game character rigging, 3dmax or maya
polycounter lvl 2
hi, i want some advice about character rigging
for everyday use, i use 3dmax, but nowaday game use maya for its rigging and animate use
should i use 3dmax for rigging and animate, or should i use maya for rigging and animate
what the pro and the con of each software
im using unreal engine for the engine
and im using some motion capture, and BVH file a lot,
in max there a "load bvh", but in maya as i know, there need to retargeting the rig
and took a long time
for everyday use, i use 3dmax, but nowaday game use maya for its rigging and animate use
should i use 3dmax for rigging and animate, or should i use maya for rigging and animate
what the pro and the con of each software
im using unreal engine for the engine
and im using some motion capture, and BVH file a lot,
in max there a "load bvh", but in maya as i know, there need to retargeting the rig
and took a long time
Replies
I animate mostly in Max with custom rigs and their tools are pretty similar.
Now if you want to learn Maya you can look into the newish Quick Rig and HumanIK features. But if you just want to get your project done then skip learning and start working!
Max can handle a project of any scale and scope but if you're looking to do anything more than what Biped or CAT can offer then it gets crazy complicated pretty quick. That's true for Maya also, but QuickRig and HIK go a little farther and have more options for dealing with mocap and re-targeting animation between rigs that aren't similar in any way.
Biped is great for getting a bipedal character up and running in a few hours with little experience required. All of the parts that you interact with are also your skin joints so there are very few moving parts. Even less because it handles FK and IK controls all on the same pieces.
Pause: IK, FK and why biped is different
[spoiler]
Most custom rigs have 3 skeletal systems, biped combines them all into one. A custom rig (and CAT for that matter) consists of:
1) IK : Inverse Kinematics, the child drives the hierarchy. Grab the end of the chain, a hand or foot and move it to preposition the limb. The end can be pinned to the world, body or other objects. Good for picking up objects or holding onto things.
2) FK: Forward Kinematics, the parent rotations affect the children, child will never affect the parent. To get an arm into position you first rotate the bicep, then the forearm, then the hand. Rotating the hand does nothing to the
3) Skin Joints: This is your final skeletal hierarchy that mesh gets bound to. It's what is exported to whatever engine you're working on. It gets constrained to follow the IK and FK systems
Typically you have switches that blend the 3rd skeleton between the first two depending on your needs. It can get a bit confusing to work with and might lead to some pops and hitches when you switch back and forth. CAT is really bad at that.
Biped, combines all 3 into 1. Very simple, very light, very easy to understand and work with. But it can build a false sense of competency "look ma I'm a rigger now". That's cute Timmy coloring a picture of a puppy isn't quite the same as painting Napoleon Crossing the Alps.
Still confused, or a visual learner?
[/spoiler]
If the project requires quadrupeds or more advanced rigging then biped starts to fall apart. You can graft on custom rigging and it will work well but biped doesn't know about that extra rigging so you will need to manage it separately if you plan to put it on another character that is similar. Which really just means you save bip anims through the biped menu, and then select your custom rigging and save that through the max menu. Or use FBX export/import the entire animation, which depending on how you rig, may or may not work.
In 3dsmax you can jump from biped to CAT which offers a more modular approach to rigging. 14 arms and a snake tail lower body? No problem. BUT CAT has a higher learning curve and operates much more like a traditional custom rig (separate IK/FK controls, IK Spine ect...) and bugs-a-plenty. So much so I don't trust it and lean on my own custom scripts to quickly build rigs.
Like Monster said, if you're looking to use Maya then I guess there is no point in putting it off, it will always be annoying at first but depending on your personality and how you deal with "different" things you'll probably adapt pretty quickly. If you're a cranky old grandpa that hates change or new things, then it's probably going to be painful.
Maya 2016 extension 2, has a Quick Rig feature and HumanIK which is a light version of Motion Builder Stuffed into Maya. It makes stepping into Motion Builder a little easier.
a good explanation there
no im doing my project alone, but im dealing with 5 character and there an animal too like horse, elephant, etc
maya didnt have a rig package for animal, and for retargeting take a more time
im open for change of software, especialy if i can upgrade my skill more
thats why im seek for maya, but before i really jump to maya, i want to hear some insight from people
i think im gonna test maya with dummy character first, and if it goes as planned, i stick with maya
Advance Skeleton : http://www.animationstudios.com.au/advanced-skeleton
This creates biped, quadraped and custom rigs, I'm using this in production right now and I like it a lot. But there are some hoops you have to jump through to get it working in an engine, I'm using unreal and it only requires that the skin joint hierarchy be parented to a root bone. AS5 is free to download but not free to use. So you can fully test it out before you commit. Be sure to check out the Advanced Skeleton youtube channel and click those ? next to the buttons in the tool, they are really helpful.
The Step Machine, Modular : http://www.anzovin.com/tsm3/
I really like TSM2 but it was just for bipedal creatures and focused mostly on film quality rigs and wasn't easily compatible with game engines. TSM3 went full on quadraped and modular and now has a game engine pipeline. The manual available on their page goes over the entire workflow, they've made it pretty straight forward.
Rapid Rig Modular : https://www.highend3d.com/maya/script/rapid-rig-modular-procedural-auto-rig-for-maya
This is another great modular auto rigging tool. Its very cheap and worth checking out.
EDIT: I forgot about these!
Unreal Animation Tool kit: https://docs.unrealengine.com/latest/INT/Engine/Content/Tools/MayaRiggingTool/
As of right now it only works with bipedal characters but it is the easiest and fastest way to get a character working in unreal and working with all of the animations that are available in the Unreal Marketplace.
DPAutoRig v2 : http://nilouco.blogspot.com/2011/10/dpautorigsystem-v-20.html
This is right on par with Rapid Rig Modular and worth checking out. The rigs it makes are easy to animate and the setup process isn't as bad as some of the others.