Questions about freelancing and mod project involvement
polycounter lvl 14
Hello again everyone,
I've spoken recently with a few people in my ongoing attempt to network, and take whatever advice I can to begin a career in game development as an environment artist. I've never done mod projects but the advice to get involved in such has come up. I've never been interested. I've received the advice, in the past from others, to never work for free, and be aware of people trying to take advantage of you. After having my last work get some features and a lot of views, the offers to get involved in such have returned. I've always felt that the time is better spent on portfolio pieces that really could show what I can do best, with a subject I can really get behind, and with a timeline I can manage. How important is it? Do you strongly recommend mod projects? Is that what my resume is lacking? Another issue is that often I go to their websites and have a hard time feeling out whether or not its a "legitimate" project. No offense intended, but if you don't know them, its a little weird when you realize how small a thing it is.
Secondly, I'm getting offers for "small" freelance work. Jobs that are, for example, start up projects offering to pay me roughly minimum wage per asset (because they don't have much) for a demo to get a kickstarter campaign in force. So are such things my ticket to getting started, quitting my retail job and getting experience? Or should I be going with my gut and realizing that I should keep at the folio full-time hours and wait for the right opportunity that pays appropriately. Thoughts?
Thanks
I've spoken recently with a few people in my ongoing attempt to network, and take whatever advice I can to begin a career in game development as an environment artist. I've never done mod projects but the advice to get involved in such has come up. I've never been interested. I've received the advice, in the past from others, to never work for free, and be aware of people trying to take advantage of you. After having my last work get some features and a lot of views, the offers to get involved in such have returned. I've always felt that the time is better spent on portfolio pieces that really could show what I can do best, with a subject I can really get behind, and with a timeline I can manage. How important is it? Do you strongly recommend mod projects? Is that what my resume is lacking? Another issue is that often I go to their websites and have a hard time feeling out whether or not its a "legitimate" project. No offense intended, but if you don't know them, its a little weird when you realize how small a thing it is.
Secondly, I'm getting offers for "small" freelance work. Jobs that are, for example, start up projects offering to pay me roughly minimum wage per asset (because they don't have much) for a demo to get a kickstarter campaign in force. So are such things my ticket to getting started, quitting my retail job and getting experience? Or should I be going with my gut and realizing that I should keep at the folio full-time hours and wait for the right opportunity that pays appropriately. Thoughts?
Thanks
Replies
On few job interviews I had people would show interest in my modding experience and ask me questions about it.
Working on mod projects teaches you stuff that small freelance jobs won't.
Teamwork, pipeline, mass producing assets with consistent quality, and all that jazz.
Having mods in resume will also suggest that you have some passion for making games.
When veterans say stuff about "people trying to take advantage of you" and "never working for free" they don't usually mean mods.
They mean projects where someone gets money while you don't. Or royalty based projects which supposedly go wrong quite often.
Of course you can encounter offers from 14 years old kids making their first mod, who are like "Your stuff is awesum, work for me plz? PLZ? ok?" Which is kinda like trying to take advantage of your skills.
But I assume that you also get better offers so if you have some time it's not a bad idea to pick something you like and see where it goes.
As for freelance jobs, quitting the normal job seems too radical at this point but if you wanna do freelance you gotta start doing it eventually.
If you keep waiting for some magical amazing offer, then when you actually get it it may turn out that lack of prior experience at freelancing will put off potential client or cause problems during work.
Only after doing some actual work you get a good idea of how long it takes you to create model x, texture y, and how they should be priced.
However, if you get a chance to work on some sort of mod or indie project that is done to a AAA level of quality, that could be helpful. If it's a project that is already getting a substantial amount of attention AND done to AAA quality, that would be quite nice.
Having worked on some random post apocalyptic zombie kill fest mod (or similar projects) that most people have never heard of won't matter much at all.
At that point its all about finding the right project. Obviously you want to work a on something that interests you, with a role on the team that will help you towards your greater goals of improving in your chosen discipline. You want a project that is professional enough that you get solid production experience (having and asset list and actual deadlines would be a good start), but you probably want to avoid those projects that pretend to be real games and try to prevent you from talking about the work in any way (if you can't show the work, I wouldn't work on the project).
Of course, if you have some very specific project you want to do, and you're determined and manage your time well on your own, personal projects are going to be a more direct and efficient way to fill out a portfolio, one which will give you total control over the process.
In terms of freelance vs mod work, obviously I would take freelance every day of the week, However, for artists starting out who don't have industry level skills, too little experience or lack the confidence to do paid work, mods are an excellent way to get your feet wet. I worked on mods in my teens, and mod work + Polycount prepared me for the production environment quite well.
"You're portfolio is going in the right direction. The only thing you need to do is prove you can make in-game assets...
...You must prove to employers you have 1) worked with a team 2) created assets meant to be viewed in-game -- something only a mod (or job) can give you.
...It's unheard of to hire artists who've only made screen renders. ..."
While on one hand I respectfully appreciate the time (and he was asked), on the other hand I'm thinking this doesn't make sense. Based on years of research and everything on Polycount from countless professionals, placing art in an game editor that renders in realtime is what is needed in the portfolio to demonstrate such, which is what I have done. People get jobs all the time without mod experience, unless I'm gravely missing something. Character and weapon artists are showing their work in Marmoset because it's a realtime renderer, it doesn't have to be in a mod. Now I'm not the expert with experience so I humbly asked the Polycount community to confirm. I'm not meaning to argue, just want to be clear.
It does make me think I can help myself by recording a walkthrough of my environments in Unreal, and maybe take greater care to display each asset in the gallery.
However, some sort of experience is VERY HELPFUL indeed, either contract work or mod work. Nobody really wants to hire someone with zero experience, but if your portfolio is amazing they will consider it. I've been in positions to influence hiring and have on numerous occasions pushed for young and inexperienced artists simply because their work was head and shoulders above other artists. Obviously, being awesome is easier said than done.
If you're going to go it entirely alone, you should definitely get your work into a game engine (UE4, Cryengine, etc) so that you understand the whole "actually making game art" process. It would be difficult to get hired as an artist if you have no relevant experience, and all you have are some offline renders with no experience at all in game engines, that's generally true (again unless you're super badass, then nobody will care).
Yea I think that's a tough one. I'm in the same boat as you with wanting to work on folio pieces. From this past month or two applying, I haven't heard back from anyone unless I've talked with someone there. I'm not sure if most places are just looking at my resume and then tossing my portfolio aside.
It'd be nice to know what exactly is needed to get a response/work looked at when applications are sent in. I wonder if working on a mod gets your resume like another step ahead towards being looked at.
Personally, if I was tasked with hiring, I would most definitely base my opinions almost solely on their portfolio first, personality second, and resume third. If there is no actual shipped titles, I wouldnt really spend too much time going through. Finally, honestly wouldnt care much to see where you went to school, if at all, as it really does not make a difference in this industry other than some of your fundamental skills/style and chosen workflow tools. I personally do not list any education, and if employer asks, I will inform.
Personality is HUGE, as in any industry. Make sure you are approachable, accept crit (even if bad, thats half the battle with crit, sifting through the shit) as 99% of the time the person has good intentions of attempting to help, and have a solid body of work. If you do end up on a mod team, absorb all the knowledges. All of them. Also use the deadlines and such to keep yourself on track. You will hear senior artists and just artists that have been around the block talk about time management very very frequently. It's HUGE in this industry, and its also key to be able to produce art in a reasonable amount of time. I have sen artists struggle to keep a job by being slow and perfectionists.
Good luck!