Looks good. I'd say the head seems a little large, but I guess it's well within acceptable variance for a realistic human guy.
The edge loops mostly seem good, however I'm not a fan of how you made the shoulders - the edges don't seem to be defining muscle structure there, since the connection to the torso is just like cylindrical segments.
I can't really explain what I mean in words, but if you want me to draw over the image to show what I mean, I could do that. Basically if you're trying to get the edge loops and mesh flow to follow anatomical muscle shapes, an area that isn't quite there yet is the shoulder.
On the whole it's looking good though, keep it up!
Well I guess the next would be for you to start building on details
The anatomy looks great, 'cept that the head seems a bit large to me. As for the edge loops, you have a nice starting point to add more geometry, but there's really not enough there to give a proper crit on.
Or that could just be me ^^;
i agree with everyone else, except for one small thing, and its hard to see from the perspective you have with it
Your forearm is clearly not long enough, look at your own arm...your bicept (or at least mine seems to be) should be about 3/4s length of your forearm. I measured this from below the shoulder to the elbow...and elbow to wrist
Just try and shorten your bicep and lengthen your forearm, and you should be great
Oh and also, it looks as if you are going for ACCURACY rather than a game, so with that, the structure of your forearm is completely off. It should have some kind of swirl within the pollies. As we all know, your forearm can swivel back and forth, and helps with turning and moveing your arm and all. If you want to model him in a relaxed pose, you need to model it in that way. I personally am being a hypocrite, becuase i think i am horrible ar arms and forearms and the anatomy of it, and i also am mean because i have no references for what im talking about
Hopefully one of the more advanced guys will read this and they can get you a picture of what im talking about
Welcome Liquidmetal. Looks like a decent start. One thing Im not sure about here is wether or not you're building this thing to its intended final resolution, or wether or not you're building it with the intent of subdividing or smoothing it?
You see heres the thing. ( and by the way, it is most certainly not my intent is to not rain on your parade nor in any way discourage you. On the contrary ) Its impressive that you have very few non quad polys in your mesh there and are thinking about edge loops. However, the fact of the matter is that that stuff matters so much more with subdivision in mind. If youre modeling a game rez character as is, really you could and should have tris all over the place since thats much more efficient than quads, and then you the artist is deciding which way an edge should be flipped rather than the game engine doing it arbitrarily.
Summary: Edgeloops and quads very much needed for subdivision work, not quite so relevant with game resolution models.
My game resolution models are generally about a 50/50 mix of quads and tris. Triangulated areas around stuff that deforms mainly. The only reason I dont triangulate the entire model is that visually a triangulated model is more 'stuff' to deal with and harder to UV etc.
before i start ranting i might as well post something useful hehe
i agree with Daz - if you're doing stuff for low poly, then build it so it looks correct, and deforms well, with the fewest amount of polys. i've seen some amazing art done with the "worst" lineflow you can imagine. if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
the only tradition edge loop that MIGHT be important that you dont have, is the row of polies that runs around from under the pec, around the end of the deltoid. the more i think about it tho, this isn't super important, especialy if the character isn't ripped.
i'm going to start an argument here... but.. so be it.
edge loops, even for high poly, are seriously over rated, in my opinion. i spent a LOOONNG time trying to figgure out a method for proper line flow. i think that my paranoia came from this whole low poly feild-- an obsession with optimization. the point is, people use edge loops in a lot of cases to isolate shapes and muscle masses- that is, if you have your bicep surrounded by a circle of quads, the arm can move and the bicep will keep it's shape. the problem is of course, if it's keeping it's shape by being defined by a row of polies in a specific part of the model, then there's no way you're going to be able to shape animate the muscle to look like it's moving under the skin. if the bicep is isolated with a circle of polies, so that it's got a sharp edge next to the elbow, then it's always going to have the crease next to the elbow, even if you want the bicep to flex properly..
i spent all sorts of time trying to figgure out how to model in the serratus muscles, (spelling?) and all the back muscles, etc. the problem is that when you have nice, clean lineflow where every single damn muscle is isolated, then you can't make it appear like the skin's moving over top of the muscle.
i remember seing a really good thred on cgtalk by steven stalberg about throwing this concept of keeping your model quads to the wind as well.. but i'll leave that out for now.
ive read that topic on cgtalk as well ...
i think the main trouble is there is 2 different explainations for edge loop modeling ,
1: is the flow of polys (tri or quad) follows the general flow of the muscle groups . (this is stalbergs method)
2: a model is literaly made of loops of edges , that join up at either end .. and detail is added by adding loops inbetween , in an attempt to maintain a clean structure..
neither is right or wrong , and i dont think my explaination for either is very good , basicly ill shut my trap.
first , Liquid metal - its looking really good ... i would agree , the shoulder area needs some work , the second pic is looking better .. but it still wouldnt deform very well rigged... no doubt Mop will do a good explaination of what to do ...
Well, dont give up on the quad thing liquidmetal. Just stick this aside as a model intended to be subdivided or smoothed, and dont worry about quads so much with a game spec model.
Replies
The edge loops mostly seem good, however I'm not a fan of how you made the shoulders - the edges don't seem to be defining muscle structure there, since the connection to the torso is just like cylindrical segments.
I can't really explain what I mean in words, but if you want me to draw over the image to show what I mean, I could do that. Basically if you're trying to get the edge loops and mesh flow to follow anatomical muscle shapes, an area that isn't quite there yet is the shoulder.
On the whole it's looking good though, keep it up!
MoP
The anatomy looks great, 'cept that the head seems a bit large to me. As for the edge loops, you have a nice starting point to add more geometry, but there's really not enough there to give a proper crit on.
Or that could just be me ^^;
Looks like a normal sized man. Looks good, good job. Should start with some details now too
Your forearm is clearly not long enough, look at your own arm...your bicept (or at least mine seems to be) should be about 3/4s length of your forearm. I measured this from below the shoulder to the elbow...and elbow to wrist
Just try and shorten your bicep and lengthen your forearm, and you should be great
Oh and also, it looks as if you are going for ACCURACY rather than a game, so with that, the structure of your forearm is completely off. It should have some kind of swirl within the pollies. As we all know, your forearm can swivel back and forth, and helps with turning and moveing your arm and all. If you want to model him in a relaxed pose, you need to model it in that way. I personally am being a hypocrite, becuase i think i am horrible ar arms and forearms and the anatomy of it, and i also am mean because i have no references for what im talking about
Hopefully one of the more advanced guys will read this and they can get you a picture of what im talking about
Slipstream:Alright I toned down the head a bit.
Adam:Yea,this is still a wip.
DarthRevanII:I get you,but I am thinking of redoing the entire arm because there are to many "rings".
Pics are coming soon.
Edit:Here are the pics.
You see heres the thing. ( and by the way, it is most certainly not my intent is to not rain on your parade nor in any way discourage you. On the contrary ) Its impressive that you have very few non quad polys in your mesh there and are thinking about edge loops. However, the fact of the matter is that that stuff matters so much more with subdivision in mind. If youre modeling a game rez character as is, really you could and should have tris all over the place since thats much more efficient than quads, and then you the artist is deciding which way an edge should be flipped rather than the game engine doing it arbitrarily.
Summary: Edgeloops and quads very much needed for subdivision work, not quite so relevant with game resolution models.
My game resolution models are generally about a 50/50 mix of quads and tris. Triangulated areas around stuff that deforms mainly. The only reason I dont triangulate the entire model is that visually a triangulated model is more 'stuff' to deal with and harder to UV etc.
Am I making any sense?
i agree with Daz - if you're doing stuff for low poly, then build it so it looks correct, and deforms well, with the fewest amount of polys. i've seen some amazing art done with the "worst" lineflow you can imagine. if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
the only tradition edge loop that MIGHT be important that you dont have, is the row of polies that runs around from under the pec, around the end of the deltoid. the more i think about it tho, this isn't super important, especialy if the character isn't ripped.
i'm going to start an argument here... but.. so be it.
edge loops, even for high poly, are seriously over rated, in my opinion. i spent a LOOONNG time trying to figgure out a method for proper line flow. i think that my paranoia came from this whole low poly feild-- an obsession with optimization. the point is, people use edge loops in a lot of cases to isolate shapes and muscle masses- that is, if you have your bicep surrounded by a circle of quads, the arm can move and the bicep will keep it's shape. the problem is of course, if it's keeping it's shape by being defined by a row of polies in a specific part of the model, then there's no way you're going to be able to shape animate the muscle to look like it's moving under the skin. if the bicep is isolated with a circle of polies, so that it's got a sharp edge next to the elbow, then it's always going to have the crease next to the elbow, even if you want the bicep to flex properly..
i spent all sorts of time trying to figgure out how to model in the serratus muscles, (spelling?) and all the back muscles, etc. the problem is that when you have nice, clean lineflow where every single damn muscle is isolated, then you can't make it appear like the skin's moving over top of the muscle.
my foolishness expressed here:
http://student.vfs.com/~3d45john/bodies.jpg
Liquidmetal- you might find that useful. also, this, maybe:
http://student.vfs.com/~3d45john/tut/tut.htm
but be warned, it's not a user friendly (or artist friendly hehe) tutorial.
anyone have any thoughts on this?
i remember seing a really good thred on cgtalk by steven stalberg about throwing this concept of keeping your model quads to the wind as well.. but i'll leave that out for now.
i think the main trouble is there is 2 different explainations for edge loop modeling ,
1: is the flow of polys (tri or quad) follows the general flow of the muscle groups . (this is stalbergs method)
2: a model is literaly made of loops of edges , that join up at either end .. and detail is added by adding loops inbetween , in an attempt to maintain a clean structure..
neither is right or wrong , and i dont think my explaination for either is very good , basicly ill shut my trap.
first , Liquid metal - its looking really good ... i would agree , the shoulder area needs some work , the second pic is looking better .. but it still wouldnt deform very well rigged... no doubt Mop will do a good explaination of what to do ...