Modeling with multiple comps over a network

PolyHertz

I was wondering, is it possible to do something in a program such as max/maya/zbrush where multiple people can be working on the same mesh at a given time? Open canvas did this for 2D and it was a real blast (though with that feature only being in very old versions of the app sort of puts a damper on things). I was sure I'd heard that it was possible at some point but I did a search around on google and didn't find anything.

renderhjs

propably with proxies and or Reference objects - depending on what you use. Maya and max have something like that,- though I believe updates need to be done manually or only occour when you save.
The max reference system however is a horrible mess,- at least in version 9 - not sure if they every fixed that big mess.

MoP

There were a couple of apps that supported this, although they were mainly level-design packages, not 3d modelling programs.

Can't remember the name of the main one (was a kinda standalone Q3-style 3d engine with a built in multiplayer map editor, more than one person could work on a map at the same time, changes would update in realtime).

There was another "connection" software which integrated into Max i tried a while ago, again I can't remember the name, pretty sure it was a 1-word snappy title like "glide" or "swift" or something (not either of those, but probably similar!), basically it was a networking layer that synced active scenes between two or more computers.

When I tried it, it only supported Editable Mesh objects and was a tad flaky, but it seemed promising. I think it was open source and possible to integrate into any 3d app. Will see if I can dig it up again...

Edit: Found it - was called "Verse"... I knew I was on the right track http://www.uni-verse.org/

Rob Galanakis

Well we use HeroEngine and our teams can all work on the same stuff at the same time... it makes undo interesting, to say the least. I'd imagine something like that could be done for 3d apps, but it'd be very, very difficult- they aren't really built to be able to do stuff like that and I can't imagine what you would need to do to have it work. MoP, when you tried it, was it interactively updating? Or just periodically?

I am 100% in line with the idea that "the redundancy and complexity of today’s applications – like Photoshop – could be replaced by a modular set of atomic tools operating together as a single meta-application." Unfortunately few companies seem to (or have any reason to), and the possibility is just starting... you'll see it happen, it is just a matter of time.

MoP

Hmm, can't remember offhand. I think it was an automatic periodic update, but fairly regular/rapid... so fairly close to interactive. Although my memory may be playing tricks, it could have also been a button you had to click to update

Rob Galanakis

Oh right, some sort of timer-based update... that's what I mean though, it isn't truly interactive or cooperative... you are working on two different files that are updating one another somewhat in sync (and I imagine both passing info on each update to a 'master' file)... Max especially (because it is a binary save file) wouldn't be good for this sort of thing, and trying to sync two entire scenes I can imagine would be very difficult (working with only meshes or whatever would be simple enough). It'll happen but I doubt with any of the current programs- to do it well would require a whole nother level of extensibility and openness that none of the programs provide (maybe houdini or blender, haven't used them so can't say...).

EDIT: Having watched the Uni-Verse video, I was a bit misinformed about what it is- it is more about a protocol which other apps can 'tap into.' That is very cool and I hope they take it further- I don't think we'll see adoption of it with most of the current 3d programs, but it opens up great possibilities for the future when it can be implemented better in the programs.

pior

In my opinion, this is the kind of tool/workflow likely to face huge realistic limitations like Rob points out. I think there is no point in trying to make such thing happen for complex scenes and even less point to try and make it run in a production environment - it just wouldn't work.

However it would be fantastic to keep such a thing limited to a very small scope (opencanvas online is extremely rudimentary, but alot of fun). For instance if someone was able to make Verse work in Max, with editpoly and turbosmooth, in realtime, that would be totally enough to create an awesome 3Djam environment for two artists brainstorming together!

In short I don't think such idea needs a complex full featured integration. I wouldn't mind something as basic as Wings3D, with realtime online poly editing added.

Someone make it happen!

Armonio

PolyHertz wrote: »

I was wondering, is it possible to do something in a program such as max/maya/zbrush where multiple people can be working on the same mesh at a given time? Open canvas did this for 2D and it was a real blast (though with that feature only being in very old versions of the app sort of puts a damper on things). I was sure I'd heard that it was possible at some point but I did a search around on google and didn't find anything.

Like previously said, there is a Game Engine that does support multiple-users at one time. (Up to four, I believe) It's called Hero Engine and is currently being used to develop the new MMORPG Star Wars: The Old Republic, which is Bioware's first MMO. (It is an MMO-specific engine)

It includes Real-Time level editing. (As in, you can run around with a character, playing the game all the while dev's are updating the content.) They've also successfully marketed the engine with the idea that One person could design and create the actual terrain, using heightmaps or just physically transforming and altering the mesh, (pushing verts) whilst another man works on vegetation, another works on building/NPC/instance placement, while another man works on texturing. Not only that, but the network it functions on can support numerous teams (of four people each, I believe) working on different levels/content simultaniously, while an "admin" can cycle through each project, guiding the project along in a "camera" type of mode, while the environment is being altered in real time. Powerful stuff.

Anyways, it comes complete with models, textures, props and tutorials, along with a hefty ~500,000 price tag.

Hero in action.

Michael Knubben

uni-verse is pretty exciting stuff. I've been drooling over it for a while. It allows two programs on two different computers to share the same data, or two programs on the same computer (think photoshop and 3dsmax, where you're painting on a model in Ps, and you can still edit it in Max, or using a specialised program to make a few specific edits to the model you have opened in Max.

Think about being able to work in Silo at work, but having the model-data siphoned into max 1:1, so you can save your work in the format that everyone else works in. If this would work perfectly, you'd thereby bypass any import/export worries. If nothing else, the feeling of having that data shared between anything you open is a powerful one, and I'm barely scratching the surface of what can be done with it, I'm sure. I'm a simpleton .D

Then there are the more advanced things, like working on a model someone else is already rigging or texturing, without having to send updates all the time. Everything would update at once. I played around with it a bit in Blender, and it was pretty fun to work on a model together, online-whiteboard style.

Pior: absolutely! That would be fantastic. OpenCanvas is so much fun with just two artists and quite limited tools, imagine doing that with 3d. Imagine modeling something while leilei/cheapalert is meticulously detailing the penis! Powerfull stuff.

Michael Knubben

Also, the Quake 3-style game MoP mentions was Cube/sauerbraten, and was also pretty damned fun to play with two players. Very limited, in the sense that Lego's very limited as well. ie. not frustratingly so, and there are still worlds of possibilities!
Here's the website for Cube 2, or 'Sauerbraten': http://www.sauerbraten.org/

MoP

Ah, I found the link to Sauerbraten last night, I thought it was the game engine I was thinking of, but I couldn't see anywhere on the site that said the level design tools were multi-user... either they're not making it clear or I'm not looking hard enough