Sets for Agatha!

polycounter lvl 4
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zetheros polycounter lvl 4
Although my set didn't win, I'm still going to make more sets, now that I've learned how to bake maps and all that.

I'm making one set for every Agathian class, and then will be moving onto making sets for Mason classes.

Looks like I'll be working on the MAA set first. Currently I'm retoping the helmet.



  • Lucas Annunziata
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    Lucas Annunziata polycounter lvl 9
    You may want to rethink the design of the helmet a bit. Man-at-arms are very light on their feet and a helmet that large/armored doesn't really fit with their fighting style.
  • Ivenend
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    Ivenend polycounter lvl 3
    the helm may suit for vanguard.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Well, their fighting style is sort of like the maul dilemma... you don't want to be someone who is lightly armoured and relies on speed while using a short weapon, against people who are more armoured, with longer, bigger weapons; that's just suicide. Because IRL, the speed and encumbrance difference between unarmoured and armoured are only slightly noticeable.

    I could make a siege helmet, generally worn by cuirassiers in plate armour; they offered the greatest vision, while protecting everything except for your eyes and upper cheek. A pike thrust to the face would probably make for a very bad day, but at least the MAA is protected from overheads...but not really, since they are 1-shot by most overheads.


    Sheesh, I don't really know what to make anymore. MAAs don't make sense, realistically. And if they don't make sense, their armour won't make sense either. It just doesn't make sense to make a game that imitates a medieval setting, but the game mechanics don't match.

    If I make a helmet that matches the game mechanics for an MAA, like a leather or cloth cap, it won't be accurate to history, since MAAs, or 'man-at-arms' were fully armoured soldiers in plate, just like knights. The only difference was in the title and in owning land and money.
  • jackalope
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    jackalope polycounter lvl 8
    It's not a historic game. It's a game with elements inspired by history.
    I think the point of custom content is to create something that fits the mechanics and is also plausible.
    I would forget titles and real world tactis and such. The game was designed to be fun, not to be accurate (something I appreciate)
    Man at arms were Knights and guys who were practically Knights yes. But in the game they are just the light mele class.
    So just pick something that is a light helmet. Even if it doesn't make total sense.
    You will find something I'm sure of it. You made some great pieces, I'm sure this one will be just as good.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Okay, well I'll work around this, I know it's a game, and I'm already rolling a few ideas around in my head for beginning zbrush sketches.

    However, it's kind of difficult to design helmets for a game when you know how armour works and functions; there's a lot of inner conflict when designing something that obviously (to me) would not work.

    When things don't appear to function as they should; like making a leather cap be part of a melee armour set, it breaches the essence of 'coolness'; which is what makes you go "Wow! That looks really amazing!" or "Oh damn, I wouldn't want to be hit by that!" When you see a piece of art.

    The essence of 'coolness' is basically form and function. You need both. In the instance of making an armour piece, it has to look really cool, and also look like it would do it's job at protecting a person's cranium.

    I suppose if all MAAs were highly trained ninjas, they could probably wear lighter armour, but errgghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhsdzsg,knfdg,kngfngf

    All it takes is a knight with a longsword to point the pointy end at a MAA, and he couldn't do anything besides impale himself, since his weapon is not long enough. Dodging and parrying wouldn't work, since it takes zero effort to step back and keep the longsword trained on the fool with a shorter stick.

    But anyway, I'm getting off my soapbox, and will try to make something that will work.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Here's the new helmet. I designed it for a fighting style that relies on speed and perception, rather than pure defense.
    This helmet isn't historically accurate at all, it's a mishmash of styles optimized for light, agile melee combat. Hope it looks real enough though, and by my observation, it should work alright as an actual helmet, with a few adjustments and ear/neck and jaw plates.

    There's still a few details to add, and then I'm moving onto low-poly!

    "Filthy hobbitsies fantasy armour. Gollum! Gollum! Gollum!!"

  • Frank the Fish
    i am really liking this new helmet its a little fantasy as you said but not to the extent where it becomes unbelievable. awesome work can't wait to see it finished!! :D
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Thanks! It's almost like a lobstertail helmet now, but not quite.

    I'm going to learn how to bake better normal maps before adding any more detail.

  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Hey guys, so I was thinking... I'm probably going to stop here, and just make my own game in UDK. It was a fun run though, and I learned a ton from the contest!

    Sorry for those who want to see this stuff in-game, it's just that I've been wanting to make my own game for awhile now.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Ok, well I guess I'm back. I've added some custom matcaps that I made to this helmet to make it look a little more real, and less like clay.

  • alexd
    Making your own game is a financial challenge :D But ! I love your helmet !
  • sp0nge
    yea man, definitely finish up this helmet either way, it's looking badass! :)
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Added ear/partial neck protection, added padding to the helmet interior, and linen articulation straps, then painted the inside of the helmet a flat black to protect against sweat and condensation.

  • islipaway
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    islipaway polycounter lvl 10
    I like this a lot! Glad to see you're continuing with this, It's much more appealing than your competition entry - to me at least. It's ornate while also being functional and it's completely unlike anything in game while also looking like it could slot straight in!

    The only part I'm not fond of is the front above the brim where the two layers of spikes go up, It feels messy when compared to the rear or the area beneath the brim with the long single sweeping spike which continues all the way to the chin. This looked much better in your earlier version.

    Where helmets painted black inside? That's interesting! It never occurred to me but I guess it would be beneficial in terms of eliminating any chance of reflections distracting you.

    It's a shame the tri/texture limit is so low for helms, I hope you can capture all this detail in your low poly.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Yep, helmets and armour were often painted with a simple black on the inside, since when a person is fighting in plate armour, it basically turns into a steam house, and your breath condensates on the inside of your visor. Pretty gross, had it happen to myself. Without the paint, the carbon steel armour would rust fairly quickly on the inside, and be even more stifling and smelly to wear (strong, grimy rust smell and feel).

    Armour was also covered by a water-repellant, but I'm not sure what it was, maybe it was anything they had available at a given moment, since it would have to be reapplied every now and then. I generally use paste wax, which is beeswax mixed with petroleum distillate. You rub the paste wax onto the steel, and the petroleum distillate evaborates, leaving a coating of orange peel/honey scented beeswax behind.

    Another way armour was protected against rust was how polished it was. Highly polished steel resists rust far better than unpolished, or lightly polished steel, since rough steel has more microscopic holes, bumps, cracks, etc - that water can grab onto. Not to mention, polished steel looks better, and also deflects strikes better, because there's nothing for a weapon to catch onto, either.

    Thanks for the suggestions! I'll work on the front brim area and probably finish up the high-poly today, if all goes well.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Moving onto the high-poly for the sword and buckler!

  • TrevorJ
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    TrevorJ polycounter lvl 9
    This looks awesome man, great shapes and details
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Thanks TrevorJ!

    Last screens of the helm... There's still a few places of high-poly that need to be fixed, especially on the inside of the helmet, but it's relatively easy to do.

    I've been working on the shield high-poly. Not sure if I'll go with the shield detail, but it can be a toggle-able feature.


    Still not good enough, not by a long shot. There is an infinitely long and difficult path ahead of me if I want to become one of those guys people hire for making 3d assets for movies. Still, I'm having a great time learning how to do all of this, so that's a plus :D
  • alexd
    Looking great, and fantastic song !
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    It's really quiet around here.

    I spent about two weeks working on the low-poly. 1200 tris is a really tight budget for a helmet for a 3rd/1st person game, especially if you want to make anything other than a barbute.


    Let me know what you guys think... I know the UV map can be optimized, and that the back of the head needs some more geo. Low-poly and texture maps is what I need to work on!

    Here is the first pass of the normal map, just to identify any problems. The low-poly still needs work, and I can make my UV map more efficient.
  • zetheros
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    zetheros polycounter lvl 4
    Here's the sketchfab link for the helmet:
  • jessabellerina
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    jessabellerina polycounter lvl 2
    zetheros wrote: »
    Here's the new helmet.

    Nice work! I could definitely picture that in-game
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