Well, that hasn't happened yet. I'm not sure Bioware even want us to be Bioware East, even though I wouldn't mind it. I think this is more of a promotion for Dr. Ray than anything else. Everyone here I've talked to is happy that our studio is reporting to him instead of directly to Frank Gibeau. Not that there's anything wrong with Frank, I don't know much about him, but we have a lot of respect for Ray and Greg. So. . . yeah, we're all pretty happy about the Bioware thing.
hahaha, why's that? care to back up that argument?
i have a negative opinion of a man who over promised and under-delivered. where's the problem with that? i have a negative opinion of a studio who was literally sitting on a pot of gold, and actually managed to turn it in the opposite direction.
i can appreciate that you may want to defend yourself, your studio, your colleagues. but there's a line between being defensive, and being naive.
i'm all out of hatred for WAR and it's developers. there was a time when i was dropping helpful suggestions, and they were ignored. then i tried being a bit less subtle in my approach, and i was called a bitch.
my passion for your studios products, has vanished. and i'm among hundreds of thousands in that opinion.
so, thanks for telling me i suck. but at least i have a job that's guaranteed to last longer than your declining subscription base
edit: and just to let you know, my original post was out of curiosity, and more concern than anything else. i don't want bioware to suffer from your bad reputation.
hahaha, why's that? care to back up that argument?
I would stop and strongly evaluate what I held in my hands if I where you. You ground your axe down to a toothpick and its no where near battle worthy.
I also think you picked the wrong place to pick a fight. I'm sure there are some gamerz forums somewhere that would love to have another flaming smacktard... I really hope you don't go down that road but its up to you.
the hard part is we always have to er on the side of caution about what we talk about - anyone who works in the game industry is familiar with all the secrecy etc.
All the EA press releases give me the impression that they are very happy with WAR - maybe they're lying but they've also eaten humble pie with "we learned a good lesson with the way we handled game x" kind of articles so I tend to believe them.
look, i'm not one to shy away from admitting i'm wrong.
the problem is, nobody has ever done anything to prove me wrong, they've just SAID i'm wrong. give me some actual evidence that you're working on the issues, and i'll be the first one to say "sorry guys, i'm a twat". but right now, it feels like i wasted my money on an unfinished game. and that i was promised things that were never delivered.
if you guys want to publically come out and say "GOA are doing a shitty job" then just fucking do it. because all we get from GOA is "we do what mythic tell us to do". so which of you is lying? the game creators, who CHOSE to use a contract company to host the euro launch, or that contract company?
yeah, ok, i'm sorry for "hating" on you, i don't think i have in honesty. and like i said, i tried giving honest, impartial advice about changes that NEED to be made. and being that you're on the dev team, you would actually be the right people to talk to about it. regardless of whether you're in the art department, you can still walk right up to the people who make those changes and say "hey, this is a good idea, why don't we try it?".
i love the fact that you guys are willing to talk about how bad some games are, but as soon as it comes to your own, you get your backs right up to the wall. learn to take the good with the bad. i was over the moon when i heard Bioware would have some input into WAR, let's hope they turn you around. right now you're under 300k subs, if you want them to go up, stop calling ME an asshole, and start listening to peoples suggestions.
like: DON'T RELEASE LOTD, and DO MAKE THE C+C CHANGES FIRST.
anyone can read your US forums, and read that the complaints there are exactly the same as the ones on the euro forum. you have the same bugs, the same flawed game design, the same shitty endgame content, and the same new expansion which does nothing but further break the T4 campaign.
now, how about this, i won't talk to you guys about WAR ever again. you can go and sit in your studio, and marvel at how you managed to make something so good into something so bad. and all because the wrong people made the wrong decisions for you. but you were too blind, or too stubborn to see it.
i love you all, you're fantastic artists, but you need to look at your product from the outside.
Is it just me or does that read like a teenage girl who just meet up with her friends at the mall after getting her license.
You know that kind of high pitched sequel of words that blends into indistinguishable white noise as they bounce around in a circle. The only thing that can stop them is when one of their purse pooches bursts an ear drum or wets itself.
I'll attempt to translate:
"I'm hounding artists as if they where my own personal GM."
"I know no one cares to read it or can do anything about it"
"I'm making myself look like a frothing MMO fanboi and don't care"
"I hate this game so much, but I still play it."
Working as an artist on an MMO I have to say, it's not nearly as cut and dry as you are making it sound Gir. It's wrong of you to assume these guys have done nothing to listen to their community or get changes made. At the end of the day, THEY aren't the ones in charge and you have no idea what actions they may or may not have taken throughout development. And they aren't at liberty to talk about it.
Just because you have the ability to go complain and make noise about problems doesn't mean that it's your fault if those problems aren't fixed....and while you didn't say it was their fault, you do seem to be attacking them as such.
I'm a lead on an MMO, I read our beta forums daily, I take beta feedback very seriously, and I would say It's pretty rare that I get to take feedback and get something done about it directly or immediately. And I work for a company that is KNOWN for listening to its players very closely, one of the best I think.
Call it production, call it bureaucracy, call it not-fully-informed beta testers, call it whatever you like, changing the gameplan mid-development is never easy and way harder than you are making it sound....and lots of people just don't realize this.
Hey, we just make the art. We also don't see the game the same way that normal subscribers do. Most of the things I see are nit-picky art related things that I may/may not be in a position to fix.
If you're having a problem in the game, or see something is broken, etc BUG REPORT it. We aren't your personal QA team, and it'd be unfair to everyone else to do so.
Sucks that you are having so many issues with the game. I just don't have any way of doing anything about it.
I think what almighty_gir is trying to say is that the art in WAR is so awesomely geniusly good, that it makes the gameplay look pissy bad in comparison. Well all right, I don't think that's his point, but let's keep it at that anyway.
this may have been wishful thinking on my part, but when i first read the news about this merge the first thing that popped into my mind were the blissful thoughts of a war 40k game done in a similar style to mass effect, where maybe you start as a fresh young 9 ft marine monster, then get to choose a squad maybe, like black templers or blood angels or dark angels or space wolves or something, then type like assault or devastator or librarian, and then get a sweet ass story and the chance to defect and hit up the void from some chaos fun or something. not gonna lie, I just sat there geekin out in my head for a while lol
regardless, hope it all works out for you guys that are part of it.
actually, i've got no problems with the artwork in the game, i've said that before.
stupid thing is, this all started because someone said i "officially suck", after posting my opinion of someone, based on my personal experiance with that person.
if you guys are so against people having opinions of each other, i suggest you look at the michael jackson thread, and then learn to shut the fuck up.
my point still stands. everyone here loves to rag on other people. but when it happens to them they cry like babies.
stupid thing is, nobody's actually answered my second question. what kind of role will BioWare play in the future of Mythic?
I for one think xenobond and justin meisse (doc_rob and Matabus can stay behind if they want) should march to EA's headquarters and demand you an answer.
You can see that bioware and mythic are under the eagames label (we definitely don't fit under easports or eaplay). But since the rpg/mmo genre is such a big step from the more standard games (mostly in terms of how revenue is generated) both studios are making a sub-label under eagames (something like that). That's what I made out of the information published about this group. Makes sense to me.
You should be more concerned on how badly zenimax is going to screw with id. They're going to make doom 4 take place in the past with knights and cyclorpses.
stupid thing is, nobody's actually answered my second question. what kind of role will BioWare play in the future of Mythic?
I did. Rob now reports to Ray instead of directly to Frank. This is a promotion for Dr Ray. All of us at Mythic are happy to receive whatever help Bioware will offer and do whatever we can in return because we have great respect and admiration for Bioware. That's the extent of it right now because the deal just happened this week.
I'm still not sure what to think about the merger. Perhaps EA corporate likes how Ray & Greg run things... definitely can't deny our track record, and our performance at E3 this year was astounding.
Maybe it means Warhammer is going to get some lightsabers? :P
You can see that bioware and mythic are under the eagames label (we definitely don't fit under easports or eaplay). But since the rpg/mmo genre is such a big step from the more standard games (mostly in terms of how revenue is generated) both studios are making a sub-label under eagames (something like that). That's what I made out of the information published about this group. Makes sense to me.
You should be more concerned on how badly zenimax is going to screw with id. They're going to make doom 4 take place in the past with knights and cyclorpses.
haha, yeah it's slightly worrying. but at least it won't look like it was designed by matel.
i think i understand about the ea labels thing. seems like a pretty complicated way of doing things though. i guess they're trying to consolidate their financial losses?
sorry for being such an ass. and yes, i know there's nothing you can do directly about it. but the only dev studio i ever worked in, the art guys (me and 3 others) were able to walk into the programmers lounge (yes, they had a fucking lounge) and ask them to do this, or that, or make suggestions. i guess it's different in the big leagues. but that was my impression.
(edit: that's the only studio i've worked in btw. just to clarify things.)
and it stemmed from wanting to see the game succeed in all areas, not just the art side of it.
ps. still waiting for teclis, and the other high elf (and some of the dwarf) heroes to have their own models :P
haha, yeah it's slightly worrying. but at least it won't look like it was designed by matel.
i think i understand about the ea labels thing. seems like a pretty complicated way of doing things though. i guess they're trying to consolidate their financial losses?
sorry for being such an ass. and yes, i know there's nothing you can do directly about it. but the only dev studio i ever worked in, the art guys (me and 3 others) were able to walk into the programmers lounge (yes, they had a fucking lounge) and ask them to do this, or that, or make suggestions. i guess it's different in the big leagues. but that was my impression.
(edit: that's the only studio i've worked in btw. just to clarify things.)
and it stemmed from wanting to see the game succeed in all areas, not just the art side of it.
ps. still waiting for teclis, and the other high elf (and some of the dwarf) heroes to have their own models :P
thats pretty much how i've done it with the team i've worked with.
we got an official bug reporting system, and in addition, i can make requests to fix certain things.
problem is, over here in the EU, our bug report system goes to GOA, who couldn't give a rats ass. we get blanket responses of "it's working as intended", or "you'll get an update one day, and no, we won't refund you the item(s) you lost".
if a mythic employee would post on the euro forum just to say "hey, we really do read these forums too", that would go a LONG way.
the reason why i talk to you guys about it, is because you work in the same building as the people responsable. you have direct contact. it's like... when i used to work in retail, i'd have plenty of people who knew me, and would ask me for advice on this, or that product, occasionally asking if i could get discount on it.
i have no problem giving advice, and no problem with the discount side either, but i'd rather offer the discount than be asked for it. so yeah, i guess i just thought "i know those guys, so i'll pick their brains". i'm sure it's something you're all guilty of in one area of your life or another.
i guess i just thought "i know those guys, so i'll pick their brains". i'm sure it's something you're all guilty of in one area of your life or another.
no what you thought was "i know those guys so i'll throw a shitstorm of insults at every thread even related to WAR untill everyone thinks i'm a giant dickface"
no what you thought was "i know those guys so i'll throw a shitstorm of insults at every thread even related to WAR untill everyone thinks i'm a giant dickface"
thanks for that. but no.
why would someone WANT people to think they're a giant dickface? that's just stupid. i meant what i said, it's my experience that people tend to go to people who're in a position to get things sorted when they have an issue.
you know someone who works in a phone shop, you talk to them about a phone you need help with.
you know someone who works in a tv shop, you ask them for advice on getting the best from your tv.
you buy a product from someone, and then it goes tits up, you go back in and complain.
i'm so so sorry mythic don't have a retail outlet, but hey, they do have employees, and i can talk to them. so why not? the quickest way to your target is through the fewest people.
now, i said i wouldn't bitch about it, and i've held true to that, so, unless you want to instigate, and become a cock yourself, just leave alone yeah?
Despite the popular belief that money makes the world go round, its actually respect.
Considering you failed to provide either its no small wonder you're in the position you're in.
You might want to rethink you're approach when trying to get a personal favor from someone.
But maybe your approach works and it just failed in this one bazaar case? I should test it out. I should sling insults at anyone walking past my cube and then try and hold them accountable for things like global warming. Yea I bet I get a ton of things done and everyone will love me!
If it works I'll write a book, "How to Get Things Done Using Insults and Temper Tantrums!"
See I believe in money, power and respect
First you the money
Then you get the motherf--kin' power
And after you get the f--kin' power
You get the f--kin' ni--az to respect you
Replies
Just to make sure there is a distinction between what happened today (been going on) and what could be considered 'merger'.
second question:
how does this affect Mythic? are they under Bioware supervision now? do Bioware get some measure of control over WAR etc?
Good lord, you are such a hater.
EA: "If you won't be EA Mythic you'll be Bioware Fairfax!" /Lightening crash/
don't confuse hatred with pity dude.
Pity? Okay. You suck officially now.
hahaha, why's that? care to back up that argument?
i have a negative opinion of a man who over promised and under-delivered. where's the problem with that? i have a negative opinion of a studio who was literally sitting on a pot of gold, and actually managed to turn it in the opposite direction.
i can appreciate that you may want to defend yourself, your studio, your colleagues. but there's a line between being defensive, and being naive.
i'm all out of hatred for WAR and it's developers. there was a time when i was dropping helpful suggestions, and they were ignored. then i tried being a bit less subtle in my approach, and i was called a bitch.
my passion for your studios products, has vanished. and i'm among hundreds of thousands in that opinion.
so, thanks for telling me i suck. but at least i have a job that's guaranteed to last longer than your declining subscription base
edit: and just to let you know, my original post was out of curiosity, and more concern than anything else. i don't want bioware to suffer from your bad reputation.
Now? no, I'm pretty sure we hit that mark quite a while ago.
I also think you picked the wrong place to pick a fight. I'm sure there are some gamerz forums somewhere that would love to have another flaming smacktard... I really hope you don't go down that road but its up to you.
All the EA press releases give me the impression that they are very happy with WAR - maybe they're lying but they've also eaten humble pie with "we learned a good lesson with the way we handled game x" kind of articles so I tend to believe them.
the problem is, nobody has ever done anything to prove me wrong, they've just SAID i'm wrong. give me some actual evidence that you're working on the issues, and i'll be the first one to say "sorry guys, i'm a twat". but right now, it feels like i wasted my money on an unfinished game. and that i was promised things that were never delivered.
if you guys want to publically come out and say "GOA are doing a shitty job" then just fucking do it. because all we get from GOA is "we do what mythic tell us to do". so which of you is lying? the game creators, who CHOSE to use a contract company to host the euro launch, or that contract company?
yeah, ok, i'm sorry for "hating" on you, i don't think i have in honesty. and like i said, i tried giving honest, impartial advice about changes that NEED to be made. and being that you're on the dev team, you would actually be the right people to talk to about it. regardless of whether you're in the art department, you can still walk right up to the people who make those changes and say "hey, this is a good idea, why don't we try it?".
i love the fact that you guys are willing to talk about how bad some games are, but as soon as it comes to your own, you get your backs right up to the wall. learn to take the good with the bad. i was over the moon when i heard Bioware would have some input into WAR, let's hope they turn you around. right now you're under 300k subs, if you want them to go up, stop calling ME an asshole, and start listening to peoples suggestions.
like: DON'T RELEASE LOTD, and DO MAKE THE C+C CHANGES FIRST.
anyone can read your US forums, and read that the complaints there are exactly the same as the ones on the euro forum. you have the same bugs, the same flawed game design, the same shitty endgame content, and the same new expansion which does nothing but further break the T4 campaign.
now, how about this, i won't talk to you guys about WAR ever again. you can go and sit in your studio, and marvel at how you managed to make something so good into something so bad. and all because the wrong people made the wrong decisions for you. but you were too blind, or too stubborn to see it.
i love you all, you're fantastic artists, but you need to look at your product from the outside.
You know that kind of high pitched sequel of words that blends into indistinguishable white noise as they bounce around in a circle. The only thing that can stop them is when one of their purse pooches bursts an ear drum or wets itself.
I'll attempt to translate:
"I'm hounding artists as if they where my own personal GM."
"I know no one cares to read it or can do anything about it"
"I'm making myself look like a frothing MMO fanboi and don't care"
"I hate this game so much, but I still play it."
Just because you have the ability to go complain and make noise about problems doesn't mean that it's your fault if those problems aren't fixed....and while you didn't say it was their fault, you do seem to be attacking them as such.
I'm a lead on an MMO, I read our beta forums daily, I take beta feedback very seriously, and I would say It's pretty rare that I get to take feedback and get something done about it directly or immediately. And I work for a company that is KNOWN for listening to its players very closely, one of the best I think.
Call it production, call it bureaucracy, call it not-fully-informed beta testers, call it whatever you like, changing the gameplan mid-development is never easy and way harder than you are making it sound....and lots of people just don't realize this.
If you're having a problem in the game, or see something is broken, etc BUG REPORT it. We aren't your personal QA team, and it'd be unfair to everyone else to do so.
Sucks that you are having so many issues with the game. I just don't have any way of doing anything about it.
regardless, hope it all works out for you guys that are part of it.
stupid thing is, this all started because someone said i "officially suck", after posting my opinion of someone, based on my personal experiance with that person.
if you guys are so against people having opinions of each other, i suggest you look at the michael jackson thread, and then learn to shut the fuck up.
my point still stands. everyone here loves to rag on other people. but when it happens to them they cry like babies.
stupid thing is, nobody's actually answered my second question. what kind of role will BioWare play in the future of Mythic?
I for one think xenobond and justin meisse (doc_rob and Matabus can stay behind if they want) should march to EA's headquarters and demand you an answer.
http://aboutus.ea.com/companylabels.action
You can see that bioware and mythic are under the eagames label (we definitely don't fit under easports or eaplay). But since the rpg/mmo genre is such a big step from the more standard games (mostly in terms of how revenue is generated) both studios are making a sub-label under eagames (something like that). That's what I made out of the information published about this group. Makes sense to me.
You should be more concerned on how badly zenimax is going to screw with id. They're going to make doom 4 take place in the past with knights and cyclorpses.
dude, you were, and continue to act like an ass. Just chill the fuck out, ok?
I did. Rob now reports to Ray instead of directly to Frank. This is a promotion for Dr Ray. All of us at Mythic are happy to receive whatever help Bioware will offer and do whatever we can in return because we have great respect and admiration for Bioware. That's the extent of it right now because the deal just happened this week.
I hopes dis is a promises!
P.S. Hope you working fools don`t get screwed in the shennanigans.
Pieces
i just downloaded it played 2 levels really love the art!
Maybe it means Warhammer is going to get some lightsabers? :P
haha, yeah it's slightly worrying. but at least it won't look like it was designed by matel.
i think i understand about the ea labels thing. seems like a pretty complicated way of doing things though. i guess they're trying to consolidate their financial losses?
sorry for being such an ass. and yes, i know there's nothing you can do directly about it. but the only dev studio i ever worked in, the art guys (me and 3 others) were able to walk into the programmers lounge (yes, they had a fucking lounge) and ask them to do this, or that, or make suggestions. i guess it's different in the big leagues. but that was my impression.
(edit: that's the only studio i've worked in btw. just to clarify things.)
and it stemmed from wanting to see the game succeed in all areas, not just the art side of it.
ps. still waiting for teclis, and the other high elf (and some of the dwarf) heroes to have their own models :P
thats pretty much how i've done it with the team i've worked with.
we got an official bug reporting system, and in addition, i can make requests to fix certain things.
if a mythic employee would post on the euro forum just to say "hey, we really do read these forums too", that would go a LONG way.
the reason why i talk to you guys about it, is because you work in the same building as the people responsable. you have direct contact. it's like... when i used to work in retail, i'd have plenty of people who knew me, and would ask me for advice on this, or that product, occasionally asking if i could get discount on it.
i have no problem giving advice, and no problem with the discount side either, but i'd rather offer the discount than be asked for it. so yeah, i guess i just thought "i know those guys, so i'll pick their brains". i'm sure it's something you're all guilty of in one area of your life or another.
no what you thought was "i know those guys so i'll throw a shitstorm of insults at every thread even related to WAR untill everyone thinks i'm a giant dickface"
thanks for that. but no.
why would someone WANT people to think they're a giant dickface? that's just stupid. i meant what i said, it's my experience that people tend to go to people who're in a position to get things sorted when they have an issue.
you know someone who works in a phone shop, you talk to them about a phone you need help with.
you know someone who works in a tv shop, you ask them for advice on getting the best from your tv.
you buy a product from someone, and then it goes tits up, you go back in and complain.
i'm so so sorry mythic don't have a retail outlet, but hey, they do have employees, and i can talk to them. so why not? the quickest way to your target is through the fewest people.
now, i said i wouldn't bitch about it, and i've held true to that, so, unless you want to instigate, and become a cock yourself, just leave alone yeah?
Considering you failed to provide either its no small wonder you're in the position you're in.
You might want to rethink you're approach when trying to get a personal favor from someone.
But maybe your approach works and it just failed in this one bazaar case? I should test it out. I should sling insults at anyone walking past my cube and then try and hold them accountable for things like global warming. Yea I bet I get a ton of things done and everyone will love me!
If it works I'll write a book, "How to Get Things Done Using Insults and Temper Tantrums!"
it's really, really serious that these changes get made right now.
First you the money
Then you get the motherf--kin' power
And after you get the f--kin' power
You get the f--kin' ni--az to respect you
REALIZE
MONEY POWER RESPECT