These questions have been asked many many times before including myself, (Not that I'm in a better spot to be saying anything but its just my 2 cents.) its not about the diploma, it’s about the quality of ur work, just like what Leviathan said. So to answer ur questions, work on ur show reel cuz that’s what everyone will say pretty much.
Paperwork. Visa´s and immigration in general. While you can get in without them it´s a much slower process. (Depending on where you are from and where you are going).
For example america is pretty much "impossible" to get into without one while Canada is much much easier. It´s the government, Not the companies.
get the diploma, why not go for the best grades? it would look worse if you did shit on a terrible course rather than getting the full marks which are fairly easy to get.
After that work work work. I did a diploma and came out with ppm which isnt great but at least i got the diploma as a couple of my friends only got the certificate
get the diploma, why not go for the best grades? it would look worse if you did shit on a terrible course rather than getting the full marks which are fairly easy to get.
After that work work work. I did a diploma and came out with ppm which isnt great but at least i got the diploma as a couple of my friends only got the certificate
waste of time..if he plans on staying in australia, then diploma means nothing really.
X years for a diploma and then X years to work on your portfolio or Just portfolio?
Seems pretty simple choice to me.
And if you change your mind about staying in australia in the future, i think 5 years experience in the industry equals degree/diploma for imigration, so even then your good and have a headstart on everyone else who did a shitty course and got diploma in "digital animation" and spent the rest of their times out drinking and wasting time..
I really appreciate all your input guys so thanks. Doing the full time will leave me with very little outside time - as I've spoken with previous graduates.
My parents are just big believer's in the piece of paper is the most important thing. So (although I'm fully independent) it is difficult without their full support. However, everyone else that's around me says go for the portfolio, even my course coordinator.
I take it some of you are in the industry now and can say this from experience?
And so general verdict is to go for the portfolio...! ?
Edit: I think worse case scenario, I spend the whole year doing a portfolio, I don't get a job, I can always finish off the topics the following year (although being incredibly miserable ). So it's still inevitably taking two years. Your thoughts?
You have a year left, may aswell finish mate tbh.
Experiance always outweighs the piece o paper, but most countrys are looking into a points based immigration policy so it does help.
Also my uni course was extremely poor, i learnt everything myself and im pretty much the only person i know to actually get a job lol, but itl prove its worth later on ;D
Just dont become ignorant, that was the biggest killer on my course i was surrounded by idiots.
work as hard for ur diploma as you can. whilst yes, it is absolutely true that its more about the quality of ur work, a diploma can't hurt, and its a great thing to have. simply so you can have a bit more free time to work on ur protfolio work is not a good enough excuse, as once you're done with your diploma, you can take a few months to really work flat out on your portfolio un-interupted, and then start applying to companies.
so basically, your options are:
work hard and get your diploma, you may have to do a few more months work at the end of it to get a job, but you'll probably be glad you did, it will certainly help getting a job, and perhaps get a different job if you eventually feel game art isn't for u
don't work too hard for your diploma, and get a few more months of portfolio work. you likely won't accomplish all that much in this time, and you'll kinda have wasted a few years of your life and a lot of money working to get a second rate diploma
also, try and gear your class work towards your portfolio in any way you can. thats kinda what i did, and ended up with nearly all my portfolio made from post uni work
work as hard for ur diploma as you can. whilst yes, it is absolutely true that its more about the quality of ur work, a diploma can't hurt, and its a great thing to have. simply so you can have a bit more free time to work on ur protfolio work is not a good enough excuse, as once you're done with your diploma, you can take a few months to really work flat out on your portfolio un-interupted, and then start applying to companies.
so basically, your options are:
work hard and get your diploma, you may have to do a few more months work at the end of it to get a job, but you'll probably be glad you did, it will certainly help getting a job, and perhaps get a different job if you eventually feel game art isn't for u
don't work too hard for your diploma, and get a few more months of portfolio work. you likely won't accomplish all that much in this time, and you'll kinda have wasted a few years of your life and a lot of money working to get a second rate diploma
I'm agree, these simple words " NAH you don't need be graduated" bullshit
When you are fucked(life) with no work with no hope...they change the words for " job hum....do you graduated? "
Think about it !
Get your " paper" and do your folio and RUN for jobs that's important
if you plan on going to the US for a job then you need something like 3 years of experience PER 1 year of college... lol considering that in games you learn more after 1 month of working on the job than you did probably in the whole 4 years of school this is kind of a terrible policy, but whatever thats the rule. So basically in order to qualify you need either a 4 year degree or 12 years of industry experience, of you have to be reallllllly good and be published in tons of books and be able to show that you're like one of the top people in your field.
now if you never plan on ever going to the US to work... then it doesn't matter, seriously no company has ever asked me to provide any sort of credentials besides portfolio and resume with previous work experience.
Now advice would be... if you're already invested into it then go ahead and finish, but don't wait to graduate before you start applying places... find companies in your area and see if they'll even look at you.
Situations change, some new tool may come out in 5 years that makes current game artists obsolete. You may really wish you had that diploma in some point in your life. Or maybe you don't, and by focusing on it you weaken your portfolio and it haunts you for the rest of your life.
Who knows? I think at some point you gotta do what you think is right, no one can decide for you. If one were truly a better option than the other it would be easy. Sometimes you just gotta roll the bones.
As someone who has lived in 4 countries and been plagued by visa and work permit issues I definately think you
should suck it up and get the full diploma. I am a PC tech, not your run of the mill school grad or manual
basher, with 10 years of experience in my field, I have owned 3 successful companies and done work for the UN,
various governments and even an oil company and none of that helped in the least getting visas and permits to work
in other countries. All they want are fucking diplomas, they don't care that the stupid thing has no practical use
or that you got it for studying outdated material under crappy teachers.
I thought much as you are now when I was finishing my education and opted for more work experience over a
diploma and I really regret it now, I never thought I would leave the country but I was wrong. Its always better
to be prepaired. Tell your folks that you will do the full diploma but they will need to support you for a while when
its done so you can get a good folio up.
... So basically in order to qualify you need either a 4 year degree or 12 years of industry experience ...
To clarify this can be a patchy mix of formal education and work experience, they add everything up to make the equivalent of a degree. So it can be an unfinished double degree, a two year diploma, and a few years experience.
Maybe post some of your work too, this will give an indication as to what you should be focusing on etc.. sure you have learnt all you can from the course and done some self-teaching, but is this enough?
My general advice would be to study for the full duration of the course. I have had to deal with some E3 visa difficulties for the US and a solid degree would have been advantageous.
My other broad advice is to be prepared to want to move overseas when you are in the industry. Itchy feet can come on pretty quick, and if the Aussie industry takes a big dive and you're without qualifications, you'll be kickin yourself.
I hate Visas, and the word " Eligible" has been hunting me for weeks now.
From what i understand to enter the US,
you need a 4 year degree, but this has to be a bachelor or master (or its becoming alot harder).
or, you need 5 years of work exp in the direction you are applying for.
Anyway,
im going to enter that yearly give away visa system, that way you dont get into crisis mode when your job leaves you and you must go through the whole procedure again to optain a work permit.
Just finish what you started man, i did the same, i cursed every day but once you get it you can only benefit from that piece of paper.
Kinda off-topic a little, but my wife's American and even for us the immigration process was a nightmare, and it's not over yet since we're hopefully moving back there within the next year.
Just because we neglected to apply for a re-entry clearance when we left the States to move here when my Mom got sick (my green card was still being processed), I couldn't even visit friends back Stateside without applying for a visitor's visa, and even got marched back onto the first flight to London from Minneapolis after a ten-hour flight and a five-hour interview by Homeland Security when I last tried to visit since I didn't know I needed a visitor visa at the time. I had to call my buddies in Boston and tell them I wasn't clearing security from the 'interview room'.
Conversely, when she moved here, my wife didn't even need to attend an interview with the Home Office, only filled out a single short application form for permanent residency, and they barely checked her passport at Heathrow.
Wow I really appreciate the constant input from you guys. You've really hit home to me.
I've opted to do the diploma, so I NEVER have any regrets about not doing it. I can always spend the following year tightening my portfolio, and I won't have that constant annoyance in the back of my head saying "you should have just finished it!".
Although as some of you have stated, companies are most concerned about the portfolio, the diploma will be a safety net in case, yes I do decide to go international, or a job listing may indeed require a qualification.
There is apparently some relatively easy to acquire work visa that was set up between Australia and the US a while back because of the Iraq war. I'm not sure of the specific details but I believe it's less stringent on the education aspect.
In your case though, Snow, you're probably best to try to nab all the qualifications you can so that when the local industry entirely ceases to exist (which at the rate we're going may not be far off), you'll be able to skip off to Yankee land.
There is apparently some relatively easy to acquire work visa that was set up between Australia and the US a while back because of the Iraq war...
This is the E3 visa I was talking about. With a two year diploma, it is possible to get it after 6 years experience. With a 3 yr degree, 3 years experience is required. To me, it's only relatively easy to acquire because of the large numbers of available to Australians, not because of the low education requirements.
snow, good decision. Why not, what's a year or so when you're (presumably) young anyways?!
Replies
So to answer ur questions, work on ur show reel cuz that’s what everyone will say pretty much.
Welcome to Polycount!
No.
Long answer is:
Possibly, but if you want to move to different country its a must.
(Well as long as you stay here)
How come it's a must for a career internationally?
For example america is pretty much "impossible" to get into without one while Canada is much much easier. It´s the government, Not the companies.
After that work work work. I did a diploma and came out with ppm which isnt great but at least i got the diploma as a couple of my friends only got the certificate
waste of time..if he plans on staying in australia, then diploma means nothing really.
X years for a diploma and then X years to work on your portfolio or Just portfolio?
Seems pretty simple choice to me.
And if you change your mind about staying in australia in the future, i think 5 years experience in the industry equals degree/diploma for imigration, so even then your good and have a headstart on everyone else who did a shitty course and got diploma in "digital animation" and spent the rest of their times out drinking and wasting time..
My parents are just big believer's in the piece of paper is the most important thing. So (although I'm fully independent) it is difficult without their full support. However, everyone else that's around me says go for the portfolio, even my course coordinator.
I take it some of you are in the industry now and can say this from experience?
And so general verdict is to go for the portfolio...! ?
Edit: I think worse case scenario, I spend the whole year doing a portfolio, I don't get a job, I can always finish off the topics the following year (although being incredibly miserable
Experiance always outweighs the piece o paper, but most countrys are looking into a points based immigration policy so it does help.
Also my uni course was extremely poor, i learnt everything myself and im pretty much the only person i know to actually get a job lol, but itl prove its worth later on ;D
Just dont become ignorant, that was the biggest killer on my course i was surrounded by idiots.
so basically, your options are:
work hard and get your diploma, you may have to do a few more months work at the end of it to get a job, but you'll probably be glad you did, it will certainly help getting a job, and perhaps get a different job if you eventually feel game art isn't for u
don't work too hard for your diploma, and get a few more months of portfolio work. you likely won't accomplish all that much in this time, and you'll kinda have wasted a few years of your life and a lot of money working to get a second rate diploma
I'm agree, these simple words " NAH you don't need be graduated" bullshit
When you are fucked(life) with no work with no hope...they change the words for " job hum....do you graduated? "
Think about it !
Get your " paper" and do your folio and RUN for jobs that's important
now if you never plan on ever going to the US to work... then it doesn't matter, seriously no company has ever asked me to provide any sort of credentials besides portfolio and resume with previous work experience.
Now advice would be... if you're already invested into it then go ahead and finish, but don't wait to graduate before you start applying places... find companies in your area and see if they'll even look at you.
Who knows? I think at some point you gotta do what you think is right, no one can decide for you. If one were truly a better option than the other it would be easy. Sometimes you just gotta roll the bones.
should suck it up and get the full diploma. I am a PC tech, not your run of the mill school grad or manual
basher, with 10 years of experience in my field, I have owned 3 successful companies and done work for the UN,
various governments and even an oil company and none of that helped in the least getting visas and permits to work
in other countries. All they want are fucking diplomas, they don't care that the stupid thing has no practical use
or that you got it for studying outdated material under crappy teachers.
I thought much as you are now when I was finishing my education and opted for more work experience over a
diploma and I really regret it now, I never thought I would leave the country but I was wrong. Its always better
to be prepaired. Tell your folks that you will do the full diploma but they will need to support you for a while when
its done so you can get a good folio up.
To clarify this can be a patchy mix of formal education and work experience, they add everything up to make the equivalent of a degree. So it can be an unfinished double degree, a two year diploma, and a few years experience.
Maybe post some of your work too, this will give an indication as to what you should be focusing on etc.. sure you have learnt all you can from the course and done some self-teaching, but is this enough?
My general advice would be to study for the full duration of the course. I have had to deal with some E3 visa difficulties for the US and a solid degree would have been advantageous.
My other broad advice is to be prepared to want to move overseas when you are in the industry. Itchy feet can come on pretty quick, and if the Aussie industry takes a big dive and you're without qualifications, you'll be kickin yourself.
From what i understand to enter the US,
you need a 4 year degree, but this has to be a bachelor or master (or its becoming alot harder).
or, you need 5 years of work exp in the direction you are applying for.
Anyway,
im going to enter that yearly give away visa system, that way you dont get into crisis mode when your job leaves you and you must go through the whole procedure again to optain a work permit.
Just finish what you started man, i did the same, i cursed every day but once you get it you can only benefit from that piece of paper.
Just because we neglected to apply for a re-entry clearance when we left the States to move here when my Mom got sick (my green card was still being processed), I couldn't even visit friends back Stateside without applying for a visitor's visa, and even got marched back onto the first flight to London from Minneapolis after a ten-hour flight and a five-hour interview by Homeland Security when I last tried to visit since I didn't know I needed a visitor visa at the time. I had to call my buddies in Boston and tell them I wasn't clearing security from the 'interview room'.
Conversely, when she moved here, my wife didn't even need to attend an interview with the Home Office, only filled out a single short application form for permanent residency, and they barely checked her passport at Heathrow.
I've opted to do the diploma, so I NEVER have any regrets about not doing it. I can always spend the following year tightening my portfolio, and I won't have that constant annoyance in the back of my head saying "you should have just finished it!".
Although as some of you have stated, companies are most concerned about the portfolio, the diploma will be a safety net in case, yes I do decide to go international, or a job listing may indeed require a qualification.
In your case though, Snow, you're probably best to try to nab all the qualifications you can so that when the local industry entirely ceases to exist (which at the rate we're going may not be far off), you'll be able to skip off to Yankee land.
This is the E3 visa I was talking about. With a two year diploma, it is possible to get it after 6 years experience. With a 3 yr degree, 3 years experience is required. To me, it's only relatively easy to acquire because of the large numbers of available to Australians, not because of the low education requirements.
snow, good decision. Why not, what's a year or so when you're (presumably) young anyways?!
and yes i'm 20, so I guess that's still sorta young!