Chasing the dollars

J O T

Hello polycount,

This is my first post, though I've lurked this site and many of its members sites over the years. So a big thanks for all the great information you people have shared.

I am currently in Sydney and I'm always hearing of how good the money is in the States. I am hoping someone could tell me the average income for Leads, Senior and Mid Level artist in the US. I've heard good Senior Artist can get 100K+ and thats quite common. Ive worked in the UK, France amd here in Australia. Now I'm thinking about the US, especially if the money is that good.

Sorry for the narrow-minded first up post.

firestarter

Hmmm, from hearsay and my own investigation into these matters... I think you have it as good as you`re going to get, in Oz, quality of life + COL wise. AND you won`t get shot at on a regular basis

Paul Jaquays

Most people in the USA are not "shot at on a regular basis". Not sure how common the $100K+ salaries are (they do exist and not just for leads) but your main issue will be a logistical/legal one. US immigration laws throw barriers in the way of bringing in employees from outside the USA (and for some reason they make it even more difficult for people from countries where a large proportion of the citizens are of European descent). It can be complicated and costly. If the job candidate has advanced degrees (got your doctorate in game art yet?) it is much easier. Complicating the salary issue is that the cost of living varies wildly across the country. Example: The salary you get in Texas goes a long way. On a mid-range salary you can even buy a house without going into a multi-generational mortgage situation. For the same position elsewhere in the country, the salary won't be much different, but housing and taxes can make it necessary to share living quarters with room mates (sometimes in areas where you are shot at regularly). Check the annual salary survey on gamasutra.com for what people are being paid in the USA.

firestarter

[ QUOTE ]
Most people in the USA are not "able to detect a joke at 100 paces".

[/ QUOTE ]
Yes I know, sad isnt it?

Mark Dygert

I was shot 4 times on the way to work and 2 on the drive back home, I'd have to say its getting better.

Honestly there is a potential to make some good money here but its not like you walk down the street and trip over those types of positions. Beware of the grass is always greener syndrome. Also I would seek out advice from people who have actually done what you are thinking about, instead of talking to people who still just dream about it. Hind sight is always 20/20.

There is fierce competition for those spots and normally those with connections fill the spot. More than likely you will have to deal with work visas and I hear post 9-11 can be a bear, some companies might not want to deal with that unless you are an absolute must have. You also are walking in cold knowing not that many people and have to fight a stigma that your prior experience doesn't really count because it was form "the outside". We all know everyone outside the US uses two rocks, a piece of copper wire and an actual dead rat for a mouse, so how experienced can you really be =P (see how it goes both ways, Jokes Lane is clogged full of traffic today! heh).

Just like retail its all about location location location oh and yes and don't forget, location. Pay is normally relative to the surrounding area. Places like NY, LA, Seattle they all pay pretty well when measured up to other areas on pay alone, but it also costs a mother F-TON more to live in those places. So be careful where you accept offers from and do housing checks before accepting. Some places seem to pay less than others but then the cost of living is much cheaper.

Really all the research in the world can't prepare you for what you are about to do, my best advice is plan for the worst shoot for the best and after you've been here for a few years and have a lay of the land you'll know where you can settle. You seem like a fairly adventurous type that doesn't mind moving so I don't expect your first choice of job/place to live to be your last

Here is what I would do and its what a few other who are from outside the US working here, have done. Don't go for it all, only plan to be here for as long as it takes to amass a small fortune, live cheaply but comfortable. Then when it comes time to retire early get on the first plane out to some place cheaper, with better traffic. Hopefully the US Dollar will still be worth something by then and "Little America" also known as the rest of the world (see they still keep coming) will not be as expensive to live. The common trap is come to America live the dream (which means buying everything on credit) and staying (being trapped) because you have to make the payments. You're coming here to make yourself money not barrow someone else's wealth and paying them back 10 fold. Have a little now or have more later, it all depends on your personality I guess and what you are willing to do to meet your goals.

J O T

Thanks for the advice guys.

Yeah, I forgot about the difficultes of not having a degree for the US. But I heard its still possible. I thought if the company wanted you, than they would basically sort out a work visa?
Going by the salary survey (thanks for that Paul) 100K salaries are probably pretty rare. Don't get me wrong, I'm not after 100k job, well I'm not anymore. I'm just wanting to get a better understanding of the market there.

I guess you blokes are there dodging bullets as you work, anyone die today? might be an outing for me.

Thanks again.

Steve Schulze

I haven't actually looked very deeply into it as yet, but apparently the free trade agreement and all that other malarky that went down recently between Australia and the US has made it much easier for people like us to get work visas between our two countries. Whether its just hearsay from people who don't really understand the workings or it is actually the case remains to be seen.

fogmann

I can say that it took me almost 7 years to get my green card. My dad came with work visa (before 9/11) and my family had dependent visas. Then when I turned 21, I was on my own, since I wasn't legally the part of the family anymore. It's a loooong process and after 9/11 it got even more complicated. Most of the companies don't want to deal with immigration, some even state on their job listings that they require employment authorization for US. It costs them time and money to deal with immigrants. They need to pay a lawyer that will take care of all the papers, and lawyers can get quite expensive. They will hire you if you are someone they can't go on without, as mentioned above, but beware that they might not pay you as much as they would if you were American citizen or LPR, since you still depend on the company for even being able to stay in the US. I say that, because that happened in my family. But anyways, I think it was certainly worth it, since in my country I would have ZERO opportunities to do anything with my life.

Leech

I agree with everything Paul had to say.

Looking at your portfolio and resume I see no reason why you couldn't come close to the 100k figure or obtain that in a short time(1-3 years) working in the US. That's not everywhere in the US, it's like what Paul said your money is going to work for you differently state by state.

There are a number of good studios in Australia though and more popping up everyday. Just throwing out another idea if you were serious about coming to the US. You could find out if gaining employment with Irrational or Pandemic would help . Both companies have dual offices in Australia and the US. Maybe they deal with the issue on a more intimate level.

McIlroy

My personal opinion is that your only going to come close to US 100K+ , if you work for EA for many years . There is far to much competition in the USA . Blizzard is a good example . Even though they make barrels of cash they are very well known for being cheap and paying there artists as little as possible .

J O T

I'm really sick of moving. My wife is French and has family there in the US, and the one flight to France would make a big different for her.
I'm happy here and the money isn't bad, but she needs to be closer to the family. I was hoping for a easy ride and good money would make the decision easier.
My current employer, Plasticwax, has recently thrown me a wobbly by making me an offer to go to Shanghai! Another reason I was hoping to hear about good money in the US, so I wouldn't be tempted to go to China chasing money.
Anyway, I've got a better understanding for the US now. I'll probably start trying and I'll see how much the immigration issue hampers my chances.