Average starting salary for Germany?

wirrexx

Hey Guys, last thread i saw about similiar question was in 2013. So i wanted to know if some of you guys have any idea of what the average salary is in German. 

What would you ask for? 

Berlin? Hamburg? Frankfurt and Munich!

defragger

I found salary information for Europe and US (15.07.2018). Not entirely sure if this is correct though!

Apparently in Europe the average salary for an Artist is 41.280 USD (36.480 Euro).

In the US average is 74.349 USD.

Art Directors with more than six years of experience in the US are listed at 110.000 USD average.

Keep in mind that Berlin, Hamburg, Frankfurt and Munich are very expensive cities to live in!!

I lived in Munich ten years ago. Real estate prices were already crazy back then. Can't imagine what it must be like today.

wirrexx

defragger said:

I found salary information for Europe and US (15.07.2018). Not entirely sure if this is correct though!

Apparently in Europe the average salary for an Artist is 41.280 USD (36.480 Euro).

In the US average is 74.349 USD.

Art Directors with more than six years of experience in the US are listed at 110.000 USD average.

Keep in mind that Berlin, Hamburg, Frankfurt and Munich are very expensive cities to live in!!

I lived in Munich ten years ago. Real estate prices were already crazy back then. Can't imagine what it must be like today.

Yeah i come from sweden but live in germany so its quite the opposite for me, where germany is cheaper! 

Thank you!

goekbenjamin

what would be the calculation for "per month", my fellow german artists?
Divide it by 12 months??

Biomag

goekbenjamin said:

what would be the calculation for "per month", my fellow german artists?
Divide it by 12 months??

Yup. The 13th and 14th salaries you are thinking about are something specific to Austria. There might be some bonus payments for Christmas / vacations, but not the way you have it, where you get 2 full additional payments with lower tax-rates.

goekbenjamin

@Biomag
How did you know that about austria? are you are fellow austrian?
Thanks for clarification on this one!

~ 3.000€ is not bad, but i think those salaries are so high only for senior artists i guess

Biomag

Not an Austrian myself, but I've lived and worked there for a veeeeery long time

wirrexx

Good Information, so thank you guys. But still Vague on what one could ask for without coming forward of being to greedy. 

oglu

In Austria there are guidelines how much you should get paid.
Here is the labour union contract for Advertising and Communication.

https://www.wko.at/service/kollektivvertrag/werbung-marktkommunikation-gehaltstabelle-2018.pdf

https://www.wko.at/service/kollektivvertrag/kv-angestellte-werbung-marktkommunikation-wien.html#heading_Abschlussprotokoll_zum_Kollektivvertrag_Werbung_und_Marktkommunikation_Wien_2018__Beschluss_des_Fachgruppenausschusses_vom_31__Jaenner_2018_

Zi0

In the Netherlands its around €1800 a month, I guess it should be something similar in Germany.

wirrexx

Zi0 said:

In the Netherlands its around €1800 a month, I guess it should be something similar in Germany.

Could be, but for an example, Hamburg is 25% more expensive then berlin when it comes to living (Apartment) and up too 10 % more expensive for food. You would barely be able to survive on 1800 a month (if that's the brutto). 

goekbenjamin

Wow, never thought that hamburg is more expensive than berlin!?
So the salary in hamburg is also generally higher than in berlin? adjust by the high costs in hamburg?

wirrexx

goekbenjamin said:

Wow, never thought that hamburg is more expensive than berlin!?
So the salary in hamburg is also generally higher than in berlin? adjust by the high costs in hamburg?

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Germany&city1=Berlin&country2=Germany&city2=Hamburg

Zi0

wirrexx said:

Zi0 said:

In the Netherlands its around €1800 a month, I guess it should be something similar in Germany.

Could be, but for an example, Hamburg is 25% more expensive then berlin when it comes to living (Apartment) and up too 10 % more expensive for food. You would barely be able to survive on 1800 a month (if that's the brutto). 

Sorry, I forgot to add that I meant Netto

Neox

goekbenjamin said:

Wow, never thought that hamburg is more expensive than berlin!?
So the salary in hamburg is also generally higher than in berlin? adjust by the high costs in hamburg?

don't worry berlin is ramping up...
new rental contracts are madness, while berlin isn't anywhere near the top 50 most expensive cities in germany. those numbers are average. the past few years you could see many things double and triple their prices. the average cold rent is supposed to be 6,50 € per m² cold. while it is close to impossible to get any new deal below 10 € per m². You nowadays have to move outside the inner city if you dont wanna audition with dozens to a hundred people for a small one bedroom appartment... its madness
Don't get me started on office rental prices, when we searched last time 12,- per m² have been one the higher end for a non fancy space, now 30,- is the average... and we are talking of timespans below 5 years.
what happens here with office and living spaces is insane, hambirg has that better under control. i hope berlin will soon also forbid empty spaces for speculation, that should level the costs a bit again

goekbenjamin

Neox said:

goekbenjamin said:

Wow, never thought that hamburg is more expensive than berlin!?
So the salary in hamburg is also generally higher than in berlin? adjust by the high costs in hamburg?

don't worry berlin is ramping up...
new rental contracts are madness, while berlin isn't anywhere near the top 50 most expensive cities in germany. those numbers are average. the past few years you could see many things double and triple their prices. the average cold rent is supposed to be 6,50 € per m² cold. while it is close to impossible to get any new deal below 10 € per m². You nowadays have to move outside the inner city if you wanna audition with dozens to a hundred people for a small one bedroom appartment... its madness
Don't get me started on office rental prices, when we searched last time 12,- per m² have been one the higher end for a non fancy space, now 30,- is the average... and we are talking of timespans below 5 years.
what happens here with office and living spaces is insane, hambirg has that better under control. i hope berlin will soon also forbid empty spaces for speculation, that should level the costs a bit again

ok das ist echt heftig!
and i was thinking austria was expensive!

musashidan

Zi0 said:

In the Netherlands its around €1800 a month, I guess it should be something similar in Germany.

That's shockingly bad considering the rate in the Netherlands for formwork carpentry, at the moment, is 1100euro a week.

defragger

musashidan said:

Zi0 said:

In the Netherlands its around €1800 a month, I guess it should be something similar in Germany.

That's shockingly bad considering the rate in the Netherlands for formwork carpentry, at the moment, is 1100euro a week.

he meant € 1800 after tax (net).

I also didn't notice at first because it's really weird to look at net salary. Salary is always stated pre-tax because taxes are different for everyone.

To get € 1100 net a week (4400 euro month) in germany you would need to make € 7800 a month pre-tax. So I'm pretty sure you mean € 1100 pre-tax.

We are looking at:

€ 2700 pre-tax starting salary for an artist in germany

€ 4400 pre-tax formwork carpentry in the netherlands

The avarage salary for an artist in Europe I stated earlier is also pre-tax. About € 3000 a month.

goekbenjamin

so in germany after taxes it is about 1800€/month....
still not soo bad right? but that is not for a senior right, but as "bloody" beginner?

defragger

goekbenjamin said:

so in germany after taxes it is about 1800€/month....
still not soo bad right? but that is not for a senior right, but as "bloody" beginner?

yeah, it's not terrible for a beginner considering it's their first gig.

Of course a senior or lead artist will get a lot more with higher skill level.

goekbenjamin

defragger said:

goekbenjamin said:

so in germany after taxes it is about 1800€/month....
still not soo bad right? but that is not for a senior right, but as "bloody" beginner?

yeah, it's not terrible for a beginner considering it's the first gig.

Of course a senior or lead artist will get a lot more with higher skill level.

but i can think of "bloody beginner" someone who has gained skills and learned software and stuff at home but lacking of exp.
than again the salary would be fair again

defragger

You can think of it as some kind of hurdle.

As soon as you are able to jump it you will get decent money.

The definition of a bloody beginner would be someone who doesn't have the necessary skills yet and therefore is not able to get in at all.

oglu

A Junior or Support Artist does get much less money than a Senior or Lead.
Depending on how fast you learn you can jump up a level every year.
Junior --> Artist --> Senior --> Lead
And on Top extra money  for the years in the company.

To become a Junior or Support you need to be "motivated" and survive the first few month in production. You dont need to know everything. And you dont have to be fast.

goekbenjamin

thst sounds great but i guess when you have to choose between some one who knows nothing and someone who knows a little. and both fits into the team. the one with more knowledge is preffered i think?

Alex_J

On any team there is three types of people.

Those who show up on time and do their work and usually don't cause any issues. This is the backbone of the organization.

Then there are those who create problems either by doing poor work or by causing human drama.

And lastly there are those who make the team better. They learn new things, they teach others, they eliminate problems and keep spirits high.

So think about who you want to be on the team. It's a daily affirmation.

musashidan

defragger said:

musashidan said:

Zi0 said:

In the Netherlands its around €1800 a month, I guess it should be something similar in Germany.

That's shockingly bad considering the rate in the Netherlands for formwork carpentry, at the moment, is 1100euro a week.

he meant € 1800 after tax (net).

I also didn't notice at first because it's really weird to look at net salary. Salary is always stated pre-tax because taxes are different for everyone.

To get € 1100 net a week (4400 euro month) in germany you would need to make € 7800 a month pre-tax. So I'm pretty sure you mean € 1100 pre-tax.

1100 is the take home pay per week. A friend of mine is already over there on a job and that's his salary. This is quite normal for civil construction and actually a lot less than in Australia, for example.

Sorry, a bit off-topic as you're talking about artist salary, but I just thought it no harm to throw in a comparison - even if it will depress a few terribly paid artists.

sacboi

musashidan said:

This is quite normal for civil construction and actually a lot less than in Australia, for example.

Off Topic apologies, but yes I can certainly confirm that, especially if an unskilled role where on average a base GROSS wage will range between AUS$4500k - 5000k+ per fortnight (5 day working week excluding overtime, RDOs, sick leave and holiday pay) working on a Union controlled site specifically for current ongoing major infrastructure projects here in Melbourne and regional Victoria.

musashidan

@sacboi double that with a trade.