popular OS because it comes with every OEM computer for the cost of the machine. There are hundreds of millions of windows user versus millions of Mac users. You tell me who the bigger game is. If you're a virus coder, your goal is maximum propagation and the sheer number of Windows users is the key to that.
I'm glad you brought up Apple's warranties. Apple offers the most horrible warranty you can buy. Apple care is a joke. I've worked in support at a college and we heard stories day after day how the "Geniuses" refuse to fix an Apple Care protected device without a check for the weakest of reasons requiring us to send it off to a certified repair service. Their one best excuse is "external damage". They will refuse to honor the warranty you paid extra for and demand more money if any of your warranty claims accompany the slightest external damage. We're talking small dents and cracks in the case material. Your hard drive is giving you read errors? Oh, there's a small dent on the corner of the cover! You'll have to write a check to fix that! Apple's warranties are shit and a waste of money. You're better off taking out insurance on your laptop, which was what the college had the students do because Apple Care was so habitual in refusing to honor the simplest of warranty claims.
Conversely, Dell offers a very good extended warranty. They have an accidental damage warranty. If you spill your drink on it, the pet uses it as a toilet, you trip and fall on it, you forget it on top of you car and drive off, the display falls off, anything that is accidental and clearly not intentional damage, they will provide you with replacement parts and repair it; in some cases they will replace the entire laptop if deemed necessary. The replacement laptop you get will be as good or better than the laptop you purchased. For example, one claim involved someone who's laptop was crushed. The laptop was totaled. It was a Latitude D800. At the time of the accident, they didn't have anymore D800's, new nor refurbished. So they gave him a refurbished D820 (a business class laptop with an alloy case). To put that in perspective, that's like going from an iBook to a MacBook Pro but with professional graphics (Nvidia quadro NVS). Oh, and this warranty can be good for up to 4 years if you're willing to pay for it.
And as Andreas said, this doesn't need to be one of those threads.
I'm not saying 'PC's suck', I built a PC last year just because it was cheap, £600 in total and blew away any 'off-the shelf Mac'. It ran ok, and as you said, I didn't get any viruses, spyware etc, buy I just didn't like it, and sold it and stuck with Mac. Sure it cost a bunch more money, wasnt as high performance but in my opinion it is 'better' for me, but that doesnt mean 'better' for everyone.
Again, it's just a luxury item that, if people have the money to buy and aren't interested in super performance to cost ratio then they'll buy... Again, like luxury car brands, they don't do anything more than cheaper cars but they look nice and are built well.... You don't argue with a Mercedes owner saying 'um you know this Ford is faster right, it works fine and you coulda saved 30 grand'.
I've noticed that in the PC vs Mac debate, it's always PC users going out of their way to make their points heard, and justifying why PC's are better. Whenever a Mac thread pops up, there's a Greevar in every one. Yet when a PC thread comes up you don't get Mac users jumping in to start explaining why Macs are better.
Also, my experience with AppleCare has been great, some of my friends/colleagues have had good experiences too. Never had a problem getting repairs at all.
I didn't bother reading your reply either
have a nice day, xoxo
This isn't PC vs. Mac, it's not even about Windows vs Mac. It's about dispelling any notion that one is any different, or better, than the other. They aren't different, they're the same. Mac is just an Intel powered PC with a custom distribution of FreeBSD and DRM to prevent it from running on generic hardware. They also overcharge you for an exterior that is, in my opinion, screaming that they just couldn't leave the 60's quasi-futuristic design concepts in the past where they belong. It's boring, bland, and lacking individuality. Most people buy Macs because they have a need to feel smug and superior to others. That's why you see them everyday in Starbucks "writing their novel" so they can be seen being "intellectual" and "trendy". Desperate for attention is more like it.
I have a great deal of respect for what the Mac OS does. It shallows the learning curve for those that are not technologically literate and protects them from their own ignorance. It's made computing more accessible to those that just don't understand technology. They should really let OSX work on generic hardware so people actually have a choice beyond Windows for economical computers. But they don't, so it's all for naught.
To put his in perspective, you're like the guy who buys a Delorean because it's trendy. I'm the kind of guy who builds an Ariel Atom because it's a precision, high performance machine that I can tune to my tastes and needs. You're not buying a computer, you're buying a luxury fashion item. But if it makes you feel good to have that lack of individuality and performance per dollar, then by all means, don't let me stop you. Just don't pretend it's anything but cognitive dissonance.
I can travel through time, and you can drive fast and lose your face to G-forces and wind resistance.
I think that still makes me cooler, just like my Mac does.
And im the kinda guy that actually likes my laptop to stay on for more then 1,5 hours when its not on a power supply..
Your entire post screams mac/apple hater and you wont at any point look beyond your own values and accept that some people just have different opinions when it comes to hardware purchases.
I've been using PC's for 14 years now, and I still use one. But I've still bought an Apple laptop due to the build quality and the fact everything just works... I still have fix my custom build i7 windows machine every once in a while due to either drivers fucking up or registry bloating.
I don't hate Mac, I hate Mac users. Macs are machines, nice machines, but not for the money they charge. They represent something important, another choice in computing aside from Windows. But their users act like they're something their not. Some of them think it's "cool" to own a Mac (as TeeJay points out). If you think riding around with training wheels is "cool" TeeJay, then far be it for me to deny you your bliss. I could understand it if you said you use Mac because you like the operating system. I like alternatives to Windows. It's a great to have options, but the OS is the only thing a Mac as over any other computer.
Entity: the latest series has a very nice battery charging system. I wont pretend to know how it works but its definately holding charge much much better than my last MPB. Not to argue your point about battery life in general though.
I was being sarcastic, of course I don't think 'I'm cool because I use a Mac'. I loathe the Starbucks MacBook jackass as much as you. In fact, I'd even go so far as saying it's almost 'uncool' now because they've become the mainstream, every RayBan wearing hipster has a MacBook and an iPhone.
That said, I own an iPhone too, and wear RayBans... but mine came with a prescription.
But yeah, jokes aside, I use Macs now, and have done for the past 7 or so years simply because I enjoy the OS more than Windows and I'm prepared to forego the excessive pricing and relative underpower. I also like the design, the unibody machines really are something, they're carved from a block of alloy and you can tell they are when you get hold of one, really solid. I didn't care much for the white plastic ones though, but thankfully we're past that.
it is really great!!!