Rigging [Default Bones or CAT]

Melodeus

I've been working the with Character Animation Toolkit since last year and have found myself required to create additional bones(Default bones) so that I was able to implement things like Bone stretching and such. I'm not near as advanced as most, but just wanted to expose myself to the area a bit more.

My real question is which is more flexible? I know that CAT has a lot of things pre-configured, but what if I wanted to create something that was extremely dynamic and ready for scripting? I don't want to feel limited to what I can do. A lot of people just tell me that it's a preference, but I'd like to know the Pro's and Con's of each if you all don't mind me asking.

Mrfred

there's already been a few threads about that but overall:
custom bone are the more flexible, however you will need to do lots a scripting in order to get decent tools.
IKFk snap, posing tools, mirror options etc, animation layer ... It's not really hard to do but it takes time HOWEVER its the kind of thing that you mostly do once and adapt to later rig if your script isnt universal.

Cat isnt recommended in production as it is too unstable and buggy...

Mark Dygert

CAT is a neat idea that was pretty stable and useful before autodesk brought it in house, it's been a buggy pile ever since, their attempts to fix it normally end up breaking it more. Case in point the rig re-size tools, broken foot placement and more random crashes than I care to ever deal with.

It's more open to scripting than biped and it behaves more like regular max objects unlike biped, it is also more customize-able than biped but all of that gets washed away when it fails to work or corrupts files you're working in.

Regular bones are a pain to set up and maintain but like MrFred said normally you do that once and build off of it as you go, as long as everything else falls within what the rig can do or you don't find a better solution mid project.

If you have a pretty good understanding of the best practices you are typically flexible enough to handle changes and adapt without having to scrap everything and redo it from scratch.

If you're just learning what typically happens is you learn to do something one way and it only works that way and you end up rebuilding the rig from scratch to accommodate new mesh or animation requirements. But that's one way of learning how create more flexible rigs.

Melodeus

@MrFred Apologies for not searching. I don't mind the scripting and such. I just have had various issues with CAT and I just cannot simply stand it. I'm researching and attempting to find so resources to go towards for this.

@Mark Dygert Well that is definitely something that I didn't know. At the moment, I'm practicing more with understanding controllers, but I have no general clue of what else to do lately. I've been analyzing other people's rigs though. Is there anything you might be able to point me to?

acitone

Paul Neale has some great rigging tutorials, he teaches both FK and IK Bones rigging and a little bit of scripting for things like shoulder twists and such. Since you seem to already know rigging that intermediate course would suit you.

Mark Dygert

Agreed, Paul Neale is great, he puts on classes from time to time, in rigging and scripting. They're great, I've picked up quite a few tips and tricks from the ones I've joined. He's a very approachable guy too likes to help people who are willing to put in the time to learn.


Digital tutors has some decent tutorials too.
http://www.digitaltutors.com/learningpath/10-Rigging-in-3ds-Max


Some of the videos and tutorials in autodesks learning path are great too, the help files are packed full of good info.
http://area.autodesk.com/tutorials/ik_fk_setup
http://area.autodesk.com/tutorials/stretchy_ik_chain
http://area.autodesk.com/tutorials/animation_and_rigging_techniques_for_architecture_visualization
http://area.autodesk.com/tutorials/wiring_a_control_board_in_3d_studio_max
http://area.autodesk.com/tutorials/creating_assassins_creed_characters_in_3ds_max

Don't just follow "character rigging tutorials" check out just about anything you can get your hands on and build up a toolbox of useful things. You would be surprised how you end up plugging ideas together. A car rigging tutorial might give you ideas on how to better connect characters to the ground and so on it all is useful.

Melodeus

Thank you guys. I'll give them a sit down. Really appreciate it.