"It's dead, Jim"
polycounter lvl 18
I know there are so big Star Trek and relates sci-fi fans here, so for those who care:
http://www.trektoday.com/news/020205_04.shtml
I didn't follow the show myself, but generally feel that nearly twenty consecutive years with one Star Trek or another on television was bound to result in declining interest. I gather quality was also an issue, but I haven't seen anything I'd consider to be a good offering from Star Trek since First Contact.
http://www.trektoday.com/news/020205_04.shtml
I didn't follow the show myself, but generally feel that nearly twenty consecutive years with one Star Trek or another on television was bound to result in declining interest. I gather quality was also an issue, but I haven't seen anything I'd consider to be a good offering from Star Trek since First Contact.
Replies
as for voyager and ds9, i enjoyed them both.. if you're gonna be a fanboi about it complain all you want, but they were both good shows...
as for enterprise, it was always on a shitty station at bad hours (for me at least), so i never watched it.
I loved the movies.
I really loved (except for a few episodes) TNG.
DS9 did not have me at first, but at some point it evolved into a pretty damn good show.
I did not really like Voyager ever, but when they got into the Borg vs "those aliens that hunted the Borg" vs "those aliens who lived for the hunt" I was kinda interested. I never really liked the whole concept of the terrorists becoming part of the crew and them working together.
I watched much of the first season of Enterprise, but sattelite issues have prevented me from watching anything else of it. What I saw was okay, but it didn't really blow my skirt up much. The whole idea of going back to the past seemed pretty lame to me.
They shouldn't be looking for the gimmick. Ahh in Voyager we have the first woman captain in the series! Big deal, just make a series called Star Trek The Next Generation II and run with it. Crank out the same old shit and I would be happy. Get some fresh young sci-fi writers in there and stick with the tried and true!
anyway my 2cents.
Star Trek has not evolved with society. The original Star Trek was ahead of its time. New technology concepts the world had never seen. TNG was much more highly polished, with an excellent cast, characters with depth, and a well scripted storyline...and the BORG. TNG showed us the perils within deep space exploration. No naked painted ladies, and furry Kooshball creatures. The rest...blah. Like watching Days of our Lives, in space. SciFi needs to raise the bar.
No furry Kooshball creatures.
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remind me to kick your ass for insulting the tribbles
I really learned to love Q, Data and Worf but it's failings by midway through were clear to me when Babylon5 came on the scene and demonstrated imo how it should be done.
I felt angry about DS9 ripping the B5 idea, but as Duke mentioned DS9 improved later on and had a couple of key characters. Likewise voyager became intersting when the Borg killers came into it.
Enterprise showed how grasping and inept the people in control of Star Trek were, too scared to try something new, too unsure of what worked in the past to capitalise on the old.
I think, all of Star Trek was at its best when you felt, as a viewer, that it actually mattered a fuck what happened that episode or film.
As was mentioned, First Contact was amazing. They had their backs against the wall, things got dark, tempers frayed and there was a sense that there was something both to lose and to win.
This was what I enjoyed about Babylon5 and Farscape. The crews were made up of expendable humans , whether they were aliens or not, they were fragile and human.
For a show that has always espoused the notion of what is best in humanity, I always thought it did a damn good job of ignoring everything I considered to be good about humanity!
While I can't really say I'm glad its done with as I haven't watched it in years and thus have little stake in it's well being... I hope this clears the way for something new, something a little bit more pertinent to modern times.
'She cannae take much more captain!'
I loved the whole Kirk 'thing'. I watched very expisode, even that awful pilot without Kirk.
'She cannae take much more captain!'
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BROTHER!
If I may so bold to introduce a quote from another movie that best describes the "Kirk"
"We are men of action. Lying does not become us."
Kirk was the man of action. He did what was necessary to solve the situation at the time, Prime Directive be damned!
Although I realize now he would never have been allowed to violate it EVERY EPISODE it did give you a sense of satisfaction to see him do the right thing, cut through the bullshit and come off clean
I always really liked Picard, but I really grew tired of his "Always go by the book and everything will be alright" method of doing things. I believe Picard secretly was ready to violate anything given the right circumstances!
Also, this.
Never was there a better engineer or 3rd in command than Lt Commander Montgomery Scott!
If Kirk said "Scotty, General order blah blah in 24 hours" Then Scotty was going to destroy that planet in 24 hours, bet your life! Mr Scott is the character who said "The best diplomat I now is a fully charged phaser bank." Mr Scott said "I'll not lower the shields on the word of that mealy mouthed gentleman below." I always felt that the Enterprise was in good hands under tha command of Mr Scott.
So let it be known, if the Kirk Enterpise and crew came into the future and got into a fight with TNG, DS9 or Voyager...I'm betting on the old guys!
I felt angry about DS9 ripping the B5 idea
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How's that? DS9 premiered in January 1993, more than a month before the first B5 movie aired.
"We are men of action. Lying does not become us."
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"True Love is the greatest thing in the world ... except for a nice MLT - mutton, lettuce and tomato sandwich ... when the mutton is nice and lean and the tomato's ripe. They're so perky. I love that."
It seems quite likely to me that these two series were developed without any relationship to each other at all. I mean, c'mon. Star Trek was at the height of it's popularity then - ST:TNG was in its fifth season and Generations planned, the franchise was thriving, Paramount greenlighted a sequel series. Star Trek was the undisputed king of small-screen sci-fi. Knowing this, knowing they were helming a massively successful franchise they'd eprsonally rejuvenated, the Paramount powers-that-be decided they couldn't come up with a decent series idea on their own, and that the best option was to rip off a little known TV writer who's most famous works to that point include the He-Man and She-Ra cartoons along with a fistful of 'Murder, She Wrote' episodes?
I believe the stagnation in the Star Trek franchise is partly due to the arrogant refusal to bring in any new blood. They have used and reused and re-reused their own content ad nauseum, even gimmick casting TNG actors into Enterprise roles. Nothing new or original or outside the ST hivemind ever gets produced. I can see no scenario at all in which Rick Berman and company actually decided someone else's idea was so cool they had to steal it.
For the record, I don't know exactly what Ror was referring to. He might be meaning the Dominion War plotline, which was written after B5's Shadow War was under way, in which case he might well be correct. But the basic premise of the series? I really don't see any way at all that is was a ripoff.
the defiant was introduced because fans and the producers thought they needed a better way to get people off the station and into jeopardy without resorting to the runabouts.
enterprise i think had a decent enough concept, to show how the federation formed and first contact with the klingons and andorians and so on, but it was ruined by the shitty temporal cold war crap and the xindi bollocks in season 3.
they should've been doing the stuff of season 4 in the first two seasons.
[edited for bad spelling]
Before attending The academy, he was a slave in the Ferengi Sex Industry,
But Through his cunning and raw intellect, escaped and went to Starfleet academy where he was able to get a scholership and eventually graduated with top honors. After school he decided to help spread literacy through out the known universe, But don't take my word for it....
But after losing his eyesight in an accident he got those cool glasses that my mom use to put in her hair in the eighties, and the rest is history...
How funny.
tpe
I'm actually glad to see Enterprise go, because it let me down every single damn time. Every time the script had a wide-open opportunity to do something blatantly historical or referential to early Trek lore, they'd just wander off into space and roll the credits. I think there was even an episode that came this close to Archer starting to think about a Prime Directive, but they mentioned the idea and then dropped it entirely, like no conversation had happened. They had all that history to draw on, and obviously nobody ever consulted the legions of Trekkies out there who have already thought about ALL of that stuff. They just made up their own junk.
Phooey! Trek will live on, it just needs to go regroup for a good while.
/jzero
while not the best show ever, it was still entertaining for me
i liked season 3 alot
the episode when archer punched the andorian captain in the face had me all like "OOOOHHH SHIIIITTT!!!"
the episode with the green dudes running the slave trading, when he picked up Tupol and her ginormous implants were being squeezed up, on her petite frame, that was the money shot for me heh
I wish Activision would get Ritual to get BoBo to make EF3 with the crew of Enterprise, but itll never happen, bastards
verm, as for B5, check the 2nd post here for an indication of how Paramount acquired the material, and this post by Joe should answer the questions you posed above. [edit] ..and this post highlights the apparent network antics that were going on at the time.[/edit]
honestly, what star trek needs a completely new direction. First contact was something awesome about its incredible darkness showing not the good of humanity with flashy prime directives and flashie ass backwards humans with spoons on their forheads.
Something with section 31 would be interesting, maybe the story of an operative, like a spy or maybe even an assasin walking the thin line between protecting security of the federation and a secret police state. Put a facist spin of the federation like in undiscovered country. With internal plots and dirty schemes, pealing back the utopia to expose it's bloody inside.
Less boyscouts and more gestopo would do it well.
verm, as for B5, check the 2nd post here for an indication of how Paramount acquired the material, and this post by Joe should answer the questions you posed above. [edit] ..and this post highlights the apparent network antics that were going on at the time.[/edit]
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Haha - wow, that was an interesting read! I guess Ror and Asherr might have pwnz0red me there, I hadn't heard all that before. JMS does make the point that he doesn't *know* what occured, and that he doesn't believe Berman and Pilelr saw his B5 treatment, but it does make for some interesting conspiracy theory. Now that I think about it, I believe I have a vague memory of reading this sort of thing back at the time. I'd just started college/found the internet in 1994, and B5/DS9 were one of the geek topics du jour. I was more into Doom 2 and Heretic at the time to really pay attention, though
voyager at least was doomed to fail, as they couldn't hold a candle to its predecessor: red dwarf. .. jk.
verm: hehe, agreed. same here, except I missed out at the time by not even knowing about some shows because all sci-fi stuff down here was on at rediculous hours on an unpredictable schedule, and I was just out of college, working, and blowing up computer parts in my buddy's garage.
It was fun. Mind you, this is my memory of watching it when I was 13-14 years old, so it probably sucked much, much more than I recall.