Female Knight - First Human Study

Stephenssart

Hey everyone so since its coming to the end of the year, and im getting close to graduating at my college i feel my portfolio is extremely lacking. so i want to completea character and id love as much help as possible along the way. ill post a few references now, and soon my start on the Sculpt of the body

just so anyone wants to correct me please do the pipeline im taking is;
Sculpt the body
Sculpt the Hands and head separate
fuse them
create the cloth
then armour
creating the LP
Baking
Texturing - Might Need help with that
im probably missing something so please shout out ^_^

Stephenssart

so after going through zSpheres and touching up this is where im at with the body, im not going for an extreme athlete but more realistic, im using division levels instead of Dynamesh

Chronicle

looks like an excellent start so far. One thing is that certain bits have the little bubbles in them, same problem I am/was having with some of mine. Just smooth those bits out and It'll be tip top.

Stephenssart

just started the head today quickly, going for shapes and trying to keep in mind the anatomy of the zygomatic bones and whatnot, i believe im off at the moment, but i want as much form to be correct as possible so criticism is recommended as i want to do the best i can

Stephenssart

ive been absent at my computer but i managed to put some time into the head and added eyes and suprisingly she doesnt look alien thankfully

Stephenssart

Despising the fact i have to do ears haha i really dont like it haha, that shall be my task now, i added the lips and added definition to the nose, the head seems slightly off but ill continue and adjust as i go on

BagelHero

You're missing lots of key forms of the face.
Check this ref out.


Additionally, your forms are quite blobby, I'd suggest going back and refining on a lower subdiv. Keep it up.

Stephenssart

i dont fully understand entirely, i do and dont see whats missing thats my issue, ive seen people draw over areas that are needing touching if anyone helped and did that it would make things a lot easier

BagelHero

Now that you've asked for it, I'm hesitant. Make sure you try to learn what you're doing wrong here, and don't just replicate.

Yours directly compared to the planes of the face ref


With notes


"Proper" red-line/what I would do differently + breakdown of how to apply the plane ref to your face shape here.


Mainly, I feel that a lot of the lumpy, undefined structure comes from you jumping ahead to a high dynamesh resolution or subdiv. Make sure you work the mesh as far as you possibly can at the lowest sub-div possible before re-dynameshing or subdividing.
Use reference as you sculpt, try to actually understand the forms, not just copy them.
Study this.

Without even going into full study mode on it, I can see there's already some good ref to help you understand the problems with your neck area and eye area, along with all the tips in the "Secrets" tab.

Good luck.

Stephenssart

Thanks for the Advice man i was busy for a few days but i finally got to it and made the changes and it feels a lot better to look at now, i also went and brought back the body so i could redefine some parts and that is also doesn't look bumpy in places anymore, also Moore constructive Criticism please

Stephenssart

so after losing motivation for a while i finally touched a bit on this project and completed the hands to an okay state, hoping i went about this the right way to make a finger then duplicate it before dynameshing and then using Zremesher to get proper form before i used divide to get higher levels of detail

Stephenssart

so i appended everything and hopefully positioned everything correctly to anatomy, i think i got the head in the correct position, but the fore arms may be a little too long, now should i Dynamesh everything together or merge, im not too sure and probably wont just yet until i know that its okay, and soon i might start the ear which im dreading. please i emphasise on constructive criticism, and what will need to be altered and changed since i am trying a realistic human.

Brian "Panda" Choi

Stephen.

This is gonna hurt, but you REALLY need to create you sculpt in planar forms before you even think of smoothing things out.

Replicate what BagelHero has. Seriously, just replicate it. We'll smooth things out later ONCE your have planes.

Long story short, if your foundation of your human anatomy is mushy and undefined, further detailing is just going to make it worse. Like a solid armature, a solid foundation will only make your life easier as detailing continues. We want smooth sailing, not frustration when you're 6 hours in.

Let's make sure you have your big forms in first, especially on your face and body, before we even touch upon "in reality, the cheeks are rounded." They are, but they follow a very specific form if broken down into basic shapes.

Put your palms facng down. I don't have a specific technical reason for it, but I have a feeling people's A-poses are at most neutral when your palms are facing down. Actually, try twisting your arms that way counter clockwise. You don't get much space after that.

Relaxes and at neutral pose as mucha s possible.


Side profile view, look at the silhouette of your sculpt compared to a real human woman. You're missing a couple of S and C curves. like pushing the abs forward more and having that insert and pinch as the leg C curve comes up into the pelvis. Butt needs to stick out more.

We want gestural flow happening, and right now it's a bit stiff. If it helps, exxaggerate a bit what you see in terms of the gesture.

Once again, compare SILHOUETTES and adjust accordingly.

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/photo/full-body-profile-female-anatomy-high-res-stock-photography/91240108

Stephenssart

By planar forms do you mean for me to go and reduce it to a lower poly count so i can work on silhouetting and form? and i understand about the palms now that i think about it, it is more relaxed that way

BagelHero

Palms facing forward is a diagram and anatomical reference thing, but you want to sculpt in the relaxed palms-down pose, as JadeEyePanda said. It's better for the rig and the animators to work with, beyond just being a set standard.
This thing is essentially a diagram of planar forms. That's why I linked it earlier.
https://warosu.org/data/ic/img/0016/33/1390037480497.jpg

You probably do want to go back to a lower polycount before matching it, but you should match it. Understand the forms in that, how the brow ridge sits over the folds of the eyelids, how the cheek pone protrudes, etc. Right now you're working from a wonky base that has missing pieces and appears bloated, and it won't do you any good to keep chipping away at it. It's better to just start anew sometimes.

On another note, your hand looks pretty good. be careful of carving lines into a surface instead of describing volumes and form. Still a bit wobbly. Seriously, keep to the lowest sub division you can while shaping the piece, or you'll end up with 100 tiny lumps you cant smooth out.

Stephenssart

Yeah i think instead of doing a high to low like i was before, im going to go in to Maya and do a low poly that has the entire body, im guessing if i do that, form and planes would be easier to distinguish, also would it be best to do it in one object or to have them in separate pieces?

BagelHero

You'll have the same structural problems.

If you feel modelling in maya suits you better, by all means do learn that. However; that will not necessarily fix the problems you're having. I find it easier to tell what the hell I'm doing when I can freely manipulate a mesh like I can in Zbrush, while polymodelling I feel like I'm running around blind when it comes down to things like the planes of the face. Still awesome to start with a base mesh, and model hard surface and stuff... but for reasons other than what you seem to want it to do for you.

I personally just start in Zbrush by immediately dynameshing a default sphere back down, so it's a low poly mesh. Usually like... 8-16 res. that, or starting with ZSpheres. I can still manipulate the points freely with the move tool, but I still have to think about what I'm doing, and the smooth tool stays relative to the size of the changes I'm making. So I make the best shape I can from that, and then dynamesh the resolution up a little or subdivide. I then start to define forms with heaps of reference, with only enough points to get a vague silhouette of all the features. So on so forth until I eventually have enough to start defining muscles and smaller forms, then move on from there to details.

Low poly mesh = Big structural changes and forms = smooth tool actually smoothing those details out.

Mid poly = smaller form definition, character and muscle definition, finalizing anatomy and forms = smoothing out medium-sized details.

High poly = surface details, veins, memory folds, wrinkles, scars, cleaning up etc = smooth brush no longer has effects on large forms, but has a small effect on medium forms and smooths out the details without destroying them.

Have you ever watched someone else sculpting in Zbrush?

Stephenssart

not extensively, i dont have the greatest knowledge of zbrush either. i was avoiding Dynamesh so i could have subdiv levels but i might take what i have then and just dynamesh it low like you mentioned and the other think ive found difficult is the eyelid and socket. i also do feel my issue is always going too high too quick

Stephenssart

i might put this project on a semi-permanent hold and go and watch people sculpting and do quick sculpt/studies of facial anatomy and general anatomy to learn instead of trying to do everything at once, and then maybe eventally come back

as you said i am missing a lot from my sculpt, so i feel going out and learning more would benefit me

BagelHero

You can keep subdiv open as an option after you dynamesh. If you dynamesh first thing, then dont use it again until the step right before you start doing midlevel details (just so you have enough even topology to work with), you can go from there using regular subdivisions like usual.

And do yourself a favour and watch people who are really amazing do their jobs. You might even pick up a few tips on how to combat issues you're having.
https://www.youtube.com/user/afisher3d/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUt-YPLeIJ_yMjRoCL5ysAg/videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOVIIpQlkcY
https://www.youtube.com/user/guhhh/videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-MC6Lu-5dA

Lots of different people, with different workflows, some with in-depth breakdowns or tips, others just make for pleasant viewing. That second link there has some good tips for eyes.

Edit: And that sounds like a plan. I think learning all the separate pieces and getting to grips with the program before tackling a project like this is a great idea.

Stephenssart

definitely, JadeEyePanda BagelHero thank you guys so much, and i was never upset about the criticism its what i want, so once again thank you guys a lot, ill go check out those videos and maybe come back to this another time after i learn different parts