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Is there a demand for hard surface artists in comparison to other fields?

polycounter lvl 9
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tynew polycounter lvl 9
I've been in awe lately at the amount of amazing hard surface weapons and vehicles constantly flowing on Polycount. It's a little demotivating in a way, I feel like I would never reach the talent displayed and always be a few steps behind. So many amazing artists.

In comparison to other fields, would it just be better to go directly into environment art and develop the skills/aquire the income needed to transition into hard surface? I'm really interested in what industry professionals think about the hard surface field in general.

I do know there will always be work for the cream of the crop for such people like Tor Frick or Paul Pepera etc. but these guys are like the Feng Zhu of this field :)

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  • marks
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    marks greentooth
    There is pretty much no such job title as "hard surface artist". If you want to do environment art, make environments. "Hard Surface" is not really a field imo, it's a skill.
  • juniez
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    juniez polycounter lvl 10
    you can be a vehicle/weapons artist if you really want
  • EarthQuake
    marks wrote: »
    There is pretty much no such job title as "hard surface artist". If you want to do environment art, make environments. "Hard Surface" is not really a field imo, it's a skill.

    Right, though some roles will generally require a lot more hard surface modeling that others. If you're interested in entering the industry and doing primarily hard surface work, shoot for a junior environment artist position. This will (generally) have you doing:
    Props,
    Building/modular sets
    Tiling textures
    Set dressing

    Usually hard surface and some sculpting will be required as well.

    From there, most artists go one of two ways, either onto a senior environment position which will generally be more of the same but may include more level-design aspects or maybe just more important assets. Others may get more dedicated roles working on hero assets like guns, important props, vehicles, etc. Generally speaking, there are a lot more environment artist positions available than there are positions for hero assets like weapons, vehicles and characters because most art in games is environment art.
  • almighty_gir
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    almighty_gir ngon master
    Only if you're Tor Frick.
  • marks
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    marks greentooth
    Yeah but his job title is "Tor Frick". There can be only one ;D
  • Francois_K
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    Francois_K interpolator
    Only if you're Tor Frick.

    Senior 3D Tor Frick - Tor 'Bevel' Frick
  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    Also, keep in mind that on the job and in production, 99% of the time the person creating the design is not the person modeling it.

    While some rare studios do allow for people to improvise while modeling like Tor and Paul do in their very cool videos, a hard surface modeling position will almost never require you to do so.

    And that's where the irony lies really : the best production modelers are usually the ones with a very good grasp of design and visual vocabularies, even though the daily job of a modeler might not always flex these important brain muscles.
  • Amsterdam Hilton Hotel
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    Amsterdam Hilton Hotel insane polycounter
    I'm a weapons/vehicles artist, which is a hard surface role. The jobs exist, but I think there's far less of them than environment jobs.

    Whether you want to do it is up to you. As Pior said you will not be doing design work which is unfortunately the most rewarding part. You also won't interact directly with as much of the game as a generalist prop artist or an environment artist would.

    Your work will be in marketing materials, covers and screenshots, prime placement in the game etc. since you'll be doing mostly hero assets. That's a good thing for your visibility but it also means you get more oversight from producers and directors.

    Everything's a tradeoff :)
  • tynew
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    tynew polycounter lvl 9
    Awesome, thanks for the replies! So what about in terms of getting freelance work? Generalist>Enviro? Or can Enviro pick up just as much?
  • EarthQuake
    Honestly I think you're getting too caught up in titles. The thing you should focus on is being able to do industry quality work. If you can do better work than the next guy, you have a good chance of getting work, no matter what style of work or what the title is.

    From a cursory glance of your posting history, you haven't created a thread to show art since 2013. You don't have a portfolio linked so I assume you don't have one. Finish some work and put together a portfolio is the best advice I can give. All the rest is putting the horse before the cart.
  • tynew
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    tynew polycounter lvl 9
    You're right. Thanks for getting straight to the point :). I think in general I'm not happy with where I am with my skills right now.I do have a portfolio but decided it's not even worth showing it anymore, as my artwork is sub-par at best in comparison to industry standard work and the stuff here on polycount.

    I think with my previous post I was trying to ask in broad terms, if there would be more opportunities by expanding skills rather than concentrating on a specific area. You made me realize that if your talented regardless of what you do, you can still get work.
  • JacqueChoi
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    JacqueChoi polycounter
    I think your work is pretty good, but it's just not overly ambitious, and not particularly memorable. Plenty of other artists have 'weapons' covered, and are already getting professional recognition for it.

    With your skillset, you could put in a lot more time to make something like this (which would get you a LOT more notice):

    http://www.peperaart.com/
    http://www.faustodesign.com/#/robots/


    Be the guy that's 'known' for something exceptionally ambitious. Be the guy that made the entire interior of a Camera:
    digitalcam600.jpg

    Or be the guy that made the turbo charged v8 Automatic Transmission:
    Transmission.jpg

    Be the guy that made a Radial Engine:
    a4bb332248ef88a1bee81e5b10e00b2a.jpg
  • yodude87
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    yodude87 polycounter lvl 5
    Only if you're Tor Frick.

    dood, i really, REALLY laughed at this hahahaahhahah
  • FelixL
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    FelixL polycounter lvl 9
    I don't agree with the notion that hero assets/hard surface work automatically means less creativity and more supervision. At Crytek, the hardsurface guys were almost always the ones that were also designing the assets.

    As for job chances, it depends. Good HS guys used to be rare, lots of people dislike hard surface modeling because there are more pitfalls and it's a more technical type of approach, especially once it comes to making clean bakes. But that may very well change with new worflows, Zbrush, modo, etc.

    If you really love it, then sure, get into it, but I wouldn't do it out of career strategy aspects or anything like that.
  • cptSwing
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    cptSwing polycounter lvl 11
    That radial engine.. jaysus.
  • tynew
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    tynew polycounter lvl 9
    @JacqueChoi
    Thank you for the motivational words, I'm a fan of your work! You're right, people have to produce something out of the ordinary to get noticed.

    @FelixL
    Thank you for the info. I'll follow your advice closely.
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