DWIV - 3D - MEZZ
polycounter lvl 8
Alright, Dominance War 4, I'm ready to go! 
I plan on whipping out some pencil and paper (you head me, 2-D style!) And get on some basic concepts/sketches/thumbs/etc.
So many characters and classes to choose from, but for the war, I think I'll play to my strengths. That being... humanoid females :P
I know stretching my skills and trying new things and all that would push me further as an artist and all that good stuff, but for such an overwhelming project... I'm going with what I know :P
Art to come!!
I plan on whipping out some pencil and paper (you head me, 2-D style!) And get on some basic concepts/sketches/thumbs/etc.
So many characters and classes to choose from, but for the war, I think I'll play to my strengths. That being... humanoid females :P
I know stretching my skills and trying new things and all that would push me further as an artist and all that good stuff, but for such an overwhelming project... I'm going with what I know :P
Art to come!!
Replies
I haven't quite decided if I wanna go with Norms or Demons yet. Machines are out cause I don't like working with tech stuff very much :P
As I said in my post, I'm basically sticking with my strenghts, which is humanoids, and mostly female at that. No idea what I want to go with yet since I kinda fell in love with each one as I was sketching it. I'd also love to develop a lot more on most of them... but no time!
Here's what the scribbles on each pic says:
First Pic
TL (Top left) - Invoker - harvests powerful magic into her "crystal plant". (My first sketch and idea... definately wouldn't mind a second pass to make this one better.)
TM - Clericon - Uses strong magical gathered forces between head piece & staff for powerful spells against enemies -> weakening, blinding, etc.
TR - Stalker - Has focused all her magic power into forging pure magic tendrils into her arm--can gather info into anything it touches. [Blindfolded so images from arms don't get clouded]
BL - Invoker - Gathers power in giant crystal imbedded in chest. Has sprites gather energy for her.
BM - Warlord - She loves running into the heat of battle with both magical swords blazing.
BR - Clericon - Alien-child that uses giant magic-filled ball all for healing & protection. (Medic-type)
Second Pic
TL - Demon Princess - "Sexy" demon that uses her dark allure to have soldiers 'come hither' until she is close enough to rip out their eyes & eat them.
TM - Demon Prince - Has tattoo marks that power his fusion with darkness. Wears horned boots.
TR - Demon Princess - Commands armies of minions, and controls the dark powers. Comes with her own human slave.
B - Demon Prince - Has fearsome strength and a sharp tail to kill his way past any opponent.
I gots me ahold of that Alchemy program so that I could jump on the bandwagon. 'Twas lots of fun.
After playing around with the program, I pretty much just re-did the Norms concepts but using Alchemy to try to loosen them up or whatnot... also added in an extra random one. Will probably do the potential Demon designs after some food.
Still nooo idea which design I want to go with...
kick some ass!!
Took the 'sexy' demon idea that lures the unsuspecting males in, added the slave from the other one, and then fitted her with a tight business suit, greentooth tie, and pen and glasses
Just a fun idea, unless someone thinks I should try taking it further...?
Otherwise, my next focus in on my first Invoker.
Thanks Rens, that's the plan!
This is just a rough idea for where I might go with her outfit and style. Next I'll do a detailed design with her 'crystal-plant' magical weapon.
Please don't mind the picture quality :P
Any suggestions are very welcome at this point! Thanks
The top left I like because of the overall shape and proportions giving it a slight Chibi look which would be fairly uncommon to see in the Dominance War, which could give your entry the slight edge and stand out amongst the pack.
The bottom left I like because of the headress and the staff. They really seem to the be main focal points of the design while everything else is kept simple and sleek. I would personally love to see you take that a little further.
Its still early days, so don't settle for an idea just yet. Keep knocking out some thumbs until something really pops up at you.
Good luck.
Right now I'm exploring my first Invoker idea.
I'm feeling a little bit of a magical-belly dancer going on, lol.
The head turned out how I pictured it, which makes me happy. However, the rest seems to be missing something that looks much better in my mind... perhaps a colour pass will help. I'm picturing her using the blue-red tones in the colour wheel, and her skin will be bluish-purple. Potentially also sparkly (if I can figure out a good enough shader
And yes, I'm aware her layered skirts are looking crazy right now. A photoshop pass with layers will be MOST helpful...
The smaller thumbs beside her are quick sketches of how she lounges on her weapon, and a slightly more detailed drawing of it. It will be all crystal, with the buds being a specific colour crystal. (I'm thinking the same colour as her eyes... red maybe?) The weapon is basically a big, plant-like shape seemingly made of crystal, but with magical gathering abilities. She would gather energy from various sources (the elements, other beings?) and then store it into the buds. When in battle, it could be unleashed in 'laser-beam'-like fashion. The magic stored in it can also be used for things like flight and teleportation(?).
Thanks for the input, Casey.
pychologically dominance should be reinforced with the male slave being almost wrapped around the legs and heels of yer Demon Princess
( regressed to submissive child at mothers feet )
My idea was that he's pretty pissy about having to be a slave, and as long as she's busy posing for the camera, he'll take whatever space he can. It's also in the interest of keeping it PG 13 rated...
I went ahead and developed the invoker with the head piece and staff more. Really like the look of it, but still not sold on whether or not I'm going with her or someone else. It's been a while since I've had this many ideas, I can't figure out which to choose!!
She seems to have a bit of a shaman thing going for her with all the bone skulls going on. Didn't see that one coming, but there it is. Outfit in the first sketch is just sorta there, not where I'm going with it. And yes, I think the heels look ridiculous right now. And I ran out of room to properly do the staff... my bad.
Still don't know which concept to do, and its been almost a week!! I gotta decide. Help! :S lol
r4ptur3 - Thanks, yeah I'm figuring it hovers. Not a bad idea, but no animation for the final so your suggestion is cool but as an idea.
Out of the female characters I think i liked the one holding an orb over her head the most. She looks almost chinese with those hair buns ;P maybe you could try elaborating that concept a bit more, having her use that big shiny orb as a weapon^^
I'm still having my dilemma of what idea to go with. Everyone seems to like something different, and I'm still attached to at least 3 of those ideas.
It's probably down to the first invoker with the crystal-plant platform and the orbs, the second invoker with the crazy headpiece and staff, and my chibi-style healer character. And then there's still the other ideas I haven't completely ruled out...
Hopefully before I go to bed tonight I will be able to upload the sketches I'm roughing out of the chibi character.
I want to decide by tomorrow which character to go with, but I really can't decide! I don't think I've ever had this problem :S Any help with deciding or any other comments on the designs is very appreciated!
Thank you for looking
So as I said in my last post, I did try a couple sketches of my chibi-style character--but that didn't go too well. I decided it was a fun idea, but not one I'm up for pursuing for the dom war.
Tried to work on the Invoker with the headpiece, but not long in I felt like I was forcing the drawing. So I stopped and went with the first Invoker concept--and decided that's the one I'm in love with, and will most be able to see through to the end.
So without further ado, I give you Pael!! (Working name--popped into my head and has sorta stuck since)
(Feel free to ignore the left sketch)
And full body!:
Definately happy with where I am with her. Next is more detailed photoshop sketches and colour scheme. Also more details for her weapon.(See the long, crazy crystal-plant thingy below) Btw, thinking her colour scheme will be from blue on the colour wheel to red. Fairly saturated. (All metalics are engraved scrollwork and will be goldish-bronze, though)
Thanks for all the comments so far, and more are very welcome!! Please tell me any ways I might further improve her. ^.^
Tonight's update is a test of the colour scheme:
No need to critique my painting skills, this is basically just slapping on colours in the right areas. I added a noise layer to the skin to give an idea of the 'sparkly' look I hope to have, and each shear cloth piece is a different colour.
Please let me know if you think the colour scheme is working!!
haZe - Thanks for the comment! Its not in the latest sketches, but she will have her weapon with her for the final. If you look in lower sketches, it is the crystalized, plant-style weapon that she sits on and gathers energy and does her magical bidding with. I hope to give that an interesting and complimentary silhouette with a fair bit of detail. If the silhouette could still use more after that, than I'll give your idea a try!
Everyone else out there, feel free to comment.
i don't know about her blue skin although it is original. and i like the idea of adding somekind of being (maybe a pet?) to give her that extra something. good work keep it up
well i think not all her hair should be tied up. have a few strands hanging loose. just an idea tho... keep up the good work
A bit of detail work for some of her pieces and a quick back view
Thanks for the comments
Gamewiz: Thanks, yah, I do understand how hard it is to be noticed as there are SO many threads.
I always pictured her with different coloured skin, somewhere between blue and purple, and I'm thinking blue is the best choice. Maybe it isn't the best way to go, but it's stuck in my head so I think I'm just gonna have to go with it :P I will need to do some thinking on another creature she might have with her. Hmmm...
Jalechah: Never too late for suggestions :P lol I was thinking she should have a very beautified look without any hairs out of place, but that's not a bad idea so I might sketch it out and see if it looks better, thanks!
I haven't done much of any modeling, let alone a character, in quite a while... therefore, just working out this base mesh was quite a struggle in itself. (This project is gonna take a whiiiiile to finish...)
I think I got it looking decent, now it's off to ZBrush with it to bring out the musculature and whatnot.
It's still early, so please, if there's anything that's very wrong, or even a bit wrong or off-looking, let me know so I can fix it
Thank ya! *Heads off to collapse in bed*
She's got some tittles though, and I like them.
i think you might have started with too many loops,
if you have half from what you have now, you can really block it out easely, and dont end up struggleing to connect all the extra loops you have.
it goes fast, and gives you a good chance to create a sexy wireframe,
her ass has some weird unneeded loops, and also the back of the shoulder.
the lines from her breasts into the arm look nice.
i suggest taking out some unneeded loops,
and have you discovered the "relax" option?
in edit poly, select a bunch of verts and find the relax button in there somewhere.
it evens out the space between verts, and gives you a smoother and better placed structure. (unless you hit the button like 5 times)
try and keep the polysize even, her ass, her wrist, fore arm, those are some dence spots, and those extra loops are not needed for zbrush.
besides all this it looks pretty good, her chest/torso is a thing you do need to look at, but you should do that in zbrush. goes faster, and you have more control, chance to play with it.
if you post a wireframe, dont make the wire the same color as the model :P
hope this makes sence,
good luck!!
-Woog
It's official. I'm the slowest modeler ever. I've only got the base mesh of her body done, and it took me 4 days. (Working approx. 4-5 hours a day)
Woogity, Rens, ColdKodiak: Thank you very much for the help!! I took it all into consideration as I tried to make my mesh better.
I wanted to focus on making a nice mesh with good loops now before ZBrush. Partly to learn this way, and partly so I can bring out muscle details and take back the lowest iteration to Max without needing to do topology.
Before I take her there, I think I'll add some basic clothing pieces to work with (Not hugely sure how to make hard edges in ZBrush ie. for corset) and work with those all together. I'll be doing the head and body in two seperate goes, so I can have the maximum polys to work with (my poor ol' computer doesn't like too many in ZBrush). Still undecided how to go about the hair...
Low Poly mesh and the one further back is with mesh smooth.
Some more detailed views.
For the entire head, I actually worked right alongside the Joan of Arc tutorial to make sure I didn't mess up the face geometry... cause I usually do... so now I've learned. (Part of the reason this all took an insanely large amount of time.)
Once again, please rip this apart as needed. I am HOPING to speed up my workflow now that I have a good base.
Thanks for looking!! *runs off to bed... damn its 4am again...*
http://www.subdivisionmodeling.com/page1.htm
once you have read that then read these two articles. They will change the way you model once you understand them:
The pole:
http://www.subdivisionmodeling.com/forums/showthread.php?t=907
The form:
http://www.subdivisionmodeling.com/forums/showthread.php?t=482&page=2
Those three links probably changed to way i modelled a lot so hopefulyl they will be of some help to you. Its certainly not easy to understand but once you grasp it then you should see some improvments
So the point is, you could start with an all quad mesh and skip the edgeloops headache in the "creative" stage and get technical when doing the retopo, which shouldnt be too much of a problem since you can triangulate at will.
The other advantage is to help your "poor old computer". A lower base mesh means you can squeeze the most out of your system (since it will allow you to get as close as possible to the maximum your machine can handle).
While we're on the slow computer subject, whenever you have a piece that can be broken off, do it. The head for exemple, i see in the concept she is wearing a neckpiece, that's a perfect break point right there for a subtool, same goes for the hands, feet, torso etc. Keep going!
It's looking good, I like the headpieced version the most. Are you still planning on pursuing that? I think you should
frubes - Read through the three articles you posted. You're right, it's not easy to understand. But I think I know what he was getting at, so I'll try my best to keep it in mind when modeling in the future. Thanks for posting those!
Psyk0 - Yeah, I'm sorta undecided how long to spend in Max before going to Zbrush. An earlier character I did was almost completely done in Max with only slight smoothing and the normal map was made with Zmapper. The next one after had a much simpler base mesh and most of it was done in Zbrush. Thinking back, I'm pretty sure the latter was the better idea.
Where I got confused in spending so long in Max was that I thought my topology was weak (it is), and it would be better if I did it well before getting high poly details in zbrush.
Now that you're brought this point to light, I'm reminding myself how I should better be working... thanks, I'll try to get into ZBrush sooner next time!
I also agree that I should be breaking them up so I can get the most out of the polys in ZBrush, but I hadn't thought about breaking them up where her jewelry pieces are. Great idea, thanks!
Drywall - Thanks, I'll definately have to take a close look at those tris (and how to get rid of them).
Thank you, I like the headpiece as well, but I felt more love for the gal with the crazy hair. Making sure I get this piece done, I'm focusing on the one I think I'll best be able to see to the end.
Will hope to update soon with an improved mesh! Thanks for all the input.
Been gruelingly working on fixing the mesh, area by area. I'd like to think it's finally getting decent. Also added in hair, hair broach, and all fabric tonight. I'm thinking I might leave the corset all for Zbrush.
I really have no idea what I was thinking when i decided to have TWO close fitting, billowy skirts right on top of each other. Uhhh yeah, will see how that goes in Zbrush. (And I'm in denial about how rigging will go)
Also not sure where I'm gonna go with the hair for high poly... suggestions?
Please continue with the tearing it apart! Thanks
You could easily sculpt a hairstyle like you've got in zb, a standard brush with lazy mouse should do it. Just make sure you've got even poly distribution (atm you don't) And don't end the hair with a bunch of collapsed triangles, you'll get nasty smoothing errors. Some loose alpha mapped strands, especially towards the end, will help sell the hair.
This lazy mouse... I hear of it a lot, but I'm not really sure how to do/activate/use/other it? Any tutorials/info on it I can take a look at? Unless its so simply it can just be explained in here... (I'm good at knowing simple techniques :poly122:)
This is gonna be the mesh I'm (FINALLY) taking into Zbrush. Yes, there are still nitpicky things a-plenty to be fixed on the mesh... but it's getting to the point where I just don't care anymore.
So, unless there's something GLARINGLY wrong someone finds, I'm onto the highpoly model.
;D .
I've only touched the chest area and lower (ooo, sounds dirty lol) so no need to comment on the arms, including shoulder area.
Hmmm... looking at the these screens now I'm noticing the painful issue at the back of the ankles. Shall be dealt with.
Also, I'd like to make a point of thanking everyone who warned me about tris and weird geometry. Thank you. I completely understand why you warned me against it. I keep noticing weird areas, I go to smooth them down and it doesn't get better. When I check the wire, it's because it's a tri or just weird geometry. I have learned the error of my ways--unfortuantely a little late on this project. Will make sure not to make the same mistake on my next mesh.
Anyway, how's she looking? Any areas looking weird? Any anatomy off?
Thanks for looking
The struggle continues... I feel like I've forgotten all/any anatomy I've learned over the years. Sigh. I'll do what I can to get this gal done :P
Alrighty, go nuts attacking the gemoetry!!
Anything is fair game except the hands right now. (Um, and the armour cuffs... those are gonna need to be redfeined. The corset and underwear are looking pretty clothy too atm
The butt needs some tweaking, the gluteus attaches on each sides of the sacrum / part of the coccyx, swirls down at the back and attaches to part of the femur
http://www.johnlawrie.net/images/photos/GluteusMaximus.gif
Long story short...it should be more at an angle and not just attach at the front if you know what i mean.
The arm in general should be more even in volume. You have established the top forearm muscle (brachioradialis) but then it shrinks down too fast and makes it look like there's very little mass when it reaches the wrist.
Some inspiration...
I really like the anatomy of Aleks Kirilenko's Elf:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=43&t=730985
...& Sama Vijay's "Medusa's gaze":
http://www.samar3d.com/medusa%27sgaze.html#