Which universities are good for game arts

Doxturtle

I am not asking whether I should go to uni or not (this has been asked a lot), I want to know peoples experiences with game arts at UK universities, and which ones would be best to look at.

At the moment I have looked at:

De Montfort: http://www.dmu.ac.uk/study/courses/undergraduate-courses/game-art-design-ba-degree/game-art-design-ba.aspx#ad-image-22

Hertfordshire: http://www.herts.ac.uk/courses/3d-games-art-and-design

UCA: http://www.ucreative.ac.uk/ba-computer-games (although I have heard some negative feedback already)

Does anyone have any recommendations for game art courses to look at, and good universities to consider?

Kel-Shaded

I've never heard of UCA,
Hertfordshire is a great choice
but Bournemouth, Bradford and Abertay Dundee are up there to.

almighty_gir

my advice?

don't go to university for game art. go to university for art. and learn how to apply that to game art here on polycount.

Kel-Shaded

Thats actually a very good idea

Doxturtle

Most of the courses I have seen do that, they teach the basic principles of art, like colour theory and lighting, then they teach you how to apply that to 3d models and game environments.

I prefer 3d work to things like drawing and painting (although I do like drawing), so a game art course would give me some opportunity to get better at these, but to also focus on using the software for 3d work.

Going to a game art course would also give me access to all the software I need, without having to shell out tons of money that I don't have(you could argue that going to uni is more expensive, but it isn't really that bad in England compared to the USA)

almighty_gir

i'm not saying learn the basic principles of art, i'm saying specialize as an artist, and learn how to apply it to games somewhere outside of university.

you will have access to all the software you need anyway, autodesk offer their software for free for students, and you can get student discounts on other software just by virtue of being at university, regardless of your enrolled course.

almighty_gir

This is a long read, but it's very worth it and surprisingly relevant, in fact it's incredibly relevant to our industry.

Off Mike Rowe's Facebook Wall

Kyle Smith writes...

Howard Dean recently criticized Gov Scott Walker for never finishing college, stating that he was "unknowledgeable." What would your response be on college as a requirement for elected office?

Hi Kyle

Back in 1990, The QVC Cable Shopping Channel was conducting a national talent search. I had no qualifications to speak of, but I needed a job, and thought TV might be a fun way to pay the bills. So I showed up at The Marriott in downtown Baltimore with a few hundred other hopefuls, and waited for a chance to audition. When it was my turn, the elevator took me to the top floor, where a man no expression led me into a suite and asked me to take a seat behind a large desk. Across from the desk, there was a camera on a tripod. On the desk was a digital timer with an LED display. I took a seat as the man clipped a microphone on my shirt and explained the situation.

“The purpose of this audition is to see if you can talk for eight minutes without stuttering, blathering, passing out, or throwing up. Any questions?”

“What would you like me to talk about,” I asked.

The man pulled a pencil from behind his ear and rolled it across the desk. “Talk to me about that pencil. Sell it. Make me want it. But be yourself. If you can do that for eight minutes, the job is yours. Ok?”

I looked at the pencil. It was yellow. It had a point on one end, and an eraser on the other. On the side were the words, Dixon Ticonderoga Number 2 SOFT.

“Ok,” I said.

The man set the timer to 8:00, and walked behind the tripod. He pressed a button and a red light appeared on the camera. He pressed another button and the timer began to count backwards. “Action,” he said. I picked up the pencil and started talking.

“Hi there. My name’s Mike Rowe, and I only have eight minutes to tell you why this is finest pencil on Planet Earth. So let’s get right to it.”

I opened the desk drawer and found a piece of hotel stationary, right where I hoped it would be. I picked up the pencil and wrote the word, QUALITY in capital letters. I held the paper toward the camera.

“As you can plainly see, The #2 Dixon Ticonderoga leaves a bold, unmistakable line, far superior to the thin and wispy wake left by the #3, or the fat, sloppy skid mark of the unwieldy #1. Best of all, the Ticonderoga is not filled with actual lead, but “madagascar graphite,” a far safer alternative for anyone who likes to chew on their writing implements.”
To underscore the claim, I licked the point. I then discussed the many advantages of the Ticonderoga’s color.
“A vibrant yellow, perfectly suited for an object that needs to stand out from the clutter of a desk drawer.”
I commented on the comfort of it’s design.

“Unlike those completely round pencils that press hard into the web of your hand, the Ticonderoga’s circumference is comprised of eight, gently planed surfaces, which dramatically reduce fatigue, and make writing for extended periods an absolute delight.”

I pointed out the “enhanced eraser,” which was “guaranteed to still be there - even when the pencil was sharpened down to an unusable nub.”

I opined about handmade craftsmanship and American made quality. I talked about the feel of real wood.
“In a world overrun with plastic and high tech gadgets, isn’t it comforting to know that some things haven’t evolved into something shiny and gleaming and completely unrecognizable?’”

After all that, there was still five minutes on the timer. So I shifted gears and considered the pencil’s impact on Western Civilization. I spoke of Picasso and Van Gogh, and their hundreds of priceless drawings - all done in pencil. I talked about Einstein and Hawking, and their many complicated theories and theorems - all done in pencil.
“Pen and ink are fine for memorializing contracts,” I said, “but real progress relies on the ability to erase and start anew. Archimedes said he could move the world with a lever long enough, but when it came to proving it, he needed a pencil to make the point.”

With three minutes remaining, I moved on to some personal recollections about the role of pencils in my own life. My first legible signature, my first book report, my first crossword puzzle, and of course, my first love letter. I may have even worked up a tear as I recalled the innocence of my youth, scribbled out on a piece of looseleaf with all the hope and passion a desperate 6th grader could muster...courtesy of a #2 pencil.
With :30 seconds left on the timer, I looked fondly at the Dixon Ticonderoga, and sat silently for five seconds. Then I wrapped it up.

“We call it a pencil, because all things need a name. But today, let’s call it what it really is. A time machine. A match maker. A magic wand. And let’s say it can all be yours...for just .99 cents.”

The timer read 0:00. The man walked back to the desk. He took the pencil and wrote “YOU’RE HIRED” on the stationary, and few days later, I moved to West Chester, PA. And a few days after that, I was on live television, face to face with the never-ending parade of trinkets and chochkes that comprise QVC’s overnight inventory.

I spent three months on the graveyard shift, five nights a week. Technically, this was my training period, which was curious, given the conspicuous absence of supervision, or anything that could be confused with actual instruction. Every few minutes a stagehand would bring me another mysterious “must have item,” which I’d blather about nonsensically until it was whisked away and replaced with something no less baffling. In this way, I slowly uncovered the mysteries of my job, and forged a tenuous relationship with an audience of chronic insomniacs and narcoleptic lonely-hearts. It was a crucible of confusion and ambiguity, and in hindsight, the best training I ever had.
Which brings me to the point of your question, Kyle.

I don’t agree with Howard Dean - not at all.

Here’s what I didn’t understand 25 years ago. QVC had a serious recruiting problem. Qualified candidates were applying in droves, but failing miserably on the air. Polished salespeople with proven track records were awkward on TV. Professional actors with extensive credits couldn’t be themselves on camera. And seasoned hosts who understood live television had no experience hawking products. So eventually, QVC hit the reset button. They stopped looking for “qualified” people, and started looking for anyone who could talk about a pencil for eight minutes.
QVC had confused qualifications with competency.

Perhaps America has done something similar?

Look at how we hire help - it’s no so different than how we elect leaders. We search for work ethic on resumes. We look for intelligence in test scores. We search for character in references. And of course, we look at a four-year diploma as though it might actually tell us something about common-sense and leadership.
Obviously, we need a bit more from our elected officials than the instincts of a home shopping host, but the business of determining what those “qualifications” are is completely up to us. We get to decide what matters most. We get to decide if a college degree or military service is somehow determinative. We get to decide if Howard Dean is correct.
Anyone familiar with my foundation knows my position. I think a trillion dollars of student loans and a massive skills gap are precisely what happens to a society that actively promotes one form of education as the best course for the most people. I think the stigmas and stereotypes that keep so many people from pursuing a truly useful skill, begin with the mistaken belief that a four-year degree is somehow superior to all other forms of learning. And I think that making elected office contingent on a college degree is maybe the worst idea I’ve ever heard.

But of course, Howard Dean is not the real problem. He’s just one guy. And he’s absolutely right when he says that many others will judge Scott Walker for not finishing college. That's the real problem.
However - when Howard Dean called the Governor “unknowledgeable,” he rolled out more than a stereotype. He rolled a pencil across the desk, and gave Scott Walker eight minutes to knock it out of the park.
It’ll be fun to see if he does.

- Mike

Credentials are nothing more than a peer group assessment of potential, it is not an indication of any actual accomplishment.

TL:DR -
A Game art degree isn't as important as your competency at game art, there are many hundreds, thousands even, of game artists who have high graded and distinctions in their degrees, but they will never work in the industry because they're terrible artists - they just fulfilled the course brief.

Learn how to be an amazing artist, and then apply it to games, you will have a much better chance of landing a job.

littleclaude

Hi Doxturtle,

I am one of the lecturers at the University of Hertfordshire so I am happy to answer any of your questions. I would be happy to show you around the campus if you would like to pop in for an open day.

If its any help have a look at the courses on the Skillset website, they have a course accreditation system which is kept in check by the UK Games Industry. There is also lots of great information on that website about getting into the industry
http://courses.creativeskillset.org/pick_the_tick_degree_courses/accredited_computer_games_courses

Here is last years BA Games Art showreel which I really must update soon! Also feel free to talk to our students about the course on our forum at www.3dhit.co.uk



If you would like to see more information about our UHAnimation course there is a Polycount thread, we have around 1000 applications for 90 places so its well worth a look at the advice sheet- http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=68766

In your first year you will get to try all the courses under the animation umbrella, 2D, 3D, VFX and Games Art and your welcome to change pathways at any point during your first year, here are some examples of those pathways.



There is also an MA in Games and Animation and we have just set up a Games & Visual Effects Research Lab (G+VERL). We can even offer a PhD but will save all that for another day.:)

Digital Animation Course Overview
[vv]31601310[/vv]

I wish you all the best for the future whichever path you take.

littleclaude

Just noticed on that last video at 3.30 its got Polycount's own Scott Homer ah! so young, we miss you :P

Also its well worth having a look at this website - http://madeincreativeuk.com/

The website is a campaign whose aim is to increase awareness of video game and digital media development in the United Kingdom.

xvampire

very nice demoreel compilation littleclaude .

littleclaude

xvampire wrote: »

very nice demoreel compilation littleclaude .

Thank you Arif, means a lot coming from you, big fan of your work



Also here are the course links for the University of Hertfordshire.

Fees, UK/EU Students, Full time: £9,000 for the 2015 academic year, (yes I go on student marches to try and keep the costs down) :poly127:

International £10,000 or US $15,000 starting to see more students coming from the US, Australia, New Zealand, China, Malaysia, India and so on.


BA Bachelor of Arts

BA (Hons) 2D Animation & Character for Digital Media | http://www.herts.ac.uk/courses/2d-animation-and-character-for-digital-media

BA (Hons) 3D Games Art & Design | http://www.herts.ac.uk/courses/3d-games-art-and-design

BA (Hons) 3D Computer Animation and Modelling | http://www.herts.ac.uk/courses/3d-computer-animation-and-modelling

BA (Hons) Visual Effects for Film and Television | http://www.herts.ac.uk/courses/visual-effects-for-film-and-television


(MA) Master of Arts

MA Animation | http://www.herts.ac.uk/courses/ma-animation

MA Games-Art | http://www.herts.ac.uk/gsa_courses/MA-Games-Art.cfm


Can also offer PhD

chronic

I'm a character artist - have been doing this for almost 6 years. I've had to review a lot of resumes and portfolios. I never look at the education background, I only care about the quality of work.

I have a Bachelors of Fine Arts that cost a lot of money and I didn't really need it to get the job I have. My friend had a MFA and over 40k in debt, still had to work up from intern in concept art. I resent that art school didn't help me get a job, other than providing an environment to 'grow up' in. I understand your inclination to avoid drawing and focus on 3D - thats what I did - and it was a mistake. I would appreciate my BFA a lot more if I had done more drawing, sculpture and especially painting even though it didn't have a huge impact on my job search.

If I had to do it again? I would have chosen a computer science degree. There is no more desirable and highly paid candidate than a programer in video games. You can go into Tech Art, Graphics, Game Systems, back-end server stuff. A computer science degree gives you a ton of options.

Not technically inclined and love ART? Find something inexpensive that won't leave you with debt. Like the '3D' aspects most? Find a sculpture program. Truly, at the end of the day, traditional art will make you a much better ARTIST than any game program. Being a great artist is what will get you hired.

I have many co workers who work as instructors at local colleges and game programs. Their recruiters try and get us to hire those students. For the most part we don't - they aren't good enough. Many of them don't apply themselves during their schooling and it shows in their work. The ones we do hire are hired as temporary workers.

Point?
Work hard, then work harder. Traditional skills are important. Debt will haunt you. Computer science is like the medical degree of the games world.

I hope my post doesn't sound like I don't value higher education. I think its very important and you will benefit. But if you want to get a job in video games then a 'Video Game Art' program is not usually the best route.

littleclaude

chronic wrote: »

Computer science is like the medical degree of the games world.

We have computer-science related courses should you wish to go down that path http://www.herts.ac.uk/apply/schools-of-study/computer-science

Doxturtle, Wherever you go make sure you talk to the lecturers about the course, go on an open day, talk to the students, its really important as it will be three years of your life and lots of money.

Good luck.

lefix

I wouldn't say universities are bad. Just don't expect to learn everything you need to learn to land a job. It will take you maybe 25% of the way, and you'll need to put in alot more work to reach industry level of quality.

That said, what universities are good for is throwing a bunch of young kids together who share the same interests and help you stay motivated. You will form friendships that will last through your entire career. It is the best place to begin networking.
Also, you will probably be able to play around with tech that you can't do at home on your computer. I was able to play around with 3D printing, 3D Scanning, Motion capturing, VR Headsets, Stereoscopy, Panoramic HDR cameras, various photo and video cameras, Renderfarms, and whatever else I forgot. And all kinds of software of course.

I don't regret getting that kind of education, but then again I studied in Germany where it's basically free.

JacqueChoi

This sounds antiquated, but the most important part about post-secondary education, is actually having a degree - Simply for dealing with borders.

Much of what you learn in that time can be complete hogwash, but actually having that sheet of paper opens up many global opportunities for you.

Living in Montreal, I have far too many friends and co-workers that are deported shortly after their visa is up. We have to turn away every over-qualified applicant without a degree, and unfortunately I've seen the same happen with plenty of Canadians trying to get work in the States (although as a Canadian, our degree costs us about 20% of what an American one does - Go Go Socialism!).


One thing you should possibly consider if you DO want to go to school, is applying to a Canadian School as an International Student. I'm actually surprised how this isn't brought up more.

I think it's triple the Canadian Rate (so still around 30% of what you would pay in the states).

One of the more decorated 3D/Animation schools in Canada is Sheridan:
Their rates are:
https://www.sheridancollege.ca/admissions/fees-and-finances/academic-fees/tuition-fees.aspx
$13,576 / year for International Students.
$54,304 for a 4 year degree.

(Should also note that this is in Canadian Dollars, which is currently sitting at $0.80 on the USD).

So with the current exchange rate, the degree in Canada would cost you $43,443, at a highly acclaimed institute, that is recognized worldwide.

skyline5gtr

Don't go to school, waste of money. Unless you plan to get a job that specifically requires a degree

Kwramm

if you think about a degree, think long term.
in the short term it won't help you to get a job. But that shouldn't really be your only criteria to base your decision on.

In the long term, it will allow you to work abroad more easily. It will allow you to specialize, change careers or augment your skills if you ever want to study some more. I graduated over 10 years ago, and I wouldn't have thought I would become a technical artist. But here I am and thanks to that degree I'm now doing a masters in software engineering.

Neox

almighty_gir wrote: »

my advice?

don't go to university for game art. go to university for art. and learn how to apply that to game art here on polycount.

Are there even any left teaching how to properly paint, draw and sculpt? Modern art is in most cases way too abstract, the market is horrible and the market dictates what is being taught in so many cases. At least over here.
Art Unis are the places turning down people like Jana Schirmer for not being good enough at arts (and even back then she was kicking some butt) i know many other great digital and classical artists being turned down by unis.
I know cases where an artist didn't finish their studies, because they didn't want their uni to profit in any way from them being successful at what they do. This is one of the cases, where he basically got bullied by the profs and students, for learning anatomy, learning classical painting techniques and so on.

I'd be careful with that tip, but i would really like to know which Unis would still teach some valuable knowledge about art.

AtticusMars

Are there even any left teaching how to properly paint, draw and sculpt? Modern art is in most cases way too abstract, the market is horrible and the market dictates what is being taught in so many cases. At least over here.

Can't speak for everywhere but from what I gather from talking to my friends in school in the US, virtually any school with an illustration program is going to have you doing tons of drawing and painting.

Example from Art Center: http://www.artcenter.edu/accd/programs/undergraduate/illustration/course_of_study.jsp

I know cases where an artist didn't finish their studies, because they didn't want their uni to profit in any way from them being successful at what they do. This is one of the cases, where he basically got bullied by the profs and students, for learning anatomy, learning classical painting techniques and so on.

That's really bizarre, I would hope that's not the norm for art schools

JacqueChoi

I'm an Adjunct Instructor at the Champlain College of Vermont (Montreal Campus).

There's quite a few industry alumni work there at the main campus in Burlington, and quite a few Montreal Game Devs are teaching the courses up here in the Montreal Campus.


But As most would agree, 99% of it is what you put into it yourself.

littleclaude

@ - JacqueChoi - hello, do you offer lecturer exchanges? swap over for a week? I would love to come and see Montreal I know loads of old work colleagues that are working their now. In return I can show you around beautiful Hertfordshire/London.

@ [Neox - QUOTE= I would really like to know which Uni's would still teach some valuable knowledge about art.[/QUOTE]

(big fan of Airbørn by the way)

In the UK I would look at the courses that have been approved by the Creative Skillset as its a requirement for any arts based course.

For example during a students study at the UH, life drawing once per week, taught digital painting, concept, comping, two extra drop in classes per week in the evening 5-7pm, concept art drop lessons in the evening with Frank Victoria, colour theory, history of animation & games and loads more.

I can vouch for Frank that he thinks Art knowledge is super important:) After working at Weta on films like The Hobbit, Tin Tin, Thor and so on, He just told me he is enjoying the freedom of being able to do 30 minute Daily Spit Paintings on Facebook, he posts them on his blog, (wish I didn't look, I thought I was good picking up a sketch book from time to time!:poly122:) - http://frankvictoria-lepicte.blogspot.co.uk/



Its so cool to see him knock this stuff up in 30 minutes, its like magic! such an inspiration and all round nice guy.

Neox

AtticusMars wrote: »

Can't speak for everywhere but from what I gather from talking to my friends in school in the US, virtually any school with an illustration program is going to have you doing tons of drawing and painting.

Example from Art Center: http://www.artcenter.edu/accd/programs/undergraduate/illustration/course_of_study.jsp



That's really bizarre, I would hope that's not the norm for art schools

yeah illustration courses are something different, they teach how to draw, as an illustrator you will definitely need that skill. I was basically talking about Universities of Arts, where at the end of it you are an artist. Not like a commercial artist. But maybe thats a german thing again, while my job title is 3d artist, i would never call myself Künstler (german for artist). I am a craftsman.