How similar is too similar?
polycounter lvl 4
Let me just start by saying that everything about art and design is derivative. All art and design are in some way influenced by another artist or by objects in human history (which all have an original designer). In order for innovation and progress to happen people must be able to look at other artists creations without being called a thief. This is what inspiration is all about. You watch a movie or play a video game and all of a sudden an idea pops into your mind.
So why are alot of people so defensive about other people building on their designs when they did the same thing in the first place? Human nature?
Anyway, this just happened again: http://steamcommunity.com/games/CSGO/announcements/detail/1751086783896069815
This time its for CSGO and the art that was "stolen" can be seen here: http://canisalbus.deviantart.com/journal/Art-theft-in-Steam-Counter-Strike-459394075
The original is at the bottom of the page. Im not sure if im supposed to hate the creators for stealing art, or if i should feel sorry for them for being attacked by overzealous copyright laws.
The colors are completely different, there is only one wolf head instead of two, the background is different and the whiskers are gone.
Exactly how similar is too similar?
I did a simple google search for wolf head and found several designs that were similar to the original art, like this one for example:
Mirror it and slap a gritty texture in the background and its basically the same except for some black lines. So this person can make derivative works based on designs by other people but when someone does it to her, its theft?
If i make a spear for Huskar or a gun for Sniper, how am i supposed to know if some dude in japan hasnt already made it and will slap me with a copyright claim as soon as i post it in the workshop and getting me banned?
So why are alot of people so defensive about other people building on their designs when they did the same thing in the first place? Human nature?
Anyway, this just happened again: http://steamcommunity.com/games/CSGO/announcements/detail/1751086783896069815
This time its for CSGO and the art that was "stolen" can be seen here: http://canisalbus.deviantart.com/journal/Art-theft-in-Steam-Counter-Strike-459394075
The original is at the bottom of the page. Im not sure if im supposed to hate the creators for stealing art, or if i should feel sorry for them for being attacked by overzealous copyright laws.
The colors are completely different, there is only one wolf head instead of two, the background is different and the whiskers are gone.
Exactly how similar is too similar?
I did a simple google search for wolf head and found several designs that were similar to the original art, like this one for example:
Mirror it and slap a gritty texture in the background and its basically the same except for some black lines. So this person can make derivative works based on designs by other people but when someone does it to her, its theft?
If i make a spear for Huskar or a gun for Sniper, how am i supposed to know if some dude in japan hasnt already made it and will slap me with a copyright claim as soon as i post it in the workshop and getting me banned?
Replies
illustration of wolf is about 60% of overall work. i don't know what you want to discuss here
I want to know where the line is, if there even is one. I look at art and design alot and i play alot of games, this is where i get most of my inspiration.
If i make an item or a piece of promo art for a hero, and that happens to be too close to some other design, i get banned and thrown out, even if its complete coincidence?
Not too long ago i was accused of stealing art from league of legends. The guy said that my staff for skywrath was too similar to a LoL item called Seraph's Embrace. I had to explain that i dont play LoL and i dont know this item.
Here is mine:
And this is the LoL item:
Wolfs are identical if you were to overly them on top of each other.
Staffs are similar and its only this guy opinion that you rip them off.
But people in the art world claim copyright on similar designs and art all the time. And thats exactly what i think about, how similar is too similar.
If they would take 3 diferent pics of wolfs and make anoter thing out of that , that would be derivative; what they have done here is 100% incontestable .
Your item on the other hand , it has the theme of a winnged staff (wich again , is not owned by an artist ), but its nowhere near the lol one .
I used to get tons of comments from wow/heroes/lol players that told me that I stole designes , and it was someting like : "look this is a greatsword aswell ", " that character has wings allso ", etc
It's the fact that they literally lifted somebody else's art, their own stylized take on a wolf head and didn't even bother to let them know. A takedown was absolutely warranted.
Deriving new designs from other ideas is a very common practice in various creative industries, but the general rule of thumb that I learned is that you need to make at least 30% different to avoid legal trouble.
In regards to your Seraph's embrace, it's just an unfortunate coincidence of overlap. Happens sometimes.
The wolf head example in question literally took someone else's work, and made minor adjustments in order to pass it off as their own. I wouldn't worry about what other people are doing. Inevitably, there is going to be overlap, as people stumble on to similar solutions. That's just life. Unless you are consciously stealing someones work, you'll be alright.
I agree. But cant you still get in serious trouble for that coincidence? How are you supposed to know if something is coincidence or not? I dunno, i think about these things. I will shut up now.
If you can't tell the difference between the csgo ripoff (which is IDENTICAL lineart to the original) and the one you posted I don't know what to tell you.
The original has an open mouth and tons of fur detail. The one you posted is closed mouth and almost NO detail. Only similarity is that they are both side views of a wolf head.
Your staff and the tiny little icon are different in many ways even if 'similar'. Yours has white feathers that are spread apart, blue wraps around, a gem held by 3 posts, gold supports to hold the feathers.
Those are differences I see. Which is basically the entire piece other than a very basic concept of 'staff with feathers and gem'
You can't just cry wolf at very, very basic similarities. There has to be some substance at least. In the case of the CSGO wolf it is easy to tell it's a complete ripoff. Yours may or may not have been inspired by that icon, but if it was at least you made enough changes that it is not a copy.
Did i ever say i cant tell the difference? I was asking the question "how similar is too similar" and why the skin didnt fall under derivation. It has so far been answered by several people.
Nope.
Well, you did say that.... you thought that was similar enough to warrant a 'copy'.
And also, I did not read every single post in the thread...
Your Skywrath staff and LoL's Seraph's Embrace are both derived from common Caduceus winged staff designs, similar but clearly different elements. There is more effort in differentiation compared to the Howling Dawn example. Don't worry about people claiming all sorts of similarity to your designs to others', such are internet warriors. The DMCA takedowns have so far been about direct ripoffs, like the original Timebreaker just an Aion mace coloured green and now this CS:GO one.
If you don't like having your designs compared, then go for rarer ideas. Many ideas still unused.
Which in a very likely case is stolen from this piece of artwork: http://artcobain.deviantart.com/art/knight-concept-215330843
I've reported it for art theft, and even tried contacting the author of the original to get his side, if there is any. No luck
Valve declined the mole rider because it was too similar to justin beaver.
they look hardly similar
According to Valve, our Puck set also looks too similar to the default Puck items
Your sky staff, the courier and puck set i disagree from Valve, they are similar but not too similar to be necessary remove or don't be accepted to be ingame. BTW I loved this puck's wings.
The limit depend how far Valve want take responsibility from Workshop items, it's hard to say.
I think the problem is that you put too much effort into yours.
But those Puck sets I cant even pretend to imagine they are similar.
For the Puck set, that's the info we got on an email from Valve. The set was supposed to be bundled with a ticket, but it won't because apparently it's too similar to the default set. I'm 99% sure that's a bullshit excuse, but whatever, nothing I can do.
Speaking realistically, I can understand where they drew these conclusions, the overall shape leading to a point in the front featuring a rodent character with buck teeth and goggles. But I can't say I fully agree in saying that these similarities should deter the couriers acceptance given the massive support we received from the community. I personally feel there was enough differences between them, especially between the flying versions for it to qualify, but I'm not valve, so what can I say other than #yoloswag420noscopes
Pretty much repeating what Andrew said this courier was to be bundled with a League ticket however someone at Valve contacted the League saying they won't accept it because it was too similar to an existing courier. After a bit of pushing the League eventually got confirmation that it was deemed too similar to the Beaver. I won't lie my heart sunk a bit, pretty much our work was being compared to the most hated Dota 2 item!
Decided to send Valve an email to hopefully get confirmation and maybe a little bit of explanation as to why this decision was made however we heard nothing back.
I slightly understand where they were coming from, with it being a bucked tooth animal riding a contraption, but that's where I feel the similarities stop and while it's almost some "comfort" to not be left in limbo wondering if an item will be added or not it I still find it rather distressing that it won't be added for such reasons, particularly when it received a decent response from the community.