Pony Plop's Workshop.

ponyplop

My workshop submission:



Ok, first up is a WIP for a Daedalus crossbow for Sniper, these are the greyscale side/top views that I wanted to work on, which I set as image planes in maya to help me model.


My initial pass on a 3D model, notice the triangle count is way too high.
Dota 2 Daedalus v.01 (click to view in 3D)


and with paint chucked at it-


And magically, less tri's, but more features! oh joy!
daedalus LOD1 WIP (click to view in 3D)



and some ingame (rough WIP) gifs!


and an updated version with base colours and a little AO baking. I need to work out how to make the gem glow, and perhaps give the arms and horns a faint pale glow also. I'll also be making the shadows more pronounced.

ponyplop

reserved.

ponyplop

Currently downloading the test client so I can get the textures working day for the final LOD0 passes.


updated my model and UVs Now using mirroring to much greater effect, as well as retopologizing to the nth degree for a total under the 700 poly limit! I'm pretty happy with the progress so far!

[SKETCHFAB]4d7315e161e04efdbd57ba22c9badb27[/SKETCHFAB]

[SKETCHFAB]376c12b85f7c4a19a239721d69a06019[/SKETCHFAB]

ponyplop

and a GIF of it ingame with some nice AO bake, mask shaders etc, I think it's getting close to be reafy for submission!

ponyplop

thanks MdK, I'll get working on that

belkun

It really doesn't fit Sniper. He doesn't use arrows but bullets, and it makes no sense having him shooting bullets from a crossbow. There are lots of lines where he jokes about arrows and stuff like that, so I can't see why he would use that. The textures also need A LOT of work, not only that but the UVs don't look good. Also, there is an absolutely insane amount of wasted triangles that could be used to define better the shape and silhouette.

I'm not trying to sound harsh, but there is just too many flaws on that, both on the design itself and on the technical aspect of it.

kite212

belkun wrote: »

It really doesn't fit Sniper. He doesn't use arrows but bullets, and it makes no sense having him shooting bullets from a crossbow. There are lots of lines where he jokes about arrows and stuff like that, so I can't see why he would use that. The textures also need A LOT of work, not only that but the UVs don't look good. Also, there is an absolutely insane amount of wasted triangles that could be used to define better the shape and silhouette.

I'm not trying to sound harsh, but there is just too many flaws on that, both on the design itself and on the technical aspect of it.

Beat me to it, I agree on all these points. What you should really do is take the daedalus item, and work it into a sniper rifle, as opposed to just making the item

heboltz3

I'm going to second Kite and Belkun.

This model is in a extreme state of infancy all the way across the board. There are several technical problems you are having, and a handful of aesthetic choices that are really hindering the model. In addition to this it seems like the conceptual direction isn't driven by the Dota2 lore guidelines.

If this is your first submission, I would really recommend delving head first into Snipers aesthetic, reading the dota guides, and taking your time while posting millions and millions of WIP shots until you have a very tight first submission. Polycount is great at being extra eyes, but it's hard to help when "definitive milestones" are posted.

ponyplop

heboltz3 wrote: »

I'm going to second Kite and Belkun.

This model is in a extreme state of infancy all the way across the board. There are several technical problems you are having, and a handful of aesthetic choices that are really hindering the model. In addition to this it seems like the conceptual direction isn't driven by the Dota2 lore guidelines.

If this is your first submission, I would really recommend delving head first into Snipers aesthetic, reading the dota guides, and taking your time while posting millions and millions of WIP shots until you have a very tight first submission. Polycount is great at being extra eyes, but it's hard to help when "definitive milestones" are posted.

I did post a bunch of WIP shots, but nobody ever commented on them

I get what you mean about the progress so far though, needs a lot of tweaking, which is what this thread is here for right?

ponyplop

belkun wrote: »

It really doesn't fit Sniper. He doesn't use arrows but bullets, and it makes no sense having him shooting bullets from a crossbow. There are lots of lines where he jokes about arrows and stuff like that, so I can't see why he would use that. The textures also need A LOT of work, not only that but the UVs don't look good. Also, there is an absolutely insane amount of wasted triangles that could be used to define better the shape and silhouette.

I'm not trying to sound harsh, but there is just too many flaws on that, both on the design itself and on the technical aspect of it.

Thanks for the feedback! Any chance you could highlight where my topology is being wasteful? (here's the latest UV map if that helps)

I'd really aprpeciate it

kite212

ponyplop wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback! Any chance you could highlight where my topology is being wasteful? (here's the latest UV map if that helps)
I'd really aprpeciate it

It would be better to see some wireframe shots of the model to really determine where tris are being wasted

heboltz3

Here's a link to a post by JeremyKlein but the general look you want to go for is this.

Pack it as tight as you can. Any space wasted is wasted space, its just about how efficient you can make your UVs.

heboltz3

ponyplop wrote: »

Any chance you could highlight where my topology is being wasteful?

Super cool Double post, but with nondeformable meshes, you just pretty much want to keep edges and verts where there is a silhouette definition, or modeled in details. Since it isn't deforming, there is no reason to load your mesh with loops, so typically you can axe out a ton of edges and verts that you would usually need for deformation.

belkun

I did some quick paintover on some edges that are not helping to define the silhouette (in red) and some places where you could add more geometry (in green):





Also, what heboltz said is very true. You don't need to keep loops and stuff like that if you're not going to subdivide or deform it.

ponyplop

Wow, thanks a million kite, beboltz and belkun I'll get working on those right away! and here I was thinking I was being super-efficient with my maps XD

That paintover is really helpful too! I wish they showed us more stuff like this at uni, but i suppose its down to us to follow up what they teach us!

ponyplop

OK, I've made a quick remodel and adjusted the form to make it more elegant/slimlined, currently sitting at 640 tri's, its not a finished ingame version yet, but I think I'm making progress- as always, constructive crits are welcome!

belkun

This is soooo much better! There is still room for improvement, but this is miles away from that last model!

I did another quick paintover on some places where you can remove edges and where you can add them:



Try not to focus on small details, since they won't be seen ingame. Always think about the silhouette!

ponyplop

wow thanks again belkun! it's really great that you're taking time to help me out with this
Also, I checked out your workshop thread, there are some really lovely hats on there! and your colour schemes/maps are really great!

(also, totally didn't realise it was you who was making the NP items on the hangout, keep it up!)

I'll have a go at working through the item now

EDIT: Here's where I've got to today:

[SKETCHFAB]a460f9a9eef8438e901f4ee774a64e2a[/SKETCHFAB]

And finally managed to UV it all, and map it so that No space was Left untouched, hopefully this will translate into some lovely textures, but we'll have to see!


And some massively improved UV's thanks to some help and guidance from Clinton on the Hangout- cheers!

ponyplop

Alrighty, I think I should definitely take a break from my Daedalus crossbow-rifle to give the February competition a go and improve my skills- so I can get back to the Daedalus afterwards and do it the justice it deserves!

Anywho, this is how I start out:

Very initial addition of polys, using the flat view to line up verts with silhouette key points:


Then eventually I add more divisions to add to the general form, using the split selected edge ring tool-


I like having a custom shelf in Maya so I can access 95% of the tools I need all within view, as shown here- I believe you just ctrl+shift click them from their menus to add them :



And a quick update with the lowpoly mesh, I reckon I'll follow the advice with the creasing etc to get a nice output to mudbox



And here's my first try at Creasing:

ponyplop

And the base colors filled in on the Daedalus- From this screenshot it's evident that the stock/wooden parts will need some TLV, and pwehaps make the scope/metallic parts more embellished!


And a before/after of it with some lightening and repainting:



And a 3D model of the latest iteration- I think the color scheme needs some tweaking, particularly the metal, gem and wooden parts- elso maybe add some painterly touches/texture to the arms and claws of the bow.

[SKETCHFAB]f75177536f154c71bf1c5c3bd34289df[/SKETCHFAB]

ponyplop

and the most up to date iteration for the rifle, previewed ingame- I'd like to adjust the barrel and possibly the scope to make them stand out more, and maybe look at how I can get bloom effects working on the gem (if this is even possible)

ponyplop

Finally finished my Daedalus rifle to a point where I can put it on the workshop!

Next up, I'll be looking at making a set for Naix, the Lifestealer.

stimpack9

I'm just wandering around the internet then I find this topic. I'm making a set for sniper too, my first one is a crossbow but it's a bit different from yours, with the idea comes from the Daedalus in game and the one Van Helsing uses from the movie.
I'm about to post it in this forum to get advice from everyone since this is my first item for Dota2
Here is some images:

few days ago

I added some more detail on this one, rebalance the color, mask....

a badass version in marmoset few days ago. Will do another one for promotion picture when i'm done with the in game model.
I'm waiting for your C&C guys.

btw, does anyone know when will I be able to create my own thread???

ponyplop

Stimpack that crossbow is really nice, I too looked at Van Helsing for some reference images, but kept it more daedalus-y

The ingame screenshots indicate that perhaps the textures need a bit of TLC- mind sharing your UV maps?
I like the topology too- it seems pretty efficient! Keep it up buddy

heboltz3

You should probably make your own thread?

stimpack9

ponyplop: thanks mate. sure man. Here it is


heboltz3: will do soon man. My first post on a forum after years so.... I need sometime to get used to it haha. Sorry if it bothers you

ponyplop

there is quite a lot of empty space there buddy, which explains why the renders work out really nice when the map isn't compressed to 256 like the dota one is, refer to this post from heboltz- notice how packed in everything seems to be/ the areas that get the most camera time in game get more space on the map, and the less significant parts less space?:

heboltz3 wrote: »

Here's a link to a post by JeremyKlein but the general look you want to go for is this.

Pack it as tight as you can. Any space wasted is wasted space, its just about how efficient you can make your UVs.

heboltz3

@stim its just good threadiquette, not to mention you will get more exposure by making your own.

stimpack9

ponyplop: yes, i'm repacking my uv right now trying to get as much space for the main parts as possible. Guess I have to sacrifice some parts which can't be seen ingame. Jeremy's uv and texture are awesome. Still I want to keep my old Uv for the promotion picture since I dont want any distortion.

ponyplop

That's a good point, the promo pics are fine, just the in game that'll need adjusting- don't forget to use the mask1 and 2 modifiers to really tie it together

stimpack9

lol just realize that hahaha. tons of work to do if I do it that way lol