Normal Mapping utility for 3DS MAX 7 and 8!
A lot of you may remember the AMP II demo which had an amazing normal mapping plugin but it only worked with version 5 of max. We've rebuilt it for Max 7 and 8 (might work with 9, I don't know). I tried using Max's render to texture to bake normal maps, and it was a nightmare. I fiddled with the control cage trying various distances and the best I could get still had artifacts all over the normal map. After some discussions with other artists they say that is common and they have to touch them up in photoshop. To me that is wasted time and effort, so try out or Normal mapper for free for 30 days, and if you like it, please purchase it! It is only 99 dollars and will save you hours of touchups. Official news:
We now have an evaluation version of the AMP II normal mapper available for download. The trial period is 30 days. Download Now!
NEWS: www.4drulers.com
Product page: http://www.4drulers.com/normalmapper.html
Documentation and Tutorial: http://www.4drulers.com/normal_mapper_docs.htm
Download: http://www.4drulers.com/amp/Normal%20Mapper%20Trial.zip
We now have an evaluation version of the AMP II normal mapper available for download. The trial period is 30 days. Download Now!
NEWS: www.4drulers.com
Product page: http://www.4drulers.com/normalmapper.html
Documentation and Tutorial: http://www.4drulers.com/normal_mapper_docs.htm
Download: http://www.4drulers.com/amp/Normal%20Mapper%20Trial.zip
Replies
It would be nice to see some samples of a complex organic object.
the way you present it reeks of BS
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it does seem a little biased. if you change some settings around in max, the renders won't be as bad.
omg our knives!!
Per you accused him of using the crappiest settings max has to offer (and it looks like he did) are you sure you didn't do that with their tool? hehehe I'll run some tests tomorrow but already it doesn't sound like something I'll be using.
i'm glad people here have donated (or sold?) some models to you, but art does not define how good an engine is. checkout c4engine.com and checkout their pricing. its the engine i am using for my project and guess what? it cost 10 times less for a personal license. in my opinion it is a better engine specs wise along with clean code and good workflow... although some parts of the editor need to be improved to be honest. i'd suggest lowering your prices.
As for the our normal mapper, try the demo. If you like it, buy it. If not, keep touching up in photoshop or playing with a cage all day to try and get decent results. I get artifacts w/max, but maybe I'm not the best at setting up the control cage. After struggling all day, I went back to using my plugin because it works better IMO and it's easy to use.
As for a control cage, you can simulate one by messing with the smoothing groups on your low poly model. Each face you give it's own smoothing group on the LOW model will get rays shot from that angle. You can change the scale of your low poly model also to sort of simulate a control cage.
For multiple models, just attach them all to one mesh, and if you have any trouble you can try boolean, but typically you can just attach them to one object and it will generate good normal maps. You can also scale your low poly mesh to be a little bigger than the high poly mesh to catch more of the object sometimes. It takes a little bit of experimenting sometimes, but 99% of the time I get perfect normal maps on the first bake and no artifacts like Max.
The sample I posted was the same image I sent to an artist I know, and not meant to run max's normal map generation down. I was a bit frustrated after spending all day trying to get decent normal maps out of max, and tried my plugin and it was perfect on the first bake. Anyhow, this is not meant to run max's normal map generation down, but provide an alternative solution.
Anyhow, try it out. I think you will find it to be a time saver. The reason it might be slower is you have super sampling turned on. For testing, try a lower resolution with no super sampling on. Once you think it looks close turn it on for a final render. Typically though, I get it right the first time and it's not that slow unless maybe you are doing a 2048 character or something really complicated.
On the face of it, max seems slow, but once you start tutning on all the quality bells and whistles, max is pretty damn fast compared to other apps.
Engines. You get what you pay for. Has C4 ever shipped a commercial game published worldwide? AMP and AMP II have shipped 3 full blown first person shooters, and many smaller applications. It's a complete engine that has stood the test of time. Gore shipped almost 5 years ago and still has over 100 people playing online, it's networking is top notch. AMP is extremely fast too. I bet you dollars to donuts that if you built two identical scenes in both engines, AMP would out perform C4, and give doom3, or any other comparable engine out there a good run for their money.
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i feel obligated to defend c4 somewhat but not in a blind fanboy sense.
the only thing your engine has over the c4 engine is that it has shipped some games. however your engines amp 1 and amp 2 have been available before c4 has. c4 began licensing around may 2005... games take time to make especially when you have a small team. its looking like the game my team is making will be the first completed one and i hope it shows off the engine to give it the reputation it deserves. and secondly, c4 engine is very fast too, i would bet my life that under the exact same system with equal engine settings c4 would be just as fast as yours... i could be fanboyish and say its faster than yours but i have no way of knowing that, but i can easily estimate that it would be atleast equally fast.
my point is that your pricing is not equal to what you give, whether you've shipped agme or not compared to some other engines out there. but its your engine and thus your decision on its pricing.
as the for normal mapper, i'll stick with 3ds max's.
having shipped titles is a valid selling point though, it means it has proven itself in action, and the tools and exporters work for what a games team need to do (in the sense that a product was finished and released). Plus completed games raise the likelyhood of workflow being smoother, if the engine guys take feedback onboard
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yeah, i understand the point and that it is an advantage, i just don't think you can use it as a basis to completly putdown another engine.
but what you said is true.
[/ QUOTE ] yeah, i understand the point and that it is an advantage, i just don't think you can use it as a basis to completly putdown another engine.
but what you said is true.
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I have no opinion but to be fair; you were the one putting down their engine when we were talking about the normal map tool.
yeah, i understand the point and that it is an advantage, i just don't think you can use it as a basis to completly putdown another engine.
but what you said is true.
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I have no opinion but to be fair; you were the one putting down their engine when we were talking about the normal map tool.
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heh, i guess that is also true, i just thought i would mention the high pricing (imo), after all its still good to listen to the community that may contain potential customers.
but lets get this topic back on track to normal mapping.
I could pay 100 dollars for your plugin which has issues or go with a stand alone app from someone who isn't trying to swindle me out of money.
I am also forced to point out Nvidia's Melody normal mapping program. Also free and works well.
As for engines, the proof is in the pudding. Anyone can write an engine, but shipping a bug free product using an engine is a whole other ball game. Talk is cheap as well. Anyone can sit there and say how their unfinished game is going to do this or that, but my guess is if you are using the C4 engine, then you haven't shipped a game, and until you have shipped a game, you don't have any idea what you are talking about. Good luck though!
I'm not marketing towards indies, but bigger companies where time is important.
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you do understand a lot of artist in the industry are in these forums right? and if you fail their quality test your software isn't going to be used much in the "bigger companies". stop being so egotistical about your normal mapper and its "superior algorithm" and fix it up. i am sure if you fixed some of the problems it would be a very popular plugin.
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As for engines, the proof is in the pudding. Anyone can write an engine, but shipping a bug free product using an engine is a whole other ball game. Talk is cheap as well. Anyone can sit there and say how their unfinished game is going to do this or that, but my guess is if you are using the C4 engine, then you haven't shipped a game, and until you have shipped a game, you don't have any idea what you are talking about. Good luck though!
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here is my game, and yes it will be my first completed game (only because the other times my team all quite... i hate quiters). however, quality takes time... i am attempting to make a game that hopefully will score higher than 2 out 5 and 1 out of 5, scores which your two completed games with your engine got at a review site.
i'd also like to add a few quotes from the review from gamespy:
"If you're a ATI Radeon owner, a graphics bug will plague you from the start. Secret Service doesn't like ATI's graphics drivers later than version 3.8, and applying the patch from the Activision Value Web site doesn't help."
"If you try to play with the latest Catalyst drivers, shadows appear as a swirling mess of headache and nausea-inducing black squares."
"Character models look about as realistic as Ken dolls. While the most of the textures and some of the objects look okay, the lighting is atrocious. The OpenGL-based engine doesn't appear to have the ability to be subtle -- either that, or the lighting artist is a rank amateur."
"but Secret Service chokes when more than a few hundred polygons fill the screen. Going downstairs, for instance, or visiting a room with a high-polygon model such as a sports car, causes this puppy to crawl. "
"Secret Service's controls also feel wooden and unresponsive, and there there are key mapping problems in that they don't always remap"
"Unsurprisingly, the enemy AI is pathetic."
"It's the people that created the game that really need the bodyguards, to protect them from unsuspecting gamers who aren't able to get their money back."
If you look at all the 3d apps that already have the ability to normal map then your plugin is quite useless if you know what you are already doing.
Max-Comes with
Lightwave-Comes with
Maya-Comes with
Softimage-Comes with
Zbrush-Comes with
Nvidia-Free
Xnormal-Free
= No reason to spend money for your plugin.