Step 1. Stop thinking too much. Save your file with a new name. Then come up with an idea, and just try it. There is nothing to lose.
Okay, so here is the sign.
Step 2. We need that corner to bend. So lets put an edge there and bend it. In Maya I use a tool called multi-cut. In blender, if you don't know what tool to use, do more tutorials.
Step 3. Time for a little elbow grease... hhuuuuurggggh! gaaaaw! phew... Not an easy job but somebody has to do it.
Step four : Clean up the n-gon if you need to. If you are going to subdivide this mesh, you may want to keep even quads. So you can just take the edge across to the other side. You only need to clean up non-silhouette holding vertices for the final game mesh.
final game mesh may look like this. They say long thin triangles can cause some problems. I don't think this will be an issue, but maybe somebody will correct me or show a better way. I think this will be fine though.
If you need to subdivide for sculpting, make an even distribution and use a subdivided/smooth mesh preview to see how it's gonna look. If you are thinking "but why do i need even quads for subdivision?" Well, just subdivide and try to do some sculpting the opposite way of what I'm saying, and you'll see for yourself. Doing things the wrong way is the best way to learn what's right.
If this is going over the head, just do more tutorials. It will become clear after lots of doing -- but only become more confusing by too much idle thinking. Only real geniuses can sit and think about something they have not spent a lot of time doing and come up with good answers. The rest of us have to touch the hot stoves in order to learn. That's just our lot in life.
Remember, understanding comes from doing. So, first do the doing, then comes the understanding, then you won't be tripping yourself up when it's time to stop and do the thinking.
I was in bed this morning and I was thinking I had sort of let the 'geometry myth' get in the way of a good model, by that I meant I realised I was too scared of using a few extra triangles to make up the sign body, as during my earlier years of 3d design I was brain washed by out of date youtube tutorials which were obsessed with polycounts, contantly warning of all hell breaking lose if the polycount goes about 6 polys! so yeah sorry about that if I had just thought about it more logically I wouldnt have needed to post it here, however I find that usually when half way through posting a question I work out the answer myself so maybe the typing here is part of the self diagnosis?
sometimes i can't figure an answer until after i take the time to write it out and post here. No worries. I was hung up about poly counts for awhile too but this place got me squared away pretty quick. I think the easiest way to think about it is "use as much geometry as you need to make it look how you want but not any more than that."
@BIGTIMEMASTER The concept of using only as much resolution as is necessary to achieve the forms you need is true across all the modeling disciplines: whether sculpting, creating optimised game assets, or render-time subdivision assets.
The problem with a lot of beginners to game asset creation is that they haven't experienced the progression of on-card vert allowances over the years with every new gen of PC cards/consoles. This leads them to obsess over 'low-poly'. The low-poly terminology goes all the way back to 1997 when it actually was a strict rule. It only came about because a counterpart 'high-poly' term was born with normal mapping. All those restrictions over the years have eased up greatly as the technology and techniques have evolved.
However, with the advent of mobile gaming there has been a rebirth of the classic 'low-poly' look, even to the point of being its own retro style. So it definitely has its place, but unless you're targeting a strict mobile budget you shouldn't worry about an extra few hundred triangles if it's the difference between a good looking silhouette and an Unreal shoulder pad from '97
It's textures now that are the memory hungry beasts that we have to be mindful of(this is one of the reasons why Substances are so commonly used now. They leave a much smaller memory footprint)
Carefully with this advice though. It is still a good idea so only use as much as necessary, and not leave useless edges. From what I see, there are 2 kinds of people nowadays who are not very clear with how much to use and when. The way too little amount is one, and there is another kind of people who just throws some auto retopo on portfolio pieces and it ends up way higher poly than it should be. ArtStation is flooded by this kind of artworks. Yeah, now there are much less strict limitations, but if people waste a lot of resources on unnecessary geo - because it can handle it without a problem, then they wont be able to use the extra resources elsewhere. There is a midway in this. If resources would be spent wisely, we could see more higher poly things on screen instead of the same amount of things as before, but in higher poly.
100% @obscura optimising the in-game mesh is very much an art in itself, and thankfully, having that experience over the years when budgets were more strict gives us a good advantage ad makes it second nature. Thankfully though, we have enough leeway these days to not have to manually turn edges.
I see the very same thing you mention, lots of edgloops/verts doing nothing. As long as beginners understand the concept of silhouette and how to achieve that with as few verts as needed then that's the mot important thing.
What has helped me a lot is following professional artist streams, as well as looking at the wireframe models from current gen games on art station, coupled with the general advice seen here. Until I started doing that, I was always afraid to add geometry and it really stymied a lot of my earlier models.
Somebody here said once, and maybe it was obscura but could have been somebody else -- one of the usual names you see in technical talk section -- anyway they said that when they were hiring people they always asked the person to justify certain decisions they made about their models, and all they were really looking for is that there is critical thinking involved in all the decision making. So I figure that, for the self-learning artist, chances are you are going to do some things not the smartest way. Or not the most current and up to date way. But as long as you can show that you doing everything with some logical intention, that you aren't just an automaton pushing buttons, then you are doing well.
What has helped me a lot is following professional artist streams, as well as looking at the wireframe models from current gen games on art station, coupled with the general advice seen here. Until I started doing that, I was always afraid to add geometry and it really stymied a lot of my earlier models.
Somebody here said once, and maybe it was obscura but could have been somebody else -- one of the usual names you see in technical talk section -- anyway they said that when they were hiring people they always asked the person to justify certain decisions they made about their models, and all they were really looking for is that there is critical thinking involved in all the decision making. So I figure that, for the self-learning artist, chances are you are going to do some things not the smartest way. Or not the most current and up to date way. But as long as you can show that you doing everything with some logical intention, that you aren't just an automaton pushing buttons, then you are doing well.
I've been following Georgian Avasilcutei lately. He's always working and takes a lot of time to help other artist as well. He does charge like $5 for a month of streaming on twitch but it's well worth it IMO as just watching some professionals work will help clear up a lot of misconceptions and give a better perspective of how this type of work is done.
@BIGTIMEMASTER Great advice, mate. I'm self-taught as well and in my early days I used to soak up the Gnomon dvds.....that came in the post.... (there was no youtube back then. No streaming or video tutorials online, and mostly a handful of written tutorials) Before those dvds I used to buy huge 3dsMax books at an actual bookshop. lol.
What I found with the Gnomon dvds was that they were by industry pros and were very fast, no hand-holding, and were not step-by-step, but rather an overview of an industry pro workflow. I used to almost cry in frustration at first, as so much went over my head, but perseverance and a staunch passion for 3D kept me going. Those Gnomon dvds were absolute gems(particularly the Ian Joyner of Blur Studios ones) and I still consider them to be a 'eureka' moment for me in my learning path.
Even now, after more than a decade I still relish learning new things. 3D is constantly evolving and the learning journey never really ends, it just gets WAY easier. Passion and practice are all it takes, and what you said at the end is key: 'But as long as you can show that you doing everything
with some logical intention, that you aren't just an automaton pushing
buttons, then you are doing well'.
This last is something that I repeat over and over in my own tutorials. Mindless button pushing is a waste of time. The WHY is all important. The good news is that those of you new to 3D have an absolute endless supply of quality learning material at your fingertips. Good to know that you seem to be milking it for all its worth.
Replies
Okay, so here is the sign.
Step 2. We need that corner to bend. So lets put an edge there and bend it. In Maya I use a tool called multi-cut. In blender, if you don't know what tool to use, do more tutorials.
Step 3. Time for a little elbow grease... hhuuuuurggggh! gaaaaw! phew... Not an easy job but somebody has to do it.
Step four : Clean up the n-gon if you need to. If you are going to subdivide this mesh, you may want to keep even quads. So you can just take the edge across to the other side. You only need to clean up non-silhouette holding vertices for the final game mesh.
final game mesh may look like this. They say long thin triangles can cause some problems. I don't think this will be an issue, but maybe somebody will correct me or show a better way. I think this will be fine though.
If you need to subdivide for sculpting, make an even distribution and use a subdivided/smooth mesh preview to see how it's gonna look. If you are thinking "but why do i need even quads for subdivision?" Well, just subdivide and try to do some sculpting the opposite way of what I'm saying, and you'll see for yourself. Doing things the wrong way is the best way to learn what's right.
If this is going over the head, just do more tutorials. It will become clear after lots of doing -- but only become more confusing by too much idle thinking. Only real geniuses can sit and think about something they have not spent a lot of time doing and come up with good answers. The rest of us have to touch the hot stoves in order to learn. That's just our lot in life.
Remember, understanding comes from doing. So, first do the doing, then comes the understanding, then you won't be tripping yourself up when it's time to stop and do the thinking.
happy new years guys
Somebody here said once, and maybe it was obscura but could have been somebody else -- one of the usual names you see in technical talk section -- anyway they said that when they were hiring people they always asked the person to justify certain decisions they made about their models, and all they were really looking for is that there is critical thinking involved in all the decision making. So I figure that, for the self-learning artist, chances are you are going to do some things not the smartest way. Or not the most current and up to date way. But as long as you can show that you doing everything with some logical intention, that you aren't just an automaton pushing buttons, then you are doing well.