ShaderFX - Max 2011 - Shaders, shaders, SHADERS!
polycounter lvl 12
Hey to all,
I was wondering if anyone could recommend me some shader authoring tools short of me burning my brain to learn full fledge HLSL for 3DS Max.
Reason is, I use Unreal's material editor, but I'm trying to create shaders which are similiar to that in ShaderFX inorder to minimize my downtime in export and import procedures.
Problem is, Max 2011 doesn't seem to work with ShaderFX (ei: All materials save for standard are broken) while older versions of Max work fine with them. Also, it doesn't help that Luminox's forums are closed so yeah, I'm in a massive pickle here.
Anyone have tips and or advice as to what I should do? Much appreciated for any input.
I was wondering if anyone could recommend me some shader authoring tools short of me burning my brain to learn full fledge HLSL for 3DS Max.
Reason is, I use Unreal's material editor, but I'm trying to create shaders which are similiar to that in ShaderFX inorder to minimize my downtime in export and import procedures.
Problem is, Max 2011 doesn't seem to work with ShaderFX (ei: All materials save for standard are broken) while older versions of Max work fine with them. Also, it doesn't help that Luminox's forums are closed so yeah, I'm in a massive pickle here.
Anyone have tips and or advice as to what I should do? Much appreciated for any input.
Replies
http://developer.nvidia.com/fx-composer
Thanks, I'll look into it. Hopefully, I can wrap my head around it. Got any tips for a virgin-noder like me? Please, be gentle.
haiddasalami
Damn it, a friend of mine told me a few moments ago that Render Monkey was a simpler version of FX Composer, but now I hear it's unsupported, when will this madness end? Will I be forced to render out movies in Unreal, having to take into account the 16 axis of time and space, and even then, not get the results I want unless I make love to a Panda? I ask you now, when will it end?
Thanks, I'll look into Mental Mill, although it seems like it doesn't have a standardized Lerp/Mix operator nor a vertex color system for painting mesh which take into account normal maps...I'll make do, thanks for the heads up.
Either that, or go back to Max 2009...if worse comes to worse, I'll do that, and see how exports from one version to another will work.
bugo
I feel out of place in asking the Luminox boys (Ben and Kees and everyone else that helped them out) for an update for a software they have no intention of supporting most likely. The forum is already closed, most of the problems I'm having are 'supposed to be fixed' in the archives threads already, and everyone is too busy with UDK to bother with pitiful peasents like me who are simply trying to find a way to create bridged shaders for realtime previews and expermenting in a much easier enviroment.
Mommy always told me to learn maths, wish I had listened...bah...
ps. you could author the shader in max 2010 and export the .fx file to use in other versions. hlsl is just hlsl after all.
Thanks, I was planning to get some sleep, but I'll start learning HLSL instead, which strangely enough, is exciting for me...I'm such a masochist. Thanks for the tip.
Anway, I tried your advice of exporting the shaders (I also had this bright idea a few moments ago), and no dice, it seems like Max 2011 seriously has an internal problem! I even tried loading one of the shipped shaders, HammerTime.fx and it still wouldn't work.
Infact, this is general, could someone test in Max 2011 and tell me if HammerTime.fx is working? Because while it works for me on 2010 and 2009, 2011 is a no go. This also means that unless a Material is standard based, I won't get the look I'm looking for under any circmanstace if it gets abit fancy.
Lordy, 2009 is looking better and better already.
EDIT: Also, Lambskin.fx doesn't work either....GAH!
Maybe I installed a hotfix and forgot to uninstall it? I don't know, I'll get home in a jiffy and do some more testing...although it is very weird, gah! Angry, angry, angry, huff puff!
http://www.mediafire.com/?uzdnlslasctm8n6
Anyone has feedback? I just uninstalled and reinstalled Max, and updated till SP1, Lordy, does anyone have the answer before I turn into a large, timeless void of self loathe and hatred?
EDIT: Not even Xiouli's shader works, FML, it's even converting images I'm trying to load into .ifl formats. What the hell Max?
EDIT2: OK, my entire procedure is this:
-Uninstall Max, CCleaner, Jav-Tool it, RED it, yadda yadda yadda...
-Fresh Install with cleanup and all...
-Install one by on all of the updates, each time checking Hammertime.fx...
-No Glow, No Glow, No Glow, No Glow...
-Restart process, but install just SP2...
-No Glow...
-Pull hair out...
Tested Max 2011 - 64 bit on Home PC and Lab PC alongside Max 2009 - 64 bit. On all bases and PC's, Max 2009 works fine with ALL shaders, but not 2011 (only basic material sets). So it's not a hardware issue considering my hardware is beefier over the ones in the Lab, so it should brute force through any memory issues no problemo.
Both programs are installed in the same way, and plus, the Lab version was installed by a technician. Those guys follow euthanized procedures, so there is no way they did anything fancy. Again, patched up both in same basis to see any resolution, nada.
When I apply Xiouli shaders, and revert back to something...else, ANY other shader, the shaders will stop working normally, the Glow shader will start faceting, the Ghost shader will stop working and red-frame on me, and so on and forth.
This clearly means there is a problem on my end, since I trust both Xiouli and Kees statement that it works with 2011, and MANY people, I'm sure, use 2011.
However, several different PC's and ALL of them have the same issue as me? Something fishy is going on my end.
I'm at a loss here...honestly, I have no idea what is going on. I'll check at my lab again to see if it works again over there,, but I guess I'm forced to revert back to Max 2009 for my renders, which is a shame, but I can live (although this means rewiring and changing a good chunk of my Shaders since I didn't notice this problem too late...bleh), but so far, both fresh and patch installed of Max aren't showing the Hammertime.fx in 3ds Max 2011 correctly, and neither are the other shaders cooperating with me (EI: They're not glowing, SSS, etc...) and this is only the minor of my problems.
If ANYONE has any advice, please do tell. I'm really fuming over here since I was hoping to save some time, but clearly, I'm not (I wasted a good 6 hours doing a full routine debug, nothing, not even a new clean Shader code saved my problems) and I'm starting to get vexed. Ugh, should just have stuck with UDK...
Ah crap, how rude of me to ignore your post like that haiddasalami I'm soo sorry mate.
I actually have Ben's DVD's, just never got around to watching them...guess I should put that on my downtime list...bleh, who needs sleep anyways.
Question about RenderMonkey, is it more organized? I was taking a look at it, and the code segmentation was more organized then that of ComposerFX.
Thanks for the other two notes, I'll take a look in them ASAP.
EDIT: Ah crap, double post...this is not my day or week.
Curious! I will have a sniff around, but so many of those shaders shipping with max are not 100% functional, it somehow doesn't surprise me.
Feel free to email either of us any time with ShaderFX issues and we'll do our best to help you. And no, you aren't crazy. Autodesk broke the feature that allows shaders to render to an off-screen buffer in 3ds Max 2011. That feature is used by the glow shader featured in your screen shots, and it's also used by ShaderFX for the skin material and the glow material. Although it would appear that it works for some people and not other people as evidenced by Racer445's screen shots.
No problem mate, thanks in making me feel better that I wasn't going crazy, but this is irksome I must say, having plenty of shaders to analyze and look at the code as well use, but almost half of them don't work for me see whats going on or work correctly? It's very bothersome.
Racer, how did you do that? If I didn't know any better, I would say you're pulling off a nice prank, but since you're a nice fellow with mad SKillz, I must know what you did.
I tried everything, and the only thing I can think of is Scene Effect Loader and put on Glow/Halo/Star combo of Post-Process to get things working, but they clearly aren't correct and don't work right even so.
Could you upload a Max 2011 save file maybe so I can check the settings?
Although on reflection, the glow is bleeding badly in the environment and the self illumination isn't blending with blur correctly...huh...fancy my pickle urchin, maybe as mommy said, stick with Max 2009.
Wow, by the man himself, thanks for the feedback Ben, and you're right, I should have checked the last post on the forum before assuming you guys had closed down (how bloody stupid of me). Now, I can sleep happy knowing something as great as ShaderFX isn't dead, and will hopefully (once Autodesk gets their act together for Max) be a pipeline tool once again.
I have one question if you could spare a moment, could I in theory create a shader in ShaderFX and save it out to be used as a Post-Process in Max in the Scene Effects Loader? I think I could, in theory, create a Multi-Blur for Bloom like settings for Self-Illumination areas, but I'm not sure if ShaderFX is able to work fine with this.
Google search shows you guys talked about this possibility before version 2.0, but I can't find any documentation about it afterwards, I'm not asking your guys to do it or anything, mind you, just curious if it's already a possibility or you guys plan of putting it in.
As for the spammers, why don't you guys do like Pixologics forums or Blogs? Moderate the first couple of posts from a user and after that, allow the posting from that user normally, it will dramatically cut down on spammers (I know it helped me alot).
Thanks for all the feedback guys, much appreciated.
are you on ATI or NVIDIA? i'm on ATI (4870) right now and it seems just fine.
scene file: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1725586/crits/SoMuchBlased.max
Although now that you mention it, I'm on an nVidia, and all the ones in my Lab are nvidia too (360, 260 GT respectively).
Huh...well, I guess ATi got one lucky break this time, and that is the area of shaders.
Thanks for the tips about setting up our forum. We'll work on that. It's important to me to get it up and running again.
Also glad to hear ShaderFX is not dead. ShaderFX and especially Ben's DVD's have been invaluable to me for learning HLSL.
The only thing that even helps for 'self illuminated' slot in my models is when I enable AO + Soft Shadows, if I don't do that, my models won't even work with the self illuminate. My temporary fix is to use Star.fx Post Process, and maybe couple it with Xiouli's Post shaders too.
Other then that, it's funny...Shadows are helping me illuminate my model, how about that for Autodesk quality.
EDIT: Almost forgot, don't try mixing AO + Shadows with Post, they don't work.
Oh, yes, yes, YES! Thanks guys, much appreciated for all the love
PS: I signed up and validated my account, but I still cannot post nor create threads, is this normal? How long till you guys validate an account.