Beginner's head

Cirmius

Hi,

Can't tell if this section is better for my question or technical talk. I started learning sculpting like a week ago and I'm stuck at my first work. I decided to do focus on the Dante's face. This is my reference:

And this is my work.

I am focusing just on the face. I know that I probably should work on forehead and lips location, but I don't know really whats next. I watched some tutorials but none of them told me when I should rely on normal texture of skin and how to get rid of this "smoothness" (brushes maybe?) but without getting in other extreme (I mean squareness).

Alex_J

You're making the mistake all beginners make: working at too high subdivision and not focusing on proportions and planes of the face.

I'd drop this thing down to a cube, subdivide it only 1-3 times, then work only with the move brush. If you get the fundamental shape of the face right it will look like dante even though it's very low poly. If you don't get that stage right, it will always look bad.

Eyes, lips, nose - these are all complex shapes in their own worthy of weeks of practice. So start out by just focusing on the overall shape first. Get that right and you'll have much better jumping off point to go further.

Cirmius

Alex Javor said:

You're making the mistake all beginners make: working at too high subdivision and not focusing on proportions and planes of the face.

I'd drop this thing down to a cube, subdivide it only 1-3 times, then work only with the move brush. If you get the fundamental shape of the face right it will look like dante even though it's very low poly. If you don't get that stage right, it will always look bad.

Eyes, lips, nose - these are all complex shapes in their own worthy of weeks of practice. So start out by just focusing on the overall shape first. Get that right and you'll have much better jumping off point to go further.

Thank you, I'll focus on that. But whats next to do in that point further?

Alex_J

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/4b1Xek

this is the idea ^

Crazy_pixel

When you making a face grab more references as just a front image.
 Side view and 3\4 view is also really important. And yeah work first on the overall shapes ( as you mentioned, chin, forehead, lips etc.) and then start detailing if you want. 

When you really stuck, you can also start over from scratch to have a fresh pair of eye's for your work

kanga

Good idea to mention the app you are working in. It helps give you better advice.

Seems like in your first post you are worried by the roughness and fine detail of the skin when that should be your last concern at the moment. Looks like you are in zBrush using a dynamesh. There are loads of tutorials on yt that use this method and its ok if the artist is experienced. I don't use it because it doesn't allow me to go up and down in subDs.

If you are doing a face then its best to do the whole head. You will work much better on an entire skull then just a part of it. That is unless you are making part studies like eyes, ears and nose.

If you are in zBrush you can start off with a cube or with a zsphere. If you are in a 3d app like Blender you can start off with a cube or a sphere, but when you start sculpting you will have to transform the basic shape into a dynamesh which means you cant juggle the resolution of your sculpt without loosing detail.

Like Alex Javor said, map out the shape at its lowest level until you have a good general form. Here is one in zB using zspheres. To get between the 2nd and 3rd step I first sculpted (mostly using the move brush) the base mesh in zB to a general form and then GoZeded the model to Blender and  just poly edited it to add and delete verts and loops where I needed to, then GoZeded it back to zB for sub division and sculpting. In Blender I deleted half the figure, lined up all the centre verts and used a symmetry modifier to get a symmetrical base mesh. Zspheres are generally symmetrical but not perfectly. People are not symmetrical, but in the first stages of modelling them its way easier to have a symmetrical mesh and add asymmetry at a later stage.

 If you are just starting, attempting a likeness is very difficult. Its really a lot faster to develop your character modelling skills by using a generic, young, attractive subject. Making celebrity or character likenesses really only works when you can first produce a good generic figure, or face. This goes doubly for monsters. 99% of all successful monster characters have a sound base in anatomy and volume. So probably a good idea to put likeness studies on the back burner for now.

You can get a good end result by using image grids in zB or image planes in another 3d app. To get reference shots you can use a free program like Daz3D. Here is a pic of the viewport with the textures disabled for easier form representation. The Genesis models are based on 3D scans.

You can take orthographic screen shots to use on your reference planes.

Once you have front, left, right, back, top and bottom you can set up your planes. This is in zB but you can do the same in which ever 3D app yu wish.

Using these views will only get you so far. Another great aid is to download a free skeleton from the web and place it under your model. This helps you to get an all round reference instead of just the 90 degree views from the planes.

When you are ready to try likenesses then a great method is to get some film footage and place the movie under zB. You can make the zB UI transparent with a slider at the top right corner. Here is a capture using zspheres and the Merlin character. The film underneath cant be captured but it is there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSYH9NYFoes

Cheerio and hope this helps.

Cirmius

kanga said:

Good idea to mention the app you are working in. It helps give you better advice.

Seems like in your first post you are worried by the roughness and fine detail of the skin when that should be your last concern at the moment. Looks like you are in zBrush using a dynamesh. There are loads of tutorials on yt that use this method and its ok if the artist is experienced. I don't use it because it doesn't allow me to go up and down in subDs.

If you are doing a face then its best to do the whole head. You will work much better on an entire skull then just a part of it. That is unless you are making part studies like eyes, ears and nose.

If you are in zBrush you can start off with a cube or with a zsphere. If you are in a 3d app like Blender you can start off with a cube or a sphere, but when you start sculpting you will have to transform the basic shape into a dynamesh which means you cant juggle the resolution of your sculpt without loosing detail.

Like Alex Javor said, map out the shape at its lowest level until you have a good general form. Here is one in zB using zspheres. To get between the 2nd and 3rd step I first sculpted (mostly using the move brush) the base mesh in zB to a general form and then GoZeded the model to Blender and  just poly edited it to add and delete verts and loops where I needed to, then GoZeded it back to zB for sub division and sculpting. In Blender I deleted half the figure, lined up all the centre verts and used a symmetry modifier to get a symmetrical base mesh. Zspheres are generally symmetrical but not perfectly. People are not symmetrical, but in the first stages of modelling them its way easier to have a symmetrical mesh and add asymmetry at a later stage.

 If you are just starting, attempting a likeness is very difficult. Its really a lot faster to develop your character modelling skills by using a generic, young, attractive subject. Making celebrity or character likenesses really only works when you can first produce a good generic figure, or face. This goes doubly for monsters. 99% of all successful monster characters have a sound base in anatomy and volume. So probably a good idea to put likeness studies on the back burner for now.

You can get a good end result by using image grids in zB or image planes in another 3d app. To get reference shots you can use a free program like Daz3D. Here is a pic of the viewport with the textures disabled for easier form representation. The Genesis models are based on 3D scans.

You can take orthographic screen shots to use on your reference planes.

Once you have front, left, right, back, top and bottom you can set up your planes. This is in zB but you can do the same in which ever 3D app yu wish.

Using these views will only get you so far. Another great aid is to download a free skeleton from the web and place it under your model. This helps you to get an all round reference instead of just the 90 degree views from the planes.

When you are ready to try likenesses then a great method is to get some film footage and place the movie under zB. You can make the zB UI transparent with a slider at the top right corner. Here is a capture using zspheres and the Merlin character. The film underneath cant be captured but it is there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSYH9NYFoes

Cheerio and hope this helps.

So powerful answer, thank you!! Just a short question about workflow.

1. References should be ortographic / with long focal length, but if I don't have good references like these, should I sculpt in perspective mode or not? And generally should I always sculpt in perspective mode? Is there any situation in which I should sculpt without perspective mode?

2. To make sure if I understand correctly:

the lines are the overlapping spheres or is it one long cylinder?

and the color is differencing mesh/poly groups?