Boo! PR hyped designers get all the glory
polycounter lvl 10
Gametrailers' "Top Ten Game Creators" http://www.gametrailers.com/player/44356.html
It's like Walt Disney. He animated all the classics. Yup, all by himself.
Anyway, if we're just going by hype in that list I think John Madden deserves to be part of it.
It's like Walt Disney. He animated all the classics. Yup, all by himself.
Anyway, if we're just going by hype in that list I think John Madden deserves to be part of it.
Replies
Exactly.
A real list in my opinion under "creator" would be filled more by folks in the trenches.
Seriously, if you are telling me that someone like Molyneux or Meier just happened to get lucky and make great games, you are a moron. These are people that have dedicated huge amounts of their life to their profession and have done great things through this. I see no reason why they should not get recognized for this.
[edit]Well they did fuck up epically on one point, no Sid Meier. Seriously, there is no way he should not be on a list like this. Oh well, tough list to make I suppose.[/edit]
You are probably in the minority there, but of course, I understand how MGS has polarised peoples opinions over the years. As much as he arsed up in recent MGS games, and despite the fact he has had less great games to his name than many on that list, I think his place in that list isn't a surprise to anyone. I've just been through Metal Gear Solid on my PSP, and it felt like the first time all over again. So so good.:)
I also hope that this list is not in order...Hironobu Sagaguchi in 8th place? Get out of it. Personal preference 'n all, I would have put him in second, the Shinji in third, because I really like my zombies. Good to see Moleneux and Wright in there too.
example : hey this movie must be cool, you know, woody Allen/Spielberg/Besson/insert known name here made it.
in games : hey this is the new game from Kojima/Itagaki/Miymamoto/Molyneux/Meier/insert known name here.
it's nothing more than a marketing asset, and as long as it helps making this industry more popular, even though I don't agree with all the names here, I'm all for it.
just my 2 cents of course
Oh, and Molyneux probably shouldn't be in there, really.
Wow, in this game have worked this artist! a must have! :P
Well, the issue for me here is not about these guys who deserve accolades for their work, legacy, or whatever. I mean in the Oscars directors are awarded as best directors, best actors, best producer, best cinematographer and so on.
But "creator"?
Just because Mr. Designer is a living legend rockstar doesn't automatically mean he gets supreme credit for art, code, pr work. That would be like somebody random taking credit for your work and years of contribution. I doubt if this guys even stay late for crunch times anymore.
Give credit where credit is due is all I'm saying. Non issue for me if this was just specifically for "designers/producers"
[edit]
Not saying directing/producing is easy either. From what I've seen, that job is hell.
Pretty ignorant statement. I doubt there's conversations at Tiburon that start "well, John Madden said we have to do this so it's non-negotiable"
making a game is a collaborative effort but these are the guys that say "yes", "no" and "put a dog in it".
also, I agree, where the hell is Tim Schafer?
(not wait-ching 10 mins of streaming vid just now, sorry)
You took it out of context. See post #3.
Are you like... retarded? Seriously, have any of these people created games? Obviously, they have, and could therefor be considered Game Creators. These are all people who have, in a sense, already put in their time. They've worked hard, made tonnes of games, and have a large body of high quality work to prove their worth. They deserve credit for that. Whether or not they work crunch now. (They have all done their share of that too I'm sure.)
And yes, they do deserve more credit than the average artist, coder, etc... I have no problem with giving people more credit who have a higher position than me on projects I work on. I need to work my way up there. I imagine almost all other game developers worth their salt realize this as well.
I know, right! What a glory hog. Any code monkey could make Doom 4.
Couldn't agree more.
A lot of you do sound like total jack asses on this topic. Yes it takes a lot of people to make a game but you have the big names to fall back on and in the limelight.
Here are a few other real world scenarios that follow suit.
The USA and it's economy and foreign relations. Everyone blames Bush like he solely marched into Iraq shot the place up and took a dump before leaving and then on his way home told all these shitty ceos to run their companies into the dirt by scamming others. No he isn't 100% responsible but yet everyone blames him.
If a football team doesn't win. Who gets blamed? The quarterback or the coach most of the time. You never here well the linemen just couldn't get their blocks today or our punter just wasn't feeling it. No. You get Donovan McNabb can't deliver in the big games.
It goes on and on guys. It's a team effort but there has to be someone that is put up on the podium to make it all work and come together so don't be that dickhead trying to downplay these guys contributions to our industry.
That said. Where is Tim Sweeney?
That said...
...where are all the new faces though? Where are todays new great minds and innovators? Every one of these names could have made (and proabably they did) the top list 10 years ago. Why arent there any newcomers worth mentioning?
Would you honestly say that's a fair and accurate practice by the press even though everybody saw the game?
Let me try this. Your current producer, lead designer, lead community guy. If they get "best creator" props primarily because they get lots of press coverage, would you honestly agree with that praise regardless of whether they'll pass the credit or not.
Sure you can have your MVPs. But one man doesn't equal a team.
To be honest I don't care. I know I worked on that project and that I can personally know I helped these people get that esteem and glory by my hard work.
We can't all be heroes.
Yes. They deserve that praise. Notice that everyone who has replied that actually works making games seems to have no problems with this. There is a huge difference between working on a game, and being the person who directs it and makes it a good or a bad game. A good team is needed for that as well and the team gets praise in their own way. However there is a different level of credit deserved for the directors.
Just because she's a fit bird does not guarantee her a place in the top ten game create of all time; she only has two great games to her name so far! :poly124:
Having been through Fallout 3 and Tomb Raider:Undeworld, I cannot agree with this statement more. Both games look glorious. Our particular side of the industry is so goddamn competitive, the quality of the art is so high. However, it seems like companies are hiring chimps to string together the code that makes these games play (or not, as the case may be).
Because Miyamoto created frikkin Mario and Zelda and Donkey Kong and contributed to the development of countless other timeless characters, so no; the guy who coded the goddamn target lock in Ocarina of Time does not deserve the same credit! :poly124:
You need to google 'auteurs' or something and learn that people that pave the way do deserve more credit.
7 years 6 shipped.
I may be ignorant and retarded in a lot of things, but I've more than paid my dues in game dev.
bitch
This is a simple list of some of the most recognizable names in the industry. The ones who build the solid foundation for what we know of the game industry today. You may think, "well, what about all the people who did all that hard work and overtime?" The response would be "without these folks, they wouldn't have jobs/careers". These folks created the game industry...not just games. They created new experiences for others to build on and emulate. Come to terms with the fact that the little hired help that creates the crates and barrels for the alleyways in FPS Game #5438 are rather low on the hierarchy. They can be replaced. The one at the top is the person that has the vision, has the knowledge, and sets in motion the methods to make it real. The creator. Many of these men started at the bottom typing code for what would be their great breakthrough, creating a ripple effect throughout the field. Without them, the world would be a different place.
Show some respect...bitch.
And finally...without one of these men in particular...this forum wouldn't exist for you to compain on. What have you accomplished lately?
I know I wouldn't. Hell I would even wash that mans car if he asked me to.
You're arguments are just kind of silly: let's say they they put a dog turd with a bowler hat as the number one game creator of all time. Just because I said it didn't mean they did.
It sounds like you watched the first 10 seconds of the video, saw Cliffy B. in the montage and raged.
Why can't hawkprey, kevin lanning, and the rest besides Cliff get BEST creator credit. (I know we're just refering to one media's praise, but say in general)
Cliff = hawkprey, kevin, et al ?
Don't think so.
Each guy deserves equal praise for their contributions. All I'm saying.
They have kick ass art work and are amazingly talented but Cliffy is the face.
This is like saying anyone that models couches and furniture for the sims should get as much esteem as Will Wright.
Seriously. It's how the world turns.
Guys that write songs for hip hop artists aren't making millions and getting the bitches so ball up and deal.
I'm sure someone will come in and go "it's just polycount group-think, don't listen to them" but honestly if someone came to me and said "make a list of the top 10 game creators" it would be fairly similar, I'd probably include Ron Gilbert and Tim Schafer in there
Seriously. Your being upset with nothing here man. If you want to be a hero or famous. Making games is probably not the best route for that.
uhhhh?
I'm not even trying to understand. I'm arguing: "Fuck the status quo".
Miyamoto, Kojima, Spector...no new inclusion or exception in any top ten is ever gonna diminish their hall of fame status. They've been the "face" for decades.
I think it's time for behind-the-scenes guys to get equal footing with these game popstars in the media.
Ok got me.
Horrible comparison there. I'm tired and in crunch. lol
Holy crap man, you have some sort of twisted view of the world. Open your eyes a bit. Just because one list looks at the most important game developers of all time doesn't mean that everybody everywhere in the world only cares about those people. There are other venues that explore other people.
Plenty of newer talent is getting noticed. Cliffy B has already been mentioned, as has Jade Raymond. Jonathon Blow gets good amounts of press time, as does David Jaffe. Ryan Payton is a well known name, and there's a good amount of people who know Kyle Gabler. Lots of people know who Patrice Desilits is. I could go on, but I think this should make the point
And given all of that, there isn't any reason any of those mentioned should be on the list in question. An overall, top ten of the most important game designers, should be the most important game designers of all time. Maybe 10 or 20 years from now some of the newer talent around today will be on that list, but it takes time to work your way to that point.
And there are lists that talk about new talent to help this.
So quit being a whiney ass bitch. No one cares if you made did a bit of work on a few games and are upset that you aren't getting as much notice as Will Wright. He deserves it more than you. Live with it.
The CEO's? The Marketing Team?
I, again, second everything Tulkamir has posted here.
cliche cheap shot
See 'ya guys in the next thread.
Tulk you are a butt
Guilty here too. The man makes my blood boil
Funny thread, but its going to get hella derailed hella soon. I suggest a lock, nothing else good could come out of it.
Hmm... well, I am full of shit most of the time.