Please, critique my portfolio models. I will give you candy! :)

Opilo

The thing I politely ask for you, is that you use your trained eagle eyes to ruthlessly critique these, and as a long time lurker I hope that we can create a some kind of longer lasting relationship, as I badly need some criticicing, as my only critics has been my gf and family. And by that I mean that you point what's wrong, I correct it, you point again, I correct it, etc.

These are the three models I have chosen for the job. First two pictures are high poly sculpts, last one is real time, game model if you will. I have (almost ready) real time models for all of them, but they are still being worked on. I will post all the models separately, and all the important stuff like wires, etc.

I think this is a perfect moment to do this, because I can still easily change things, before I go any further. So go crazy!
 It's a privilege to get feedback for such a great artists as yourself, so big thanks!

p.s. All the concepts are made by me, which in hindsight was a really bad idea.

Opilo

Opilo

Highpoly I made for a supernatural SWAT game (like what would the SWAT team be like in a Fables, Wolf Among Us world). It was never finished and we never got to the supernatural part.  The game model I made at the time was quite horrible, so I though it was time to do it again, properly this time.

Opilo

Opilo

This is the most ready game model. Made for the same game, but the game model was for unity 4 and wasn't presentable, so I made it again. Textures are made with substance painter, and they are very much WIP. I thought that getting some critique before I go any further would be a good idea. So please help

Opilo

Oh, and all models were made with Zbrush, Blender, and Substance painter. And I will post all the realtime models with wires tomorrow.

Opilo

Here is a game model texturing test for the Veteran (the knight character). Not final by any means.

Opilo

Another shot from Veteran highpoly.

Opilo

Oh, and the straps coming from shoulder pads (the air floating ones)  are already corrected.

Tomtegubbe

Have anyone ever told you, you look a bit like Ricky Gervais. Anyway that armor is really neat, what you're lacking is anatomy skills. Try sculpt a nude human and aim for photorealism, that is what's missing.

Opilo

 You can't be serious!!! Ricky Gervais, oh man. Don't know if i am angry or ....angry? 

I really didn't aim for photorealism in any of these as you can see in the other models. This one was supposed to be the most realistic one, and I started sculpting from the anatomic base mesh, but seems I lost the way. Can you be more spesific? What parts of model are unrealistic? What parts of the model are breaking the illusion? Pose? Proportions?

And that Gervais stuff...just rude.

Opilo

Now I am second guessing, if putting my picture there was a really bad idea :P

ChenTheChen

For the armored guy, the hands and feet/legs are lacking, Thumbs look quite long. For the legs/feet, maybe it's the lack of recognizable form that makes it look off? Armor design is interesting though and face looks cool. You just need to iron out the imperfections.

Tomtegubbe

Just got the mischievous ricky gervais eyes. Anyway some people don't like to acknowledge it, but realism is the standard by which we judge something to be good or bad. That armor you made would look more impressive on a realistic looking figure. Just grab some reference from a site like this for example, sculpt a more realistic human figure and put your armor on it.
https://www.3d.sk/photo_sets/search/query//thumb/small/standard/1/premium/1/category-7/31-40/category-113/Man/category-145/White/category-169/Nude/category-263/Athletic/page/1

Opilo

I totally acknowledge the importance of realism on characters that are supposed to be realistic. Ofc there are models that are aiming to exaggerate human proportions, but  good anatomy should be the basis for these works as well.

Opilo

Big Thanks @ChentheChen, That's just the kind of feedback I am looking for. You point out spesific areas that just dont work. More like this

 I definitely agree on all of your points. The thumbs really are too long, and the lack of recognizable form is and was real problem. This huy has so much armor on, that even if there would be a perfect human being inside , it still would look bad. So the armor is a part of the problem, but i don't think I have time to make big changes to that, sadly.

The feet/starting of legs are a problem. The feet part needs some work. They are too mushy. An the position of the legs seems to be little off. I tried them like a million positions, and this is what I ended for. Maybe I just tweak them little more. Hard in a way because there is nothing under the armor.

Anyway, keep  that feedback coming. I really appreciate it! I also have some wires coming so you can destroy them

Opilo

Opilo

I checked the proportions, and they actually seem to be quite correct. The hands seem little shorter, but they are bent on elbows, so when straight, they are the correct length. I started by doing anatomically correct base mesh, and didn't meddle with the proportions at all. I think it's the armor, that is giving the wrong impression.

Beard3D Bandit

your armor is awesome!

Opilo

Can anyone please confirm/deny Tomtegubbes claim about bad anatomy. Ofc it isn't perfect and the armor is somewhat problematic anatomy wise, but I don't know if it's that bad, that I should be sculpting a nude figure (again) to make it right. 

Opilo

Oh my, thanks a lot @Beard3DBandit!  Heart-warming!

slosh

The anatomy does look odd.  Perhaps the armor is not well designed then.  His shoulders look crazy high up...almost around his head.  This definitely looks weird.  The cape and the armor cover too much and you can't identify what is going on underneath.  Maybe do screenshots of his nude, with the armor but without the cape, and then the full version side by side.  As for your stylized pieces, the proportions do look odd even for exaggerated work.  The police/military guy has a very odd looking face.  His nose looks extremely large which would be ok but the basic muscle structure doesn't look right, the chin and cheeks could use work, the lip structure looks wrong as well.  I would redo that head entirely from scratch using sound anatomy first and then pushing proportions after.  

Opilo

@slosh Thanks you very much for your critique! I will cover the swat first; This was my first character I ever finished, and there sure is bunch of thinks that are plain ugly, or wrong.  The head especially. Eyes are bulging, the skin is bumby, and mushy, and the anatomy is just wrong. I was even at one time thinking a ski mask for him just to hide his face

 Anyway, I will make a new head for him, but the body didn't look that  bad when it was animated. And ofc I won't be presenting him in this stance. So maybe, besides remaking the head, perhaps I should rig and pose him now and see how it looks?

 As for the knight, he really has massive shoulder under that cape, like Wow, Warhammer massive, and they were even bigger at some point. Problem with cape is that when the shoulders are under it, they really don't give the impression of massive shoulders but an impression of weird shoulders. I definitely will work on them. 
 I like the armor, but it really has some big problems. I think that part of it are just so thick, that they distort the underlying anatomy.  I'm kinda stuck with the upper front part. Whatever I do it will still dominate the chest area and it's round design doesn't let any underlying anatomy away, but that's one reason I like about it. It's agressive and I like the tankiness, but it does hide everything under. I really don't have time to make a totally new piece, but I think I can try to fit the man inside there better. After I have redone the guy, and refitted the armor, I will post pictures without cape so you can check if things have gone better (although I love capes, and this one is here to stay )
 
Anyway, thanks a bunch @slosh! These points were superhelpfull. And I appreciate especially the pinpointing of specific mistakes, not just like saying go learn anatomy, or something I hope you stay and watch the next round after I have redone the posture.

Biomag

You might want to put the cloak simply underneath the shoulder pads and gorget. You can still have a hood then, but it won't be hiding the work you put into those pads and it should be easier readable, going for something like this (not in details, just to give you an idea):

Opilo

 Hey@Biomag thank you for the idea!  I thought of that at one point, but I am little insecure about those shoulder pads. They went through many iterations and I hated them all. That's why they are hiding under the cloak.

 But now that the shoulder area got kind of harsh criticism (good thing), I think it's time to re-evaluate the whole thing, and your idea might be one solution. So, people, what do think of the shoulders? They can be seen on the very WIP textured realtime model above.

 What is even better than criticism, is suggestions how to correct them. So, big thanks @biomag sir!

Opilo

BTW, can anyone of you professionals link (or maybe give?) me a good anatomical male base mesh for reference? I have made couple particulary for re-use, but now I am starting to doubt if they actually work! I have learned that the little things can make a big different.

 So If I could get one of them, that you evaluate correct and anatomically sound, I would be eternally gratefull! Seems that you can only go so far with 2D references.

Thank you!

Biomag

You can find Grassetti's tutorial + 3d ecorche on gumrod or a 10,- sculpt from Adam Skutt. I personally have Adam's sculpt in my ZBrush scene as reference to help me get the portions right and remember all the muscles. Just keep in mind he actually pushed all muscles a lot to serve as reminder and not as much as a reference to follow.

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/4NB8L

GeoCat

sorry Dp

GeoCat

3dSK provides some of the most uninspired figure reference around. A subscription is great for creating spotlight textures though. They're reference won't really help anyone seeking to do stylized, dynamic or hyper real characters. To slavishly mull over and sculpt from their photo's would result in some really uninspired looking characters imo....

Here's a guide I like to use from my pinterest collection when establishing proportions for stylized or "photo-real" characters. It explains a bit about the different body archtypes/proportions that are typically associated with certain types of characters, and provides some really nice readable contours to follow....



Here is my pinterest and huaban board for characters. Both contain lots of photos, structural and proportional breakdowns and guides, which is really helpful...

http://huaban.com/boards/13782542/

https://www.pinterest.com/rjz3dcg/costume-and-character-design-reference/


But yea take the time to look and work from reference, always. Your armor is great. The fore arms on the detective were done really well too. But overall your characters are lacking interesting/dynamic shape and form, there's no silhouette... the bodies are straight cylindrical. As stated by others  there's no contours or adherence to an underlying structure. 

Your on the right track though. Just take more time to look at dynamic reference, and practice just working some good base meshes that hit on the difference body types. Don't get into to much detail until the structure is sound. A great way to get your head around it, and start to really see the shapes in their primary form is to work up a mesh, using a body type from the first image as a guide, with Zspheres. Than break it down to a low poly mesh and build up on that base...
hope this helps,
cheers, and good luck! 

Opilo

@Biomag That sculpt looks great, and could be very helpfull. Thanks a lot for the tip!

@Geocat Wow, thank you so much for all the critique, links and references. I totally agree what you said about 3D.SK. I had the subscription for a year while a go, and I almost only used it with spotlight to paint base for skin textures. I did sometimes use it as references, but only for like hands, ears and other spesific areas of human body.

That board you posted looks awesome, and you are dead right about my models lacking interesting silhoutette. Actually so much, that when you mentioned the cylindrical shapes, for the  "detective" (or Bruiser, my working title ) I was really aiming to do it cylindrical, because as my second character ever, I had big problems baking good normal maps, and I though the cylindrical shapes would help . Ofc now when I know how to do it properly, there isn't much sense to keep them so roundish.

I really hope that the posing would bring up more interesting look, but of course it doesn't solve the major issues. I am, as we speak, posing a base mesh for the knight character, and then fitting the armor on (hopefully more lively) posture. It really warms my heart that artist of your caliber liked my armor, and I think that really it's the only thing I am happy with. So I hope that with help of you guys/girls, I can do justice to it (and you) by fitting it properly on good mesh, and with interesting pose.

As for the detective. I really am running low on ideas, how to make it more interesting. I am in a huge hurry in my life, and the knight is the priority now, so I can't change hes clothes, but they really aren't the problem anyways, right? So as you advised, what I could do, is "pump" up the anatomy itself, and make the underlaying muscle definitions better. (Sadly, there is not base mesh anymore, because it was an old model and I only had couple of files left)

Anyway, thanks again, and let me say that It really is privilege to get feedback from such a great artist as your self! Before I posted anything here on polycount, I went through your sketchbook, and it is just something truly wonderful and inspiring!

I hope you stay on this train, and continue giving feedback as I will post my progression!

P.S. Those reference boards are just pure gold!

Opilo

@slosh I checked your artstation page, and was just blown away! Piece after piece just truly outstanding work! Going through them was just an incredibly inspiring ride! So clad I got critique from you, and I definitely try to take all your advises by heart.