Hi polycounters. I wanted to have a go at making a current gen version of Tifa, hopefully I can finish this before Square-Enix releases screenshots of her in the remake and completely puts me to shame.
I'm going to do the classic outfit but I'm thinking about adding other elements and layers to make it a bit of a redesign. Been working on the body and face so far, been looking at east asian fighters for reference, though I want her frame to be a bit thicker and curvier than usual. Here's what I have so far. Please crit if you see anything that looks weird or bad so far.
face is looking pretty good so far, but her proportions are all outta whack to me at the moment. she looks quite a bit more amazonian than she does "a bit thicker and curvier than usual". I think it's the lower half of her body, mainly. having that much thigh muscle with a huge thigh gap is a really weird looking combo. Look at the thighs on your top left reference photo for example.
Looks nice, the transition around the deltoid between the pectoral and the arm looks pretty weird right now. Looks almost like theres no volume in the pectorals and its just connected to the arm by thin flesh. Also have an odd groove running down the inner thigh.
I'd probably round out the deltoid a bit more, just personal preference though.
@PyrZern Thanks! The eyes are about half way down the head at the moment, so I'm not sure about moving them any lower, there's a pic attached of the head without hair though @polaroid29 Thanks, you're right about the hips/thighs, they were too wide so I've reigned it in a bit and slimmed out the thighs more. Thanks for the ref, she's cute. Also with body proportions, I'm going for 8 heads high, idealized/stylized proportions. @AtticusMars Yep you were right that there's no pectoral, I've added it in now and rounded out the deltoid, do you think this looks better?
@cmc444@AtticusMars@seimax Thanks guys! Carrying on with this, I made some clothes with MD/zbrush and got some rough shoes on the go. I want her boots to have little heels, but I need to hit some more reference, they look wrong from the back. I'm thinking of trying to make the gloves in MD and seeing if it gives me a good result. I want the clothing to look really high quality, so loads of work to do on detailing...!
Mainly missed your progression thread when you were doing Aigis, so I'm excited to see this one! I guess the only thing I'm concerned on is the folds for the top? MD does a great job, but I kind of question whats going on on the back of her top? To my knowledge those kind of horizontal folds show when the cloth has friction on the surface underneath it, enough to not fall down, so the cloth piles ontop of itself. It looks though like there's nothing on the curve of her back for cloth to get stuck on like that though?
the only thing I don't care for is the face. It has that common japanese cute/innocent quality that I never found fitting with the character, who lets remember, owned a bar and worked for a terrorist group. But it's a style choice, I get it.
Awwww yeah thread action! It's great to see progression pics of the full thing all in one place, you don't quite get that sense for how it's all coming along from the streams. Subbed ofc
Ahri, Aigis, and now Tifa? You're hitting all my favorite female characters. I wish I could offer some useful critique, but things are looking pretty great. Looking forward to following your progress!
@Tits@Mateus@Fazijinn@TomGT@Nuclear Angel@douglas3ddesigner@tda@kasigawa@darkmag07 Thank you guys very much! Please feel free to crit if you have any suggestions! @Aveon You're right about the folds, I missed that, thanks! Tightened up the top at the back so its not hanging loose any more, but still needs more work! @Fuiosg Haha you are right, though she always had a sweet and innocent side I feel that kinda contrasted with Aeris' cheekiness. I think because the face is neutral she does look a little gormless though, I'm unsure how much expression I want to give the face in the bake but I will definitely try out some facial expressions and see if I can give her more energy.
Added some more cloth elements, made the long gloves in MD and started on her sparring gloves. I think I want to add some more padding to the knuckles still. Here's a quick drawover to show what I want to add - also thinking of designing a leather jacket that would be like a cold area costume variation that I could just turn on and off.
Man i love the addition of materia to her gloves, totally helps sell it! I'm actually not a fan of her abs... i feel like they could be defined better, and their transition onto the ribs looks a little weird to me, like they're bulging out instead of flattening. Could be the matcap...
This may be a bit more defined than you're going for, but you can see how the abs flatten out quite quickly. Additionally, the stronger/more cut a woman gets, the more their abs tend to run straight up/down than have that "A" shape to them. Again it depends how soft you want her to look. But you definitely need to look at the transition from the ribs to the external oblique.
Another observation i made earlier in the thread but forgot to post about (my baaaad!) is to pay attention to the area above the tricep on the back of the arm, unless she has a crazy low body fat percentage, that area (above tricep, behind deltoid) is always kinda... puffy? Looking really nice though man.
This idea might not be so much a good one, but perhaps I should just put it out there. I noticed when Lara came out for the new Tomb Raider game she didn't have such a clean look. I think this more rough look gave her more personality and realism. Do you think maybe a little bit of grime or dirt would be a good idea to add to this model? I mean Midgar isn't the most cleanly of places. My opinion. Nevertheless, the model looks great as it is. Keep up the good work. http://i07.kanobu.net/c/6b8302182d57f82c608017965a15c278/1040x584/i.ytimg.com/vi/z1ViXbnAHBQ/maxresdefault.jpg
The facial expression does bother me a bit though, I feel like she should look confident - whereas right now she looks rather lost and insecure. I haven't played FF7 (or any FF, lol sorry) but that's the feeling I'm getting from your mood reel.
@almighty_gir Wow thank you for such a good crit! I agree, the body anatomy isn't to the right level yet, the exposed bits of skin need to look totally on point. I can show a basic material matcap next time, but when I look at anatomy diagrams and not just photos, its hard to get the correct forms going on when there's skin and fat involved. That ref pic isn't too far off what I want so I'll seek out more like that and redo that part. The tricep did loose volume actually, I'll fix that. I definitely wanna see your take on Sephiroth @kasigawa The 'skin' that's on the model right now is literally just a flat colour, so yes I definitely want to push it in that direction and add some wear and tear, idk if I'll go full Lara with dirt on the face yet but we'll see!
Looks great! My only crit would be about the shoes, the one you started looks great but I kinda miss the big doc martens like boots she had in the original design (which you seem to follow). I know it's a matter of personal taste, but I also believe that they change the silhouette of the character quite a lot. With the big boots with normal heels you have a strong shape that does a nice contrast with the smoothness of the legs. Also it helps to balance the character, making her feel like she would be hard to put off balance, which is important for a close combat fighter. As I said it's a matter of personal taste but consider to give it a try, maybe just a dirty photoshop paintover just to see how it would look. Keep up the good work!
@KingKellogg Depends where you look I think, AC for instance had very Japanese influenced characters IMO. I'd like to get a western and east asian look to the face, but I think I will experiment with it still!
@Abrvpt Thank you, the more I look at the shoes I was starting to question the heels! I agree that she looks a bit off balance - I need to redo the sole of the shoe properly anyway, so I'm tempted to stay on model to doc martens. I wanted to try make the sole a bit chunkier to give it more of a scifi feel.
Update, built lots of straps this week! Had another go at the anatomy, but still lots to do on the body yet.
I'm.....kinda(?) with slosh on this one. I think it's realistically possible to have hands that small, but it does continue the same shape of the arm in her silhouette (basically is the same thickness as her arms, especially with the squint test). It's not necessarily a bad thing( it'll help make sure the detail you put into her gloves doesn't out weigh her face as a focal point) but enlarging the hands could break silhouette more, which might be something to consider
Take it with a grain of salt, i'm kinda testing my own knowledge via my input haha. Still looks great, the small refinement on her abs brought miles of quality
I hadn't noticed it before but now that slosh mentions it, i can't unsee it. I feel like it's an illusion more than anything because of the highly padded glove. The hand when it was just the bare arm seems fine to my layman eyes. Either a little extra chub on the fingers or a reduction in the volume of the glove ought to even them out no worries. She's looking sweet as, loving the attention to detail on all the straps
@slosh, @Aveon, @tda Aaa you guys are right, the fingers look too tiny now. I think I will do a combination of overall enlarging the hands, thickening the fingers and scaling back the gloves. Tonight I worked on the face and realized I did my usual nonsense of making the eyes too far apart, and the face was a bit wide. Here's a gif of the changes I made. If you see something that still looks whack feel free to paintover!
Following along with these updates has been absolutely amazing. Looking at your recent changes to the face I feel like the "after" look makes her look softer and cuter than before. Something about the original had more of a tough indifference that I thought was a nice direction for Tifa (but it might have been the thickness of the eyebrows, or the upper lid and mouth.. I'm not sure). That being said, the ears and width of the face feel much better now, so maybe I just have a bias to the way it was before. I wish I had more to contribute but I really love watching the character come together. Can't wait to see more!
@lotet thank you so much! @dGreenberg That's good, I'd like the base head to have a neutral expression overall, I think the new one is more balanced overall too. Thickened the fingers, hopefully they don't look too sausage-like now. Next I need to add belt loops to the skirt and build the shoes, going to stick closer to the dr marten boot and build the sole of the shoe in 3dsmax. Need to write a list!
You know it's gettin' serious when you start making lists! It's hard to say for sure but the hands look more balanced now and i don't see any sausage action! A longer shot would probably be a bit better for comparison though? Kicking all the ass!
I know it's been 3 days, but patience is my weakest virtue and I'm hype for the next update haha
Interesting that you've got the leather micro-details going on, I'd of thought you'd maybe do that in substance? Though I don't know too much of your work flow.
Thanks everyone for the encouragement! @Aveon Glad you're hype! Those are just for visualising it at an early stage, for the game res version fabrics will be done in the texture @WanaBRtiBtMTuLzPsHlp You can catch some of the process on my twitch channel, there may be tutorial coming eventually! @f1ey they're just placeholders for now
I bought a scan of a female body and ecorche model over the weekend and went back to the base body. I polished up a few more bits and pieces and made her elbow armor, added belt loops etc. Need to resculpt the shirt 'cos I ended up changing the boobs a lot. As usual crit appreciated!
Replies
Great start indeed!
Great start though !! Especially the attention to details on her panty O o
Angela Lee (left) might be good reference for ya.
I'd probably round out the deltoid a bit more, just personal preference though.
@polaroid29 Thanks, you're right about the hips/thighs, they were too wide so I've reigned it in a bit and slimmed out the thighs more. Thanks for the ref, she's cute. Also with body proportions, I'm going for 8 heads high, idealized/stylized proportions.
@AtticusMars Yep you were right that there's no pectoral, I've added it in now and rounded out the deltoid, do you think this looks better?
Carrying on with this, I made some clothes with MD/zbrush and got some rough shoes on the go. I want her boots to have little heels, but I need to hit some more reference, they look wrong from the back. I'm thinking of trying to make the gloves in MD and seeing if it gives me a good result.
I want the clothing to look really high quality, so loads of work to do on detailing...!
I guess the only thing I'm concerned on is the folds for the top? MD does a great job, but I kind of question whats going on on the back of her top? To my knowledge those kind of horizontal folds show when the cloth has friction on the surface underneath it, enough to not fall down, so the cloth piles ontop of itself. It looks though like there's nothing on the curve of her back for cloth to get stuck on like that though?
@Aveon You're right about the folds, I missed that, thanks! Tightened up the top at the back so its not hanging loose any more, but still needs more work!
@Fuiosg Haha you are right, though she always had a sweet and innocent side I feel that kinda contrasted with Aeris' cheekiness. I think because the face is neutral she does look a little gormless though, I'm unsure how much expression I want to give the face in the bake but I will definitely try out some facial expressions and see if I can give her more energy.
Added some more cloth elements, made the long gloves in MD and started on her sparring gloves. I think I want to add some more padding to the knuckles still. Here's a quick drawover to show what I want to add - also thinking of designing a leather jacket that would be like a cold area costume variation that I could just turn on and off.
I'm actually not a fan of her abs... i feel like they could be defined better, and their transition onto the ribs looks a little weird to me, like they're bulging out instead of flattening. Could be the matcap...
This may be a bit more defined than you're going for, but you can see how the abs flatten out quite quickly. Additionally, the stronger/more cut a woman gets, the more their abs tend to run straight up/down than have that "A" shape to them. Again it depends how soft you want her to look. But you definitely need to look at the transition from the ribs to the external oblique.
Another observation i made earlier in the thread but forgot to post about (my baaaad!) is to pay attention to the area above the tricep on the back of the arm, unless she has a crazy low body fat percentage, that area (above tricep, behind deltoid) is always kinda... puffy? Looking really nice though man.
I may need to revisit Sephiroth...
I love your works btw xD!!!
http://i07.kanobu.net/c/6b8302182d57f82c608017965a15c278/1040x584/i.ytimg.com/vi/z1ViXbnAHBQ/maxresdefault.jpg
The facial expression does bother me a bit though, I feel like she should look confident - whereas right now she looks rather lost and insecure. I haven't played FF7 (or any FF, lol sorry) but that's the feeling I'm getting from your mood reel.
Keep up the great work!
@kasigawa The 'skin' that's on the model right now is literally just a flat colour, so yes I definitely want to push it in that direction and add some wear and tear, idk if I'll go full Lara with dirt on the face yet but we'll see!
As I said it's a matter of personal taste but consider to give it a try, maybe just a dirty photoshop paintover just to see how it would look.
Keep up the good work!
@Abrvpt Thank you, the more I look at the shoes I was starting to question the heels! I agree that she looks a bit off balance - I need to redo the sole of the shoe properly anyway, so I'm tempted to stay on model to doc martens. I wanted to try make the sole a bit chunkier to give it more of a scifi feel.
Update, built lots of straps this week! Had another go at the anatomy, but still lots to do on the body yet.
Take it with a grain of salt, i'm kinda testing my own knowledge via my input haha. Still looks great, the small refinement on her abs brought miles of quality
Tonight I worked on the face and realized I did my usual nonsense of making the eyes too far apart, and the face was a bit wide. Here's a gif of the changes I made. If you see something that still looks whack feel free to paintover!
Subbed!
@dGreenberg That's good, I'd like the base head to have a neutral expression overall, I think the new one is more balanced overall too.
Thickened the fingers, hopefully they don't look too sausage-like now. Next I need to add belt loops to the skirt and build the shoes, going to stick closer to the dr marten boot and build the sole of the shoe in 3dsmax. Need to write a list!
Interesting that you've got the leather micro-details going on, I'd of thought you'd maybe do that in substance? Though I don't know too much of your work flow.
@Aveon Glad you're hype! Those are just for visualising it at an early stage, for the game res version fabrics will be done in the texture
@WanaBRtiBtMTuLzPsHlp You can catch some of the process on my twitch channel, there may be tutorial coming eventually!
@f1ey they're just placeholders for now
I bought a scan of a female body and ecorche model over the weekend and went back to the base body. I polished up a few more bits and pieces and made her elbow armor, added belt loops etc. Need to resculpt the shirt 'cos I ended up changing the boobs a lot. As usual crit appreciated!