The Sandman is NOT throwable. You can hit a ball, but you can still use it as a melee weapon while the ball is gone. Throwing this bottle would leave you completely empty handed which isn't acceptable really. Melee weapons are necessary for when you're out of ammo and need to kill someone quickly in close range.
what if you also give the demo some kind of stick AND the molitov, or better yet have the molitov not be throwable...it would be like a gun with no bullets.
I don't like the Molotov.
It is too close to Pyro's fire characteristic, and it sounds too much like a grenade unlockable (which Valve have stated will never be available for any class but Demoman).
I'm aware of the fact that Valve likes to keep the burning to the pyro. That's why I mentioned that it would have to be lit by a pyro in order to throw, like the huntsman's flaming arrows.
It could still be used as a regular melee weapon if you choose to- the same as the regular bottle. However, a risk you could take would be to throw it, leaving yourself without melee for some time until it regenerates.
Does that make it seem more sensible? Or is it still too far out there?
Not sure, what you mentioned would make its uses as a grenade a lot more restricted and if it rewarded the Pyro an assist it might create a new Scout/Pyro relation.
However, it might still be too function based for Valve to like the idea.
Not sure if that was a typo (Scout/Pyro relationship) but this IS an unlock for Demo Melee. I kind of want it to be a melee weapon first, throwable second.
GAME MECHANICS ASIDE, I really like the concept painting - as long as you get some jiggle bones going for the cloth that's hanging out (and maybe the liquid inside?), I think it'll look great in game.
Not sure if that was a typo (Scout/Pyro relationship) but this IS an unlock for Demo Melee. I kind of want it to be a melee weapon first, throwable second.
Oh, yeah I got the item mixed up with another entry.
Someone made items for Scout where he had found things from his "grandpappy" and I got this mixed up with that... haha.
Yes, Pyro/Demo relationship.
A grenade unlock would then be more viable, but still I'm not so certain what Valve will think about allowing a melee to double as a grenade, and the whole "fire" thing :O
valve always makes sure everyone has a melee. Maybe when he throws it (you'll need some animations) he can take out a tiny 'nip' bottle of alcohol to 'hold him over' till the Molotov regens?
It would do something like 50% damage and be really tiny.
This contest is, 100%, an aesthetic change to existing models in TF2. This contest is not 'design a completely new weapon then do the artwork for it'. Let Valve figure out what they'll do with the functionality of your item, if any.
Please read the rules of the contest. I like your ideas but this contest is just not the way to go about them.
You really shouldn't even be bringing up stats at all here. This new weapon is almost entirely designed to be thrown as a projectile, thus seems somewhat pointless to attempt to enter with.
No matter if you had designed it to be melee first and throwable second, you're putting added functonality into your design that shouldn't even exist.
@Khthon that is a great idea. I will definitely be making another tiny bottle as well.
@Reaprar I realize that the contest is recommended to be purely aesthetic. However, I'm having a lot more fun thinking of what the weapons would actually do and trying to fit them into gameplay. The way I'm looking at it is, if I'm not eligible to win because my ideas have gameplay context, that's okay. I still got some good practice and feedback on my work
@Khthon that is a great idea. I will definitely be making another tiny bottle as well.
@Reaprar I realize that the contest is recommended to be purely aesthetic. However, I'm having a lot more fun thinking of what the weapons would actually do and trying to fit them into gameplay. The way I'm looking at it is, if I'm not eligible to win because my ideas have gameplay context, that's okay. I still got some good practice and feedback on my work
If you have the spare time, you could make backup weapons for each weapon you come up with a new functionality for.
So if you did this melee that is designed to be a grenade unlock, you could make another version of it that is designed to be just a melee and not a grenade.
That way you could present your idea for a weapon with a new function to Valve, but also have a backup without a function in case Valve doesn't like your function. Meaning that you have a backup to prevent your possible disqualification for not having enough acceptable entries.
Good idea, simski. If I have time before the end of the contest (which I SHOULD, it's a long contest!) then I'm going to either make backups, or custom animations. I do have some animating background, the challenge will come in finding how to get it from maya to engine :B
Hmmm... how is Demoman's drinking taunt going to work with the cloth there?
If this is not insanely lot of work...
Could you have the normal model + hitting be without the cork and the cloth...
Then 2 different animations, first when you click the secondary button you put the cloth and cork in, and when you press secondary again you throw it?
That would be a lot of work probably, but it would make his taunt make sense, and it would give it some additional disadvantage to make up for it being a melee and a grenade at the same time.
Plus, the cloth doesn't make that much sense in the case that Valve would decide they didn't want your function :O
Hmm, if I have time, and I figure out the custom animations, I may try to do that just for the added risk of using it as a projectile. I'm not too concerned with the taunt being realistic as we DO have demos drinking out of pain trains right now
I'm not too concerned with the taunt being realistic as we DO have demos drinking out of pain trains right now
True.
We have a Demoman drinking from a wooden stick and a broken bottle, a Heavy loudly exclaiming that his chocolate bar contains ham, and we have a Soldier banging his head with a railroad spike on a stick !!
if i may make a suggestion, i think you should rethink the functionallity
i doubt valve would want to like the loss of a melee weapon. and if they dont like one weapon the entire submission will be turned down
second, i dont see how this is back to basics.
and third, they just want redesigns of the original weapons, not new weapons all together.(less work for them)
again, dont scrap the weapon completely, just rethink the functionallity
@ChromeE: Honestly, I'm building them with functionality in mind because I'm having more fun with it that way :P I have tried to alter the way the weapon functions more towards something valve would actually implement (Using Khthon's idea of the 'emergency supply' so Demo is never without melee), but if I don't win the contest because of it, it's not the end of the world; I'm still getting a lot of valuable feedback on my work.
My idea behind it being back to basics is because it includes two of demo's favorite pastimes: explosions and alcohol. That, and it's also made from all home-made ingredients. Trying to stray away from the demoknight valve has been focusing on as of late.
@Viceroy Bubbles: My original idea was to make something like a flak-cannon, and those stats fit pretty perfectly with the idea. I was thinking it would fire some kind of slapped-together explosives that shoot shrapnel on impact
lol sounds dangerously awesome, although keep in mind that Valve decides the stats of the weapon. You can describe what it shoots and how, but they get the decides stats, I only added those to give you an idea of what it would be.
Going to design a new one for both The colors are very subject to change too, they're moreso in there just so i can tell whats what in the texture layout.
Replies
So it's a melee weapon? Your description says 'throwable'.
people were
It is too close to Pyro's fire characteristic, and it sounds too much like a grenade unlockable (which Valve have stated will never be available for any class but Demoman).
It could still be used as a regular melee weapon if you choose to- the same as the regular bottle. However, a risk you could take would be to throw it, leaving yourself without melee for some time until it regenerates.
Does that make it seem more sensible? Or is it still too far out there?
However, it might still be too function based for Valve to like the idea.
Oh, yeah I got the item mixed up with another entry.
Someone made items for Scout where he had found things from his "grandpappy" and I got this mixed up with that... haha.
Yes, Pyro/Demo relationship.
A grenade unlock would then be more viable, but still I'm not so certain what Valve will think about allowing a melee to double as a grenade, and the whole "fire" thing :O
It would do something like 50% damage and be really tiny.
You really shouldn't even be bringing up stats at all here. This new weapon is almost entirely designed to be thrown as a projectile, thus seems somewhat pointless to attempt to enter with.
No matter if you had designed it to be melee first and throwable second, you're putting added functonality into your design that shouldn't even exist.
@Reaprar I realize that the contest is recommended to be purely aesthetic. However, I'm having a lot more fun thinking of what the weapons would actually do and trying to fit them into gameplay. The way I'm looking at it is, if I'm not eligible to win because my ideas have gameplay context, that's okay. I still got some good practice and feedback on my work
If you have the spare time, you could make backup weapons for each weapon you come up with a new functionality for.
So if you did this melee that is designed to be a grenade unlock, you could make another version of it that is designed to be just a melee and not a grenade.
That way you could present your idea for a weapon with a new function to Valve, but also have a backup without a function in case Valve doesn't like your function. Meaning that you have a backup to prevent your possible disqualification for not having enough acceptable entries.
I also have an upside-down version with the cloth hanging the other way
Feedback on overall shape/silhouette appreciated.
If this is not insanely lot of work...
Could you have the normal model + hitting be without the cork and the cloth...
Then 2 different animations, first when you click the secondary button you put the cloth and cork in, and when you press secondary again you throw it?
That would be a lot of work probably, but it would make his taunt make sense, and it would give it some additional disadvantage to make up for it being a melee and a grenade at the same time.
Plus, the cloth doesn't make that much sense in the case that Valve would decide they didn't want your function :O
Mmh! hhhmhm mmnhm ggmhmmhm! >:C
Oi! Back off my Turf!
We have a Demoman drinking from a wooden stick and a broken bottle, a Heavy loudly exclaiming that his chocolate bar contains ham, and we have a Soldier banging his head with a railroad spike on a stick
Can't wait for some texturing or paint overs to check out.
i doubt valve would want to like the loss of a melee weapon. and if they dont like one weapon the entire submission will be turned down
second, i dont see how this is back to basics.
and third, they just want redesigns of the original weapons, not new weapons all together.(less work for them)
again, dont scrap the weapon completely, just rethink the functionallity
Pipebomb-launcher 2.0
+10% splash area
+20% damage
Explodes upon hitting the ground
-30% range
If you dont want to change the pipebomb then you could always make a hat. Like maybe a really big bomb with a hat ontop of it.
@ChromeE: Honestly, I'm building them with functionality in mind because I'm having more fun with it that way :P I have tried to alter the way the weapon functions more towards something valve would actually implement (Using Khthon's idea of the 'emergency supply' so Demo is never without melee), but if I don't win the contest because of it, it's not the end of the world; I'm still getting a lot of valuable feedback on my work.
My idea behind it being back to basics is because it includes two of demo's favorite pastimes: explosions and alcohol. That, and it's also made from all home-made ingredients. Trying to stray away from the demoknight valve has been focusing on as of late.
@Viceroy Bubbles: My original idea was to make something like a flak-cannon, and those stats fit pretty perfectly with the idea. I was thinking it would fire some kind of slapped-together explosives that shoot shrapnel on impact
Sorry for boring update, still just flat colors