i dont see anything whatsoever on your site or the forums?
sorry, just a quick bit of constructive criticism... the "Where games are meant to be experienced." thing on your site sounds extremely cheesy. aren't all games meant to be experienced? isn't everything in the universe meant to be experienced?
i do like your tutorial on max viewports though, good refresher
i think it might be a little unrealistic to be creating an mmorpg at this point. consider all the assets to be created, the time, the staff needed, and the money. who is going to fund such a large project? if you pull it off, i will be impressed.
An mmorpg is hopelessly optimistic as a first project. You need to seriously reconsider If you want to finish this. There is just NO way. You clearly have no idea of the overheads of such a MASSIVE undertaking. What engine are you using? How many MMORPG's has your lead engineer made? You do *understand* the server requirements of an MMO right?
"Plus we are also going to be selling training dvd's to cover some cost's of startup and to generate some cash flow."
No disrespect intended, but this is mightily naiive. You would have to be providing some artistic or technical expertise in those DVD's that was absolutely top notch and VERY highly sought after to be able to warrant selling them. There are a gazillion FREE high quality tutorials all over the internet covering all aspects of computer graphics created by extremely experienced and talented people. Being able to actually market your expertise as a commodity would require that you are in the absolute top of your craft in CG and a name to boot.
Seriously you'll never achieve anything with such absurdly lofty goals.
And cut it out with the 'jobs' crap unless you're an established company looking for employees.
Aim for something realistic and you might actually achieve something. Currently you're doomed before you've even begun.
Tone down the arrogance and make a mod of an existing game.
I'm not trying to flame you. You need a reality check for your own good.
I don't know about you but starting up an MMO as a first project is just way too big of a project to handle. I'd personally go for something small or maybe two small projects like a 3rd-person or side-scrolling adventure game with a few levels and some interesting enemies ... make it fun and simple and once you get some cash-flow running from small projects then try at something a little bigger but not too big and maybe even hire an extra team member or two because as projects get bigger, you're going to need more people.
Guys, you don't know how many times i've seen newbies try to start MMORPG's as their first project, usually following a post-apocolyptic/cyberpunk/dbz/fantasy cliche with no plot. :P
THEY USUALLY FAIL AND THE MMORPG ATTEMPT WAS NO MORE THAN A TRY FOR FORUM RECRUITMENT (no i don't mean this)
Things like that can't be taught they have to be learned and experienced so that you KNOW, not fear, KNOW that the shit ur working on is NOT gonna happen, its usefull to know these things so that in the future you don't put 100% of your faith into something that is destined to fail.
I encourage you guys to go on with it and make your MMO, and if you succeed GREAT, if you don't, hopefully you learn your lesson, but keep at it and make more stuff.
Are you insane?
I just finished my first game after 3 years of development over the net, and I can tell you without a doubt you will not be able to finish such a massive project over the internet. I am not even going to go into the massive server costs, how hard it is going to be market (with a mmo, if there are not many people playing you don't get more people playing, its either a sucecss for a complete failure). To keep your game online you need to pay a massive amount of server fees, to pay these server fees you need a large fan base, to get a large fan base it needs to be better than what professionals create (by professionals i mean people who are actually in the industry).
Internet developers need to innovate, they need to make products the industry won't create, SIMPLY because there is no way an internet developer can make the same quality games as the industry.
There is no chance you are going to get a major publisher as an internet team, it has never happened and I doubt if it ever will. Massive corporations do not put in hundreds of thousands of dollars into a project like that simply because it has to many legal problems.
I see you have the stance that you won't listen to anyone and you'll show them. Listen to Daz, he is in the industry, he knows what he is talking about, be realistic and stop chasing insane dreams.
Obviously this post won't help you or anything because after not listening to the above posts there is no reason to listen to this, but I had to rant about this somewhere.
Listen, I wish you the best of luck mate honestly.
Your ambition is not in question. Your sense of reality is. If you'd ever gone through a videogame production process you'd know exactly what I meant. I offer my apologies since I didn't realise you had a huge staff of highly skilled software engineers, artists, designers, sound specialists, producers, your own game engine and the extremely high end technical prowess and server overhead needed for an mmorpg at your disposal.
What really bothers me about net projects and teams, is that as internet teams they never try to innovate or do anything original. They all want to create the biggest game of all time, a new Half Life 2 with scripting and the newest technology. The game I just finished was not innovating but it was designed to be very simple to develop online, I never really needed to be over someone's shoulder telling them how to script a level and such. Internet teams really need to see their massive disadvantage.
I am not talking directly about this project, this is another general rant.
While the project seems unlikely to me as well, for all I know this guy could have a masters degree in EVERY FIELD OF BUSSINESS IN THE WORLD! So, who knows..
Listen here, people here are trying to help you by telling you to start off with smaller projects, and thats EXACTLY what you should do. Show us some work that your artists/programmers/modellers have done thats on the level of which they can bust out an MMORPG with no prior released games and we'll shut up.
Im implying that it's exceptionally hard to get a Greencard ( I should know. Since I'm English, been here 5 years and am still not in possession of one ) and you can't start a business here without one. You can't usually get one without a degree, and judging by the spelling on your site, I'd be amazed if you had one of those.
That's all.
But Im sure you've looked into all that silly legal stuff.
Wow. You're the most immature moron I've seen around here in a while. People that have ACTUALLY DONE WORK in the game industry have given you advice to start on a smaller project and how to help out, yet you say we're all just insulting you? I hate to sound like too big of an asshole, but judging by your avatar you definitely aren't ready to make a game. Who knows what your programmers can do, but there's a very slim chance that you'll succeed considering you have no experience.
I don't mean to insult you. Just encourage you to take a different approach to your business goals. Your website and forum have nothing and could have been created just today from an idea you decided on yesterday. Not that it was, but just the way it appears. That's not much of an invitation.
And the inability to delete or atleast lock a thread is kinda stupid. Why did this happen?
I value all views from people who have been in the industry, especially so now, and I would love to talk about the ins and outs of game developement with anyone willing to answer my questions.
and I suppose:
"You can't usually get one without a degree, and judging by the spelling on your site, I'd be amazed if you had one of those."
was an experience derived suggestion around game developement brought on by an interesting thread.
So maybe you have changed my mind, perhaps now I am leaning towards something smaller. would anyone like to offer some sound advice please?
Design a really cool single-player game. Good single player experiences are thin on the ground these days.
A proof-of-concept FPS single player game with a good engine, 2 or 3 different maps/levels, a few different enemies and some innovative ideas will be much easier and faster to produce than an MMO, and if you get an effective working "demo", you can show it off to publishers and maybe get some interest and funding, if it's good enough.
It's gonna be tough whatever you do, though, if you're determined to get something "real" produced and start a business. Free mods for existing games are easier to do and just as fun to work on, they give a similar experience to the people working on the game, too.
It'll be an uphill battle if you want to publish your game, whatever it may be.
so walking with the FPS pathway for a moment, which would you prefer, having inovation in terms of physical things such as Physics and dynamic creations or having a very immersive stoyline, (thinking metal ear solid)?
not that i'm saying both at the same time aren't possible
Environmental interaction is a key issue these days with FPS single-player games ... players want to be able to touch and use pretty much everything that isn't nailed down in the game. I don't know why, but players find it fun to kick cardboard boxes and shoot cola cans when they make a cool noise and bounce around.
Whatever you do, just don't have bottles/magazines/items lying on tables or floors that don't move when touched or shot at - that makes people go "gah, I'm just playing a game, this isn't real at all!".
Replies
i dont see anything whatsoever on your site or the forums?
sorry, just a quick bit of constructive criticism... the "Where games are meant to be experienced." thing on your site sounds extremely cheesy. aren't all games meant to be experienced? isn't everything in the universe meant to be experienced?
i do like your tutorial on max viewports though, good refresher
i think it might be a little unrealistic to be creating an mmorpg at this point. consider all the assets to be created, the time, the staff needed, and the money. who is going to fund such a large project? if you pull it off, i will be impressed.
"Plus we are also going to be selling training dvd's to cover some cost's of startup and to generate some cash flow."
No disrespect intended, but this is mightily naiive. You would have to be providing some artistic or technical expertise in those DVD's that was absolutely top notch and VERY highly sought after to be able to warrant selling them. There are a gazillion FREE high quality tutorials all over the internet covering all aspects of computer graphics created by extremely experienced and talented people. Being able to actually market your expertise as a commodity would require that you are in the absolute top of your craft in CG and a name to boot.
Seriously you'll never achieve anything with such absurdly lofty goals.
And cut it out with the 'jobs' crap unless you're an established company looking for employees.
Aim for something realistic and you might actually achieve something. Currently you're doomed before you've even begun.
Tone down the arrogance and make a mod of an existing game.
I'm not trying to flame you. You need a reality check for your own good.
Just some ideas to throw at here ...
THEY USUALLY FAIL AND THE MMORPG ATTEMPT WAS NO MORE THAN A TRY FOR FORUM RECRUITMENT (no i don't mean this)
Things like that can't be taught they have to be learned and experienced so that you KNOW, not fear, KNOW that the shit ur working on is NOT gonna happen, its usefull to know these things so that in the future you don't put 100% of your faith into something that is destined to fail.
I encourage you guys to go on with it and make your MMO, and if you succeed GREAT, if you don't, hopefully you learn your lesson, but keep at it and make more stuff.
Cheers to Ramucho for linking this in #md
Please, please, please prove all of us wrong, i would love to see it, I beg of you
btw how much will the radio video tutorial cost to purchase on DVD?
the radio thing is free, take it
I just finished my first game after 3 years of development over the net, and I can tell you without a doubt you will not be able to finish such a massive project over the internet. I am not even going to go into the massive server costs, how hard it is going to be market (with a mmo, if there are not many people playing you don't get more people playing, its either a sucecss for a complete failure). To keep your game online you need to pay a massive amount of server fees, to pay these server fees you need a large fan base, to get a large fan base it needs to be better than what professionals create (by professionals i mean people who are actually in the industry).
Internet developers need to innovate, they need to make products the industry won't create, SIMPLY because there is no way an internet developer can make the same quality games as the industry.
There is no chance you are going to get a major publisher as an internet team, it has never happened and I doubt if it ever will. Massive corporations do not put in hundreds of thousands of dollars into a project like that simply because it has to many legal problems.
I see you have the stance that you won't listen to anyone and you'll show them. Listen to Daz, he is in the industry, he knows what he is talking about, be realistic and stop chasing insane dreams.
Obviously this post won't help you or anything because after not listening to the above posts there is no reason to listen to this, but I had to rant about this somewhere.
and i speak from experience i KNOW hor hard it is to make MMO's first hand.
start on something small, then work up, MMO's are the hardest for real expereienced companys to do even.
Listen, I wish you the best of luck mate honestly.
Your ambition is not in question. Your sense of reality is. If you'd ever gone through a videogame production process you'd know exactly what I meant. I offer my apologies since I didn't realise you had a huge staff of highly skilled software engineers, artists, designers, sound specialists, producers, your own game engine and the extremely high end technical prowess and server overhead needed for an mmorpg at your disposal.
A bunch of the guys here are working on Imperator. Check it out: http://www.imperatoronline.com/
I look forward to the DVD's.
I am not talking directly about this project, this is another general rant.
we are going to buy premises in Washington state, and begin life as a games developer hiring as and when we need to.
[/ QUOTE ]
Wait a minute. Didn't your sig say earlier that you were in England? Are you English? You have a greencard then right?
IMO that is.
The world is not all Flower and butterfly anyway.
I get tons of thoses " WERE ARE A NEW STARTUP COMPANY CURRENTLY CREATING A MMORPG"' Why would you be any different anyway.
BAH I say.
b1ll
That's all.
But Im sure you've looked into all that silly legal stuff.
simple
And the inability to delete or atleast lock a thread is kinda stupid. Why did this happen?
and I suppose:
"You can't usually get one without a degree, and judging by the spelling on your site, I'd be amazed if you had one of those."
was an experience derived suggestion around game developement brought on by an interesting thread.
So maybe you have changed my mind, perhaps now I am leaning towards something smaller. would anyone like to offer some sound advice please?
A proof-of-concept FPS single player game with a good engine, 2 or 3 different maps/levels, a few different enemies and some innovative ideas will be much easier and faster to produce than an MMO, and if you get an effective working "demo", you can show it off to publishers and maybe get some interest and funding, if it's good enough.
It's gonna be tough whatever you do, though, if you're determined to get something "real" produced and start a business. Free mods for existing games are easier to do and just as fun to work on, they give a similar experience to the people working on the game, too.
It'll be an uphill battle if you want to publish your game, whatever it may be.
Good luck.
so walking with the FPS pathway for a moment, which would you prefer, having inovation in terms of physical things such as Physics and dynamic creations or having a very immersive stoyline, (thinking metal ear solid)?
not that i'm saying both at the same time aren't possible
Environmental interaction is a key issue these days with FPS single-player games ... players want to be able to touch and use pretty much everything that isn't nailed down in the game. I don't know why, but players find it fun to kick cardboard boxes and shoot cola cans when they make a cool noise and bounce around.
Whatever you do, just don't have bottles/magazines/items lying on tables or floors that don't move when touched or shot at - that makes people go "gah, I'm just playing a game, this isn't real at all!".
Know what I mean?
*** You are ignoring this user ***
-R
pak?
pak?
pak?
are you hearing me?
I am only ignoring one user and it's not KDR.
[/ QUOTE ]