Character /Creature Modeling reel 2006
polycounter lvl 17
Hey, hey, hey. 
My second post on Polycount:) Great site.
I finished 6 months of intensive studies at VanArts in Vancouver, Canada and had the honor and pleasure of sharing a class with some very talented and helpful individuals. Instructors too. (they're in my credits on the reel. 
C&C always welcome.
my new site http://www.imwfactor.com
My second post on Polycount:) Great site.
I finished 6 months of intensive studies at VanArts in Vancouver, Canada and had the honor and pleasure of sharing a class with some very talented and helpful individuals. Instructors too.
(they're in my credits on the reel. C&C always welcome.
my new site http://www.imwfactor.com
Replies
great work
Secondly, the credits are about half the length of the entire reel. Trim that down a bit.
Thirdly, get at least one more model on your reel. 2 is not enough in my opinion, although I understand you not having all that much more since it was only a 6 month program you were enrolled in.
Fourthly, work on your shaders and materials. You can get those looking a lot better if you put some more time into it.
Lastly, model some more detail into your creature. You've got plenty of little bumps are scars, but you neglected to model in details such as his claws or toenails which for some reason, actually exist in the concept. Frankly, there are a lot of things about the concept you could work a little harder to stay truer too.
Congrats at completing your program at VanArts though. Great school. Wish I coulda gone there.
i love your beast. it has been a long way with it. i quote: it will be done this weekend.
i totaly agree with the too long credit.
later petra
You all rock!!! Thanks for responding!!!:):)
DarthRevanII: Thanks. Remember, the mind is capable of doing many things. The power of suggestion. What one can conceive, one can achieve.
Aesir, Daz: Cool, thanks.
Petra: Thanks.
In regards to the reel, I figure put something out there, at least.
WIth more time, the Beast would've been dancing to the tunes.
Credits: That was a toss-up. I don't like leaving people out who helped me out on my first reel. I like giving credit where credit is due.
I've heard that many art directors, when viewing portfolios and showreels (especially online ones) are likely to have their own music playing, so having music in your own reel is going to conflict with that, or at best annoy them. I wouldn't take the risk that one art director happens to love Craig David if 10 art directors hate his music... at best they won't have any speakers at all. Personally I'd just drop the music entirely, this will also be of benefit since the file size will be smaller for download.
The credits are far too long. If you absolutely must have any credits (personally I think they're unnecessary), put them all on one screen if at all possible. The final image (and probably first image too) should have your name, website and all relevent contact info, in a nice clear font. That way the viewer gets all the necessary info on one slide, instead of having to skip between 3 different images to find your name, email, phone number and website.
If this is a reel targeted for character art in videogames, something that is a "must", is putting info on polygon count and texture sizes. If you're applying for a job at a PS2 dev company but you're only used to making 10,000+ poly models with 2 1024x1024 textures, they'll want to know about it. Wireframes are all well and good, but showing flat textures and model info is also something I would deem necessary.
You need more content - 2 characters is really not enough. You need to show that you can tackle any subject matter with equal skill.
Also, I would say your texturing needs work - like Aesir mentioned it all seems to be "high-frequency" detail (ie. skin pores, wrinkles, scratches) and "low-frequency" detail (ie. muscle shapes, bone structure) ... but there's nothing in between... no fingernail outlines, no clothing seams, no dirt or wear and tear.
To be brutally honest your textures are far too simplistic. You need to get more colour variation and design worked into them. The female (i think?) character has a very boring costume. The colours are dull, and there are no interesting or striking areas of detail. Everything is the same rough uniform texture, which does not make for an interesting model.
Likewise there isn't really much interest in the concept of these models - their silhouettes are bland and have been seen before innumerable times ... there's nothing original going on here that makes me sit up and say "wow, that's cool!"
I think judging by the wireframes you are a very competent modeller, but you need to really work on some more original designs and ideas, get some more models built and practise your texturing skills to bring them up to scratch with the model-building. Then re-compile your reel, lose the music and credits, keep everything simple and clear. If you're not applying for a job as an animator, lose the short animation of the creature - it's fine to rig and pose (maybe with a short idle cycle) to keep it interesting, but personally I think it's not adding a whole lot to your reel by having a 1-2 second clip of zoomy-camera animation.
Hope that helps, keep workin' at it
Edit: You replied while I was typing! That'll teach me for taking so damn long
Really I don't think it's worth keyframing and animating the beast to dance with any music. It's just not necessary. Are you planning on applying for a job as an animator? If so, your whole reel should be animation-based. If not, keep it to a minimum so that it shows you're capable, but leaves the modelling, design and texturing at the forefront of the showreel.
And agh! No! The backstreet boys would be even worse... I hope you were joking
What was liked about the reel?
Mop: Thanks for the suggestions.
And
Thanks for the responses.
Thankyou all for taking the time to write.
I knew I should've used the Spice Girls for the music.
And there is way way to much still frames, it's a video clip, try to allways have motion.
The music wasn't in question, if one wants to watch a reel, one turns off the sound. Aesthetics are being evaluated not musical taste.
And a reel gets one an interview, it doesn't get one a job.
As for more than one character on a reel, with the counsel I received on quantity over quality. The recommendation I got was one solid character over 3 average characters.
THere's a guy who lives a few blocks from me who recently got hired at EpicGames as a modeler, his reel had two characters, he got hired off of one of the characters, the first one he showed.
And another recommendation i received was, "if you're gonna be a modeler, learn how to rig aswell. DOn't limit what you can do, 'cause that's how your more than expendable. Be a character artist, not just a modeler.":)
Take care, all.
Honestly though good luck!
Putting words into people's statements...evaluate again, what you've just written, and read what i have written, please.
If you re-read the comments, mine and others, you can see my responses and you can evaluate the comments aswell. And I stand by my statement, A reel gets one an interview, it doesn't get one a job.
And the counsel i received is from "industry veterans"
And thankyou for the congratulations. Fact is, some of you made predictions that didn't come true. To me, if one is proven to be mistaken it is most productive to not become defensive that their evaluation method isn't a constant across the board. When it comes to art, and commerce ( I preference this with my opinion) there are variables in play that will influence the final outcome.
Take Care.
Labouring Under Correct Knowledge
L-U-C-K. That's what it stands for.
I think the biggest complaint I have with the reel is the same I have of all the VFS reels. The anatomy is only taken a little ways. All the largest lumps and bumps are there, but none of the really subtle stuff is, and there is nothing sharp or finely detailed in the model. Add in the same rotating model posed on a base, one creature + one chick or hero character, and a portion thanking classmates teachers and parents, and you have the formula for a reel from VFS.
I'm not trying to rag on the college, as I've never been there, and I don't know the quality of their teachers or courses. All I'm commenting on is the trend I've seen from the reels of students coming out. You need to do something in your reel that sets you apart from the base level that almost all reels coming out of there have.
*edit* was pointed out you went to Vanarts and not VFS, so they must be creating similar programs, but I think the comments still apply.
But I wonder as to why these boards, CGtalk and conceptart.org seem to fill up with VFS students right after a graduation, classmates all sign up and give compliments, then they all dissapear never to post again? Is there a teacher at VFS who points out these forums for students to post to after graduation? For what purpose if any constructive critical critique is dismissed?
"A reel gets one an interview, it doesn't get one a job."
What are you saying? That a reel doesn't have to be that good, it merely needs to impress some clueless HR person long enough to get you a foot in the door? I really don't understand your point. Sorry If that's not it.
As for any predictions ( and I'm assuming that you're talking about the reel not landing you a gig ) , they've yet to be realised either way. The reel hasn't *actually* landed you a gig yet, so it's a little premature for congratulations. I was offering luck. Keep that in mind.
And, Ben, thanks for the resource on your site, very helpful.
The reel is the calling card to get one an interview. It does not get one a job.
Hope that clarifies.
Take care all.
"not to be mean"
Oddly enough if your intent was to be mean I didn't read it.
VFS grads on conceptart.org? that's news to me. They usually post on CGtalk.
I had a class of 8 people, that's why they're in my credits
Checked out some of your work on your deviant site. I particularly like the samurai with the skull helmet. When do you plan on modeling that one?
VFS. The school doesn't make the artists.
/sarcasm off.
ok so heres what I see, you're saying that a reel just gets you an interview and then the rest is up to ... what? your amazing personality and people skills? Lets see you just barged in here and started telling us all how things work in this mysterious industry that we lowly noobs don't know anything about.
my advice is... i dunno, get a job, save your money...
If the answer is in question, I recommend to converse with several artists and ask them how they got their positions. Ask the juniors and the seniors.
From my questions, the constant I received was "The reel got me my interview, if I choked at the interview, that would be it, I would've had to keep sending it out."
Film, animation and games. It's a team environment.
Please do not put statements into my posts.
No where in my posts have I called anyone a "lowly noob". And no one is above reproach.
If you feel the statements in your comments, that is an issue you must take up with yourself, not with me.
Thankyou for taking the time to write.
And no, I did not "barge" in. If you look at the top of the thread, I am the thread starter who has welcomed others to partake in the thread I have started. I have thanked and continue to thank them and yourself for your participation.
Take care, and thanks for posting.
I realize you might not be trying to come across a certain way, but if the majority of the people in this thread are getting the impression, you might want to reexamine your posting style.
And for those of you getting hostile, let's try to remember the reason we post crits, and not get *too* hostile. Especially if it's fairly obvious the person in question might not fully understand the english language.
Please consider my responses to you as a kind forewarning of an annoyed professional. I do not care to have any further conversation with you based on your downward spiral of posts.
I do, however, enjoy that you have just explained to daz how the hiring process works. In fact, I think i spilt a bit of my mojito. Congrats on comic relief for an evening. You win the jackassery award. *high five*
Your texturing needs a lot of work before you'll be good production-quality standard, as does your concept design. Your animation also looks like it needs more work, the arm of the (boring, boring) creature right at the start is pointing vertically upwards but it's evident from the way the shoulder is deforming that the rig is not built to accomodate this.
Just because you have an interview or two does not mean you've magically gained skills and a kickass reel.
If these couple of interviews lead to no job, you'll be sitting here again wondering what to do.
I will point out, I have not used profanity in any of my posts. This is a public forum. IF the majority misinterpret, that is their issue, not mine. A majority decided to fire up some ovens and put some people into them, that doesn't mean those folks deserved to be burned up.
Perhaps it is they( some in this forum thread) who must re-examine the attitude they bring to a public forum. Saffoo explained this is a public forum, yet he has outwardly used profanity to express his opinion.
Professional is an attitude. Wear it or don't wear it. Last professionals I encountered did not use profanity on public forums and secondly they didn't address themselves as professionals, others in their company did.
If my intent is getting lost, I recommend those with issue re-read my posts. I thanked all for taking the time to write, and I shared the advice I have received and the results of my 2 interviews due to the current efforts I have posted. What I am seeing in some of these posts is ego, unchecked, clouding reason. Ego isn't a bad thing, yet when it interferes in one's understanding and reasoning ability that is when it becomes an obstruction in personal growth.
I stand by my statements, if there is any misinterpretation, please re-read.
Thanks for clarifying. I now stand informed on the hiring practises of major studios, thankyou.
[/ QUOTE ]
Oh man did that ever make me chuckle...good game sir, good game.
Mop, I thanked you for your input.;) No where in my post did I say "i have a job" I said I have 2 interviews.
The reel gets me an interview, it doesn't get me a job. And please, as I've stated before, do not put words or emotions into my statements.
I did not state
"you've magically gained skills and a kickass reel"
So please, I will say again, do not put words or emotions in my statements that I have not said.
Whatever you have projected onto me, is an issue you must take up with yourself, not with me.
Thankyou for takng the time to write.
This is my opinion, of quite a few of the posts I'm reading. Learn to look on the brightside. Life is more than polys and jobs.
Take care.
Something you may have missed, which is maybe why people are getting a little wound up, is that you seem to have ignored every critique directed at your creature and character model and texture.
You responded to critique about the length of the credits, and the music, but you have in no way acknowledged the fact that your texturing and design skills need a lot of work. You've just skimmed over that fact like it doesn't matter, when in fact it's the most important point of all.
I will quote what you said in one of your earlier posts:
"As for more than one character on a reel, with the counsel I received on quantity over quality. The recommendation I got was one solid character over 3 average characters."
This is good advice.
However, what your reel has now, is 2 average characters. There's nothing exceptional about them - the modelling is fine, but everyone's mother and their brother can make decent topology after following a few examples these days.
Do you agree that your texturing needs work, and that you should create more interesting, unique and original character and creature designs? Or are you just going to ignore this critique again in the hopes that you won't have to face up to it? Because that's the impression I'm getting right now.
Feel free to prove me wrong.
In addition, I will stand by the statement and the counsel I have received 1 or 2 characters are more than suitable, you may disagree, that is your opinion, I've encountered more than one artist who got hired off of one strong character over 3 average characters.
And if any one's mother and brother can model a decent character with efficient topology after following a few examples, excellent. That's how I learned too
If you find the characters dull and boring, so be it, that's your opinion, thanks for sharing.
"The secret to failure is trying to please everyone."
And lastly I will state, what ever one reads in my posts, that's their issue not mine. I am clear and direct. I thnak all for their contribution, and I also stated "more to come". Last I recall "more to come" meant there was another quantity being produced. That's why I say "more to come." I'm not changing this current reel when I can make another one. I kept my credits as is cause I give credit where credit is due. It's important to me. And I also stated it would make no sense if my second reel had this many credits on it. And once again, there is no button on my reel that says "keep volume on" when playing the reel. That's what volume ctrl is for.
Craig David is generic? Wow. I can respect your opinion.
I recommend you try some Enya.
Ninjas, as i state before to all who put words and emotions into my posts, check your own state of internal affairs, please
Statements like "lowly noobs" from a prior thread poster, and then having that statement projected as quoting me?
My advice live life.
'Cause no matter what I write, somehow some ( I stress some) of you will find a way to take offense to it because you can.
My opinion, Sad, day indeed.
Peace and LOve.
More to life than polys and jobs.
Take Care.
I'll find a way to close this thread, 'cause being engaged in this "posting" is interfering with any of you and myself in focusing on your jobs, your training, and living life.
All the best to ya all, and thanks for taking the time to write.
and this thread is freaking weird
Peace, pot, and microdot bro.
im sorry i dont mean to offend u , but u seem to be part of a new generation of artists that take courses in some "cg oriented schools" and make some mediocre work convinced that they are the kings of the world..i dont have nothing agaisnt CG schools , but u rely too much on words and not acts u sy this and that , but really dont see u move muscle to fix what everyone has agreed that is wrong . i dont care bout the music , screw it , ur applying for a 3d job not musician, so stop being pompous, yes pompous and dont tell me to "re-read" the topic cause iv wasted like 15 mins reading all this ( yes my choice ) , i just want you to know that that ur way to see things wont lead u anywhere , ur more worried on making quantity as u said with some average quality, but honestly ull need quantity AND quality maxed up ! perfection ! u gotta destinguish urself from the pack, thats why like almost veryone of this topic is laughing at you cause they know it ! they ARE professionals, not those university teachers that u take as professionals in gaming industry...
ill resume : get ur ass out of the pedestal and work on ur texturing, study anatomy , model like crazy loose sleep hours and do something usefull ( its funny iv wastd 5 minutes writting something useless ).
damn sorry if i sound too hostile, but its my mind speaking , so get to it fix ur folio !PERIOD.
UH
Ismail: Push ur detail.
I feel like such a biggot for accepting the fact Bill's a frenchy.
But seriously though, after 133 posts you'd expect someone to see that pretty much everyone else uses a slightly 'richer' alphabet, right?
and
In no way is this meant to attack you from what you have written, it is just a way to clarify some things that I feel may have gone out of control.
You have asked for critiques on your demo reel which people have given you in the beginning. You started seeing nothing but critiques pointing out flaws and none pointing out what people felt was good. As to this, the responce from some was to point out some good things on your reel.
Then it just started getting completely off topic. You were able to get two interviews with your reel which is great. No one disputed or would dispute that. What people are trying to say is that even though you were able to obtain two interviews that does not mean that you should stop fixing that reel. Ofcourse you are then quick to point out that this is not the only demo reel you are working on. Thats fine and that is what we like to hear as a forum community. Then you had to point out that the hr department and senior artists could turn off the sound if they don't like it. That and two great models are better then 4 semi good models. Yes this is what you have been told by industry professionals but the people who are giving crits are industry professionals. Atleast a good majority are. Needless to say they were not interested in schooling on matters of demo reel etiquette.
I believe that also you may have been wrong to keep pushing the subject of placing words in others mouths but others were also wrong to keep commenting on the matter. When things get blown out like this it is always best to just walk away from the issue and get back to the main point.
Show us what you are working on to correct problems that we see and that you apparently have seen. I believe this course of action will be best at swaying the topic back in its proper direction.
Ismail please keep showing us progress