Chibi warrior girl
polycounter lvl 10
'lo, I've been working on this for a game with some friends and I kinda need some feedback before I start doing 20+ armor types and other types of weird stuff
(Marmoset Viewer here)
main thing I'm worried about is whether the armor textures clash with the cartoon look as I went semi-realistic but feel free to tear this piece apart if you'd like
(Marmoset Viewer here)
main thing I'm worried about is whether the armor textures clash with the cartoon look as I went semi-realistic but feel free to tear this piece apart if you'd like
Replies
I think you could still improve on the face. It is coming across more as a dwarf than chibi.
Eyebrows: Could use some variance/tapering in shape.
Face: Color is a huge factor. If you want that cute chibi look, then I think it would be beneficial to smooth some of that color and give her some slight blush or color other than yellow. I feel like the lips are too realistic for the stle of chibi. Her cheeks could use some attention, they seem like you pulled them out to get the silhouette but you have an underdefined jawline that could have helped. I looked at the Marmoset viewer and the behind the ears could use some love as they feel a little lumpy.
I think this character could be pretty cool and you are off to a good start. I don't mean to come off as harsh or overly critical, but I think you could push this a lot farther.
The eyebrows are a choice, she's supposed to have bushy straight eyebrows.
About the lips, would you think is it better to straight up erase them from both the normal and the diffuse or should I try changing the shape of the face as well? I've also received some feedback that the mouth itself should be a bit more narrow, what do you think?
She does have some blush by the way, just look at the Albedo map in the viewer. Guess I set up the material wrong. :S
I think you will have to try a few tests with the lips. The shape of the upper lip isn't working as is. I would try changing that before making the mouth more narrow. But if you have it in Zbrush you can just duplicate the mesh and freely mess with it to see what will work better. Overall just simplify the shape of the mouth.
I checked the Albedo and she seems to have blush on her jaw, but not her cheeks. Her cheeks are where the blood would be flowing and provides the most appeal.
Another thing I noticed is that you could smooth your normals on the face a bit and it would feel cleaner. I can do some draw overs when I get home tonight and that might help.
By the way this would work for a lot of projects, but you said you are going to be doing 20+ armors, so it is worth it to go the extra mile on the face.
Yep, see what you mean.
Same with these. I'll jump into zbrush and mess with her lips and eyebrows a bit and try to smooth her face a bit.
In all honesty I think the hard edges on her face are due to polycount as opposed to normals since it's supposed to be quite a bit lowpoly. Guess either something went wrong with the baking or I should relax her topology a little. Good thing the head is separate from the body.
And yeah, I do have some concepts to work with, I don't know if the artist would like if I showed those around, I'll ask and report I guess. We decided to deviate from the art style a bit tho so that might have something to do with it, but most of the elements (wide cheeks, shape of the jaw, eyebrows) are part of the character and come from that.
Looking forwards to your paintovers btw, those might help quite a lot.
See if you can make the face texture work with a minimum amount of details. Tone the brighter values down a bit, as especially the forehead seems a bit too bright for me at the moment. Also some more hair in that area might be a good idea.
Her eyes are also missing some shading that occurs where the iris dips inward (darken the part towards the upper eyelid).
You might want to look at Chang-Gon Shin's work for reference: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/puzzle-dragons-idunn-idunna
The sculpt of the ear could be simplified a lot. It would match your style and make the low polyness less obvious.
I have to redo her face textures anyway since I'll have to rebake her head and change topology so I'll get back to it eventually.
@Fenn: again, the nose shape is part of the character (she isn's supposed to be a straight-up cutie by character design). Your other suggestions make sense. I'm going to throw her head into zbrush again and see what I can conjure.
I can't do a paintover or anything right now, but if you're willing to hold of on that retopo for a day I can give a proper overview of what I think looks a bit off (while taking into account the actual character), and what makes this read poorly overall, along with some weird quirks you have here that stop it looking like a chibi model.
If you'd be happy for me to do this, a clean front/side shot in zbrush would be super appreciated (even if you decide to move on but would still like the feedback)! I'd like to see this go from an adequate piece to a great one, while keeping your original vision intact, I'm just sorry I don't have the time to write up a good post right now!
@BagelHero: here you go, take your time. Hope you just meant the head, I don't think I'm going again over the body (expecially since it's covered by clothes on 70% of the outfits)
These shots are great, thank you for replying so quick. I'll be able to get back to my computer in a few hours, with some luck! And good luck with the hair, too!
Fire away.
If anything, the character's body was meant to be plumper and with stumpier legs (or, as the artist put it, "the body of somebody whose main activity is throwing joypads at a TV"), but in all honesty I don't see those kind of characters sprint around in plate armor so I messed around with the proportions a bit, it might have gone wrong at that phase
Chibi characters don't really need to be fully functional, so much as easily readable and cute, so your alterations may have sort of messed with the read of the whole character. I'd like to see the concept you used.
I tried to use my lunch break to draw up some visual notes, but couldn't get something that would clear up anything for you, so for now the conclusion is basically:
- The bulky torso, shoulder pads and tiny hips give the overall impression of a masculine body, the upside down triangle shape made is classical stylized shorthand for "male".
- The balance of the head, torso and hips is off.
- Making the upper torso a little smaller helps, but changed the style a lot
- Widening the hips and making everything a bit chunkier also helps, doesn't call for a change of the style so much.
- There's a few combinations of approaches to proportions that would make this better, but I feel like without the concept I'd only be guessing, on what would work "best".
But I digress. I feel like the face has a lot you could improve with very simple alterations! You're really close to being there, I think, but it feels as if you're encountering some technical sculpting/workflow issues that are preventing a sense of confidence and character from coming through.
- Don't forget to go back to a low subdivision to change big shapes without causing any muddiness! And polish/smooth shapes as you need to.
- From the side it becomes apparent that the head sits too far forward, the neck usually emerges from the middle of the head, an invisible midline tracing down where the ear attaches, and serving as a guide for where to attach the neck.
- The pulled back jaw/chin is probably the biggest thing causing a strange look to the face.
- You shouldn't be able to see the caruncle (inner corner of the eye from the side, it should probably be pulled back more!
- Double check the nostril placement, and the planes of the nose could stand to be more defined. See the "Asaro Planes of the Face" reference sculpture, and also anatomy4artists. :thumbup:
Stuff from people better at explaining than I am that might help:
[ame]
https://www.artstation.com/artwork/frozen-fan-art-breakdown-tuto
I feel like I'm skimming over a lot of things, so if something in particular doesn't make sense to you just ask and I'll address it specifically! It was probably me rushing, haha. :poly136: Sorry for being a bit brief (for me). I hope this can help a little!
Oh... torso proportions look off because of the armor, I had a specific request to make it look buff as heck, in actuality her body looks more like this, which is still far from ideal proportions but you still get the idea.
Terrific feedback btw, thanks. I'll surely get you back on that.
@PyrZern: the seams on the boots are on the back and where it connects with the sole, the one you see on the front is a crease
going after the hair next, i'll have to redo it from scratch but hopefully it's gonna be worth it
[edit] worked a bit more on it, I think I'm comfortable with the face now, did some experiment on the hair. Tbh I don't like how the back looks but if you can't suggest me a decent flow I'll probably go with it