Would a free 3D-art school be worth it?
polycounter lvl 5
So, because I live in Finland, all the schools - except the private ones suited for special careers - are free. I've seen quite a few people say that art school isn't worth it, but the people saying it were mainly from the US, where the tuition cost a ton.
I was wondering if a 4-year, free tuition is worth it. I asked the teachers of the school via e-mail, and they said that they use the traditional tools like Maya, 3DS Max, Zbrush, Unity etc., and that during the tuition, most students will get employed during a time period where they work with game companies.
The employment part could be a huge benefit, but I'd like to hear you guys' thoughts on this.
I was wondering if a 4-year, free tuition is worth it. I asked the teachers of the school via e-mail, and they said that they use the traditional tools like Maya, 3DS Max, Zbrush, Unity etc., and that during the tuition, most students will get employed during a time period where they work with game companies.
The employment part could be a huge benefit, but I'd like to hear you guys' thoughts on this.
Replies
problem with this is that I believe you need that drive to succeed at art at all but if you have it "3d-school" isn't necessary since learning resources online are abundant. but anyway if you lack that self motivating/improving ability but still desperately want to get into the industry it might be your best bet.
Personally I'd rather study something else, like engineering, CS or fine arts that can complement and bring your skills to the next level in different ways.
For what it's worth polycounter "rolang" is from Finland and I believe graduated from a course there, and is now working in the industry. He's a good artist and also a very nice guy so I bet if you PM him he might be able to answer some of your questions more thoroughly.
The drive really isn't my problem. I'm highly motivated to do what I do, and I love it. The only thing I'm concerned about is that if I go to school, will those 4 years give me something valuable in return, or will I just be wasting my time there.
Thanks for the tip, I'll try to get in touch with him.
I thought they PAID YOU to go to school in Finland.
Heh, not quite - altough you can apply for a steady financial support when you're 17, if you're living by yourself and studying. But it's all made so complicated that it's a pain to even apply.
This one: http://www.metropolia.fi/haku/koulutustarjonta-nuoret-kulttuuri/viestinta-3d-animointi-ja-visualisointi/
Just don't fall into the trap of assuming that you're on track to get a job when you graduate just because you're doing well in the course.
Yeah, I understand that. The experience of working in groups and possibly seeing how things are done in the industry are what I'm interested in.
But you might as well have the best time of your life, spending 4 of your best years with likeminded people to a degree that you never experienced before. You'll make alot of friends, and can build contacts in the industry before you even enter it.
Just keep in mind that a school usually won't get you job ready. Maybe it will get you half the way, but you'll have to spend alot of time working your ass off on your own to make it
Yeah, I'm not really only looking at it from a career point of view - I'm only discussing whether it's worth it from a career POV, but I have been thinking about the experience as a whole from another perspective.
Anyway, thanks for the helpful replies, I think I'll apply for the tuition next spring
If you have a opportunity to go for free, if the school at least use the actual tools we are using and you don't try to turning into a zombie that says, "school will teach me every thing I need" go and be happy ^^!
Worth the complications dude.
Get PAID to learn.
It's one of the Only place on the planet where that is a thing.
Yup, I know. My plan is - now that I've decided to apply for the next semester - that if I get in, I'll apply for the financial support. Even though most of the aid will probably go into paying the costs of living near the school, it will most likely be worth it.
@sprunghunt : I'm not sure if that really matters, altough I do feel like the degree is recognized world-wide.
It matters because, if you apply for a visa, and the school isn't internationally accredited by a recognized organisation then the degree basically means nothing.
The problem is that many of the schools which offer specialized courses like "3d art" aren't accredited and aren't recognized by anyone. This is why it's sometimes better to get a more generalized degree from a more respected school.
It's like if you bought a car, but they wouldn't let you drive it on the road, because it doesn't meet the licence standards.
Ah, I see.
The degree I would get from the course is a degree of media technology, but I'm not sure if that's the exact translation of it. Anyway, the course covers one of it's areas, which is 3D visualization & animation.
The school should definitely be internationally accredited, as it's one of the biggest ones in Finland, it's in the metropolitan area, and it offers about 80 different courses (there's also a student story on their site, in which the student tells that he's working in an Ubisoft studio in Sweden) - but I could be wrong, of course.
I hope this doesn't get overlooked. Your more able to work oversees if you have a degree then not. If its free, then bloody, why the heck not take it?
Something that would be good to ask about is what relationships the college has with nearby studios. I know that Ubisoft and DICE both have internships for local students - and these studios are both in sweden so are close by.
For the last few months I've been trying to get some info about the school, but there are a few things that concern me. The school's site doesn't feature any student work, and when I asked the staff about this via e-mail, they said that their student gallery was being worked on. This was around 5 months ago, and their site still has some below-average work.
I also tried to get in touch with a few people who graduated from that course. Only two of them replied, which is a bit unfortunate. One of them gave a pretty positive "review", but he did say that he felt the teachers weren't that knowledgeable. I don't know if that's changed since then, since the guy who replied graduated in 2011. The other person I managed to reach gave quite a mixed review. He said that the school taught the students the basics of CG (not just game art), and that the projects they made during the course weren't exactly intensive or something you could put on your portfolio. He also noted that while the teachers knew how to use the software, they couldn't really give proper critique on the students' work.
I decided to check out some of the reels and projects they've made, and I found this reel from 2014:
https://youtu.be/XmVlO4jNrns I also found this game reel from 2015, which doesn't look too promising in my opinion: http://youtu.be/qZy6G9nsiN4
To be honest, I don't really know what I could expect from a free school, but when compared to something like the Uni of Hertfordshire, the difference in quality is massive.
Some opinions on this would be greatly appreciated. I'm seriously considering Hertfordshire as a second option, but the possibility of a 50,000€+ debt makes me want to think this stuff through. And since I live in Finland, I'm not entirely sure how I would apply to Herts or attend the tests for that matter.
But dude, please, don't get yourself in debt over this. I am literally sweating just about thinking of a 50k euro debt.
You will pay for years and years and years to repay it. What they offer is not worth it.
You will always find that "reviews" of colleges or companies are really mixed. There is always something that is wrong, even if you personally, possibly, wouldn't see it. You NEED to understand that colleges will always just teach you to use the tools and maybe, maybe, some tips here and there. The only element that will make you succeed in this industry is you. If you work twice, or three times as hard as the other students, you probably are a step closer to getting into the industry than anyone else in that college. Colleges are good for their degrees, which are helpful for visas, because you will probably want to travel around for jobs. They will not make you a proper professional artist no matter what you pay them. It is completely and only in your hands. Let them help you learn the tools and learn some basic stuff with their help, but maximize it with your own sweat. Where I studied 5 years ago, there were people complaining that they weren't taught as much as they should have and when I visited the college to get some documents, I saw one of the people that complained sitting in a classroom, playing pokemon (not kidding), while the lecturer, a really good one at that, was sculpting a character from scratch. So, yeah.
Don't get sold into the whole "we will make you a professional" because all they care about is your money, only you care about yourself, work hard, learn. work harder, apply, get the job.
Seems like MiAlx and I shared the same school and our experience is the same though years apart - students complaining about the teachers and education while only doing the minimum. Still as he is a proof and I know others too who managed to get in AAA studios and productions. Biggest difference? They worked their asses off constantly.
So try the school. Never mind how good it is, do your stuff at home being ahead of class and get your degree. At your age being a student is an good experience so its not even waisting time. If the whole thing doesn't prove ideal for you, you can still get some additional courses online like GNOMON or CGMA or pick up a debt to go to a big university.
I'm definitely leaning towards the free school. Besides, as you said, the 50 000€ debt is insane - and it doesn't even cover all the expenses that would result from me moving to the UK. Paying it off could take me decades, especially if I don't land a job fairly soon after school.
@Biomag : You're right, it's most likely a great experience, and in case it isn't I can always quit - though having a degree could be beneficial.
I'll try and find some more info about the course, and if nothing alarming comes up I'll apply there. I could also try and get some experience by doing some occasional, small freelance projects during the course.
Most of what has been said above and discusses multiple times here on polycount is true, if you stick to what they want our of you you will most likely not be employable by the end of the degree, you need to really work hard on you own.
I moved from Barcelona, Spain to study there. I had not done any 3D before or anything and when I got there there was people who were already really really good. For me that meant that was great as it gave me an the goal to get to their level. Because the entry level is quite high you will find yourself surrounded with people who are really talented and everyone is pushing everyone.
The tutors in most cases, some more than others, do care about the students and will always help. Good artists I could look up to in my classroom was one of the biggest motivators for me.
After the three years I did get a Job in the industry here in the UK. I don't think I could afford to go to the University now because it's not just the fees, it's also the living in the UK part of it which is not cheap.
Hope this helps, feel free to message me if you want further info on specifics.
Edit: I didn't read that you were already leaning towards the free one, just wanted to chip in with my experience at Herts
Really the only thing that makes me not want to go to Herts are the costs. The course alone costs around 34,000€. When you add the money I'd have to spend on moving to the UK and living (near London) to that, the cost can be over 50,000€. Because a job isn't guaranteed, I'd rather not take the risk of being in debt even when in my thirties.
It really sucks how education is put behind a paywall.
There are some free schools in Sweden as well, but the only problem is that I don't speak Swedish well enough to understand what the teachers are saying
Plus, you would leave school debt-free. This is a no-brainer.
A better way to do it:
- get your free four year education
- after school, search Artstation for the most popular freelance artists
- hire one of them as your personal tutor for a month or two under contract (costs approx $5,000 a month)
- you would own whatever you made together, sell it on an asset store to recover costs over time
- put "Studied under this super-awesome artist who worked on these super-awesome games" on your resume
You would have a free education, direct experience with the best artists in the industry before you even worked in the industry and own assets instead of having liabilities (debt).
Yeah, you're right, for some reason hiring a mentor didn't come to mind. Getting a good mentor could definitely help in some areas in which the school maybe couldn't. Thanks for the tip!
All the best with your endeavours, with a good attitude i'm sure you will learn and become good and make it to the industry!