Modelling with high precision

Starboxx

Hi guys !

Could you guys give me some tips about when you need to model something with high precision from references?

Let me explain myself
I'm trying to model a Mig-31. I intend to model every single part of the cockpit, every bolt of the fuselage, every bit of the landing gear, etc, with as much precision as i can.

For this, i gathered as much references i could about the airplaine, from pictures to blueprints. The issue i have is, blueprints come from scale model plans, and are not very detailed. Sometimes, blueprints have big variations from one an other (like some 30-40cm differences of where wings starts for example). Yet, they are the only orthographic views i can use as image planes.

I have been trying to find a way to use perspective photos as image planes for references, but i really struggle matching the cameras to the perspective view. I'm working in Maya and i've been trying to export cameras from Max "match perspective", but still, i get no sufficient results. Tweaking and tweaking doesnt give me more success either. There is always something that seem to be off.

How would you guys would go about something like this, with the goal of having something as close to the real thing as possible? I'm really trying to achieve something with, if not milimeter, centimeter precision, and i can't seem to get close.

I've been thinking about finding one of these planes in a museum and photogrammetry it, but the only Mig-31s in museums i find are in Ru. From Belgium, that's pretty far.

oglu

We do a lot of vehicle modeling using photos. Aligning the Perspective cameras does take up to three days. First you need a good basemodel. And from there its just moving cameras trying diffrent FOV angles and adjusting the model. 

zachagreg

Can I ask why you want to do this? Is it just for practice or mastery sake? Like oglu said matching perfectly to references and setting up initial scene files is going to take a while. You're going to run into issue after issue as you discover that these publications of blueprints, references and the like were made by humans and can contain human differences and errors from publication to publication. 

I'd recommend toning your scope back a bit, any aircraft is made of tens of thousands of pieces. Or maybe chop up each "zone" into it's own workable project. Like the cockpit being one project the landing gear, the engine, etc. 

Try to step away from scale model plans as these are extremely error prone as they are not meant to reproduce the actual Mig-31 they are meant to reproduce the scale model. It would be easier to find schematics and blueprints of decommissioned models of jets/planes as those wouldn't necessarily be seen as a defensive intel to a lot of governments. With the Mig still being in commission in Russian airspaces and missions any actual blueprints of those are locked tight

HAWK12HT

Ok first off unless you are using cad program like solidworks, autocad, alias or fusion360 getting the kind of precision you are after will just take forever with traditional 3d tools. Unless you are provided with cad data like most car racing game companies do and you model on top of it after extensive cleaning operation you are limited with eyeballing your 3d model without it. 
You can achieve top quality results just model away and share your progress! keep in mind that in production scenario things move super fast 3to4 weeks a most on hero game asset or a year like Pacific Rim robots.   

sacboi

I wouldn't advise using scale model plans for ortho refs because they're basically more than anything else other than issues already mentioned here, really just a set of assembly instructions so essentially not a workable solution if accuracy is the intended goal. However these long term precision aircraft WIPs I've followed on and off for literally years IMHO valuable resources that list a raft of extremely useful info ranging from preparing refs, subd cage modelling right through to a final production render pass. They're worth at the very least a cursory glance even though obviously of different aircraft types along with vintage but nevertheless the underlying principles of capturing hyper accurate data I believe are relevant for your project.

SBD Douglas Dauntless by Witold Jaworski

Recreating the Wright R-1820 “Cyclone” by Witold Jaworski

Reference Prep by Witold Jaworski

MI-24 - A Russian Aviation Icon by Andre Cantarel  

    

Starboxx

Thank's all for your feedback guys, and sorry to have taken so long to answer.

As i am doing this as practice, i have moved away from the Mig-31 and set my sight at something i'd be able to photogrammetry scann, the Mil Mi-24P, wich is an other machine i really like. I went to take a few (about 1500) shots of the exterior at an outdoor museum in Germany a few hours from where i live, and have been processing all this into realitycapture. I hesitated alot between the Mi-24 and Mig-23, since there are two of them at that museum.

 What's even better with realitycapture is not only you can generate a scanned mesh, but you can also export a camera with each photo (something that i was very happy to learn) wich is really handy to check for details accuracy.

Here are orthographic snapshots of the scann if anyone is interrested. Top view is quite messy beceause i'm not tall enough to take photos up there  but i have contacted the museum director to have authorisation to get cockpit and passenger compartiment shots, i'm awaiting their response (Beceause cockpit was locked with rivets). I got enough photos of little parts of the outside to be able to model the fidelity i aim for. Feel free to use the orthographics,  i can provide way higher detail stnapshots if you're interrested. 



I've also been looking for a mig-31 sitting in a museum in Europe, but there seems to be none. Maybe i'll have a trip to moscow museum, but i'm unsure if they'd let me take a thousand of photos of it. Time will tell. I heard it's supposed to be decomissionned in 2020.

sacboi

Yep, I'm sure you'll get plenty of practice creating another iconic aircraft in the Russian aviation arsenal, so best of luck and have fun with it.

Cheers.

EDIT:

Also taking inspiration from Andre's WIP plus your particular goal for this project. I would be interested in the snapshots if you don't mind because similarly as a fellow modeller I'm always on the loolout for something really cool to sink my teeth into while learning a bit keeping the old skills up, thanks. 

Starboxx

@sacboi sent it to you in pm.