[Unity] Stylized Dojo Exterior Environment

Azaraen

[updated progress]

Hello Polycount,

Working on an environment for a fighting game and I really need some ideas/feedback on what I can do to make it more interesting.

Some trouble areas is that I am not sure which way to go with this style.
I've also gotten feedback:
* Dojo does not fit with the rest of the stage. (not sure what I can do)
* Maybe make it more anime.
* Maybe make it less detailed.
* Looks too mobile.
* Needs more...  (life?)



With Characters:


These are some images of references I was suggested to look at in the creation of this environment.
1. Overall Lighting - from Overwatch
2. Cartoon/Anime Stylization - from Guilty Gear Xrd, World of Warcraft, & Heroes of the Storm
3. Water & Bloom Lighting - Super Mario 3D World
4. Maybe try to match the snow level that a previous stage artist made. Players seemed to like the level of detail in there. Like the tree.

Tomtegubbe

Maybe a bit more texture to the trees, or not I don't know. 

fatihG_

Its lacking contrast and lighting imo.

The 'it looks too mobile' crit is probably because the dojo looks fullbright.
'Make it less detailed' - I agree with this, try to use flat colours as much as possible and have details only appear near the edges of the objects.
'Needs more life' - can probably be done with better lighting. Make it interact with the environment. Add some fog, edge highlighting, bounce light from the ground/grass. Cast shadows and very subtle AO.

Avoid 90 degrees edges imo, try to bevel those sharp edges up a bit, so they can catch some highlights.

Looking at the stage the other artist made, he seems to be using some subtle fresnel as well. This could simple be the way he or she set up the lighting though.

Ged

I would agree it needs more atmosphere and more interesting lighting, that paintover is good. the roof of the dojo is green and the trees are green so its all blending together too much in my opinion, either make the dojo have a different colour roof(yellow? red?) or make the trees have autumn colours. Perhaps add a few more foreground detail assets for example a few stones on the ground with grass sticking out, some leaves from the trees around the place etc.

Tomtegubbe

I don't agree that making things less detailed and adding fog is a good idea. Unless you have fog appearing in front of the sprites or 3d models and unless it's moving like a mist it won't look like mist. Making things less detailed never makes something look better either, the only exception might be if you're creating something that is higly stylized, old japanese art for example. But since this background has perspective it's better to go for as much details as you can, or at least enough detail for the 3d models to not look out of place. I agree though that making the shadows on the building a bit darker is a good idea, currently looks a bit washed out, cheers.

praetus

I think the biggest issue I have looking at it is "Look at how brown and green everything is."  You have a green treeline that almost blends directly with the rooftop.  Not just in color but also height.  I feel that either season of tree leaves could change or the rooftop color.  As for the dojo coloring, all the wood is the same in color and style which at that point is going to blend together completely if your lighting doesn't make up for it.  What about having an eggshell white for the walls and have the wood beams accent the color? 

fatihG_

@Tomtegubbe
My reasoning is all based on the provided screenshot of the 'previous artists' scene, the provided references and the feedback that was received so far.

The 'fog'  is to simulate atmospheric perspective, similar to the previous snowy scene. It helps to make the characters pop out from the background as well.

Looking at the snow scene, when it comes to detail, notice the lack of detail on the objects. It almost looks like an AO map has been used to mask out details.
As for making things less detailed is never good, 'less is more'.
I'm not saying to remove all detail, just use them sparingly. You don't want allot of high frequency detail. Especially not in a fighting game imo, as the main focus while playing should be the characters on screen.
Notice how the snow scene almost has no high frequency details. It looks very stylized and clean.

Basically looking at your argument, to me, it sounds like you are 'just trying to improve the image'.
While the focus should be more on how to get it to be more similar, when it comes to art style.

@Evolvyn I think the comments on colour palete are on point as well. 


Something like that can look cool. Maybe use this image as a base for colours and add some red accents?
It would fit a bit better with that Torii on the left as well I think.

Tomtegubbe

I'm not sure but I think that the glare or bloom or whatever it is that you see at the top of the trees behind that temple is actually an artifact from the camera. It's very common for people who make games to overdo the artifact, bloom filters for example, it's an artifact that only exists in photos, not in real life. Atmospheric perspective is something you notice on a distance, things become more desaturated the further away they are and if mist would be to be added you would have to cover the entire scene in mist if you want it to be realistic. Something like the picture below:
https://tripswithtots.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/d-walking-into-the-mist.jpg
I'm not sure what could be gained from blurring the entire screen, mist also desaturates things. When dealing with cartoons there aren't really any rules, so I suppose you could do whatever you want, but personally I feel that even cartoons benefit from being more realistic as opposed to odd. Snow white > Chibi mangas

pixelb

Nice. I'll just suggest you make your grass cards like this-
normals point straight up, dither out the alpha at the bottom. No more harsh transitions.

Azaraen

@Tomtegubbe : Yeah... I do want to add a little more detail to the trees. Just not sure how to do it without it being too noisy. The tree in the snow level looks just right, but you are also up close to it. The detail would be too crazy for a tree that further away & a different kind.

@bb0x : I had not noticed that before! The shadows are too light. I'll make them darker I will also lessen the detail on the wood to just around the edges. I'll also give beveling a try! (I assume I should soften the normals on those edges)

@Ged : Unfortunately, I cannot change the green on the dojo because it ties in with the color of the character who belongs to this stage. And I actually got that feedback recently aswell. So I will go with giving the trees a variety of autumn colors. Gives me a good reason to have falling leaves. And gotch on more stones on the ground.

@praetus : Yeah, I'll definitely try the autumn leaves approach on this, because the dojo roof has to stay green for the character it belongs to. I think you are on to something with the eggsheel white color on the dojo.

@pixelb : Thanks for the tip on the grass! I'll give that a try!

Thank you everybody for the much needed feedback! Overall, it sounds like my lighting and contrast is a big issue. I'll also see what I can do to make the trees a different color from the dojo roof. 

Azaraen

Trees are my weakness. haha. Not sure how to approach remaking the leaves with autumn colors. I'm thinking I need more details so that I can show actual leaves. But ultimately, I am having trouble. Most of the time I find videos on how to sketch leaves, but nothing on how to create a polished tree with leaves. I am going to try making transparent 3D planes with leaves on it and experiment.

Been looking at these trees for reference:
https://www.artstation.com/artwork/5KgdJ


http://mataraelfay.deviantart.com/art/Tileset-bosque-expansion-rtp-RPG-Maker-XP-325243427

Azaraen

A before and after image!

What do you guys think now?  
And thank you all again for the feedback (AND PAINTOVERS)! It really really helped.