I don't print out any instruction count info at the moment.
But I believe I could do this.
At least in DX11 mode. Not sure if the info is available in OpenGL.
well that is just fucking stupid not to include it in the full version. Jesus christ Autodesk. We pay enough for this software you think including features in the cheapened version would be included in the full...
Im not sure why people expect that a tool that was released in a product (maya lt - august 28, 2013) after the release of maya proper (april 12, 2013) would magically make it into the build?
I don't wish to be pedantic here, but nothing has actually been confirmed regarding future features and releases.
Also, lets not forget that we released an Extension for Maya 2014 in September. The continued improvements to modelling from that also went into the first MayaLT Extension.
I am curious what advantages it gives over old 3dmax plugin? I have had that plugin for years but beyond some playground and better understanding of real time shaders I wasn't able to get any practical usage of it.
Tried to urge company management to use it in pipeline somehow but have not succeed. It worked pretty differently from what the game shaders/lighting produced.
In fact I came to prototyping shaders in Blender with its nodes realtime capabilities. Not as many nodes to chose from as in Shader FX plugin but much more close to the game lighting and specular rendering. Probably gamma corrected viewport or something or maybe just similar lighting setup. Also Blender have a nice tool to paint or bake node branches into the textures.
The improvements over the old 3dsMax plugin are quite a lot.
For example, you can visually debug each step in the shader, which is nice.
You also have a lot more control over what happens in the shader graph, if you are interested in a deep technical dive.
If you have the technical knowledge, you can write new shader graphs with completely different lighting algorithms that match your game engine more closely.
The main objective is to allow you to work with real-time materials inside the Maya viewport more like you would in a game engine like Unreal without needing to know as many of the manual shader writing bits and pieces.
For example, you can enable tessellation (in DX11) just by connecting a node into the tessellation factor socket.
Or use normal maps by connecting a Normal Map node, without needing to knwo the exact math Maya requires to do this correctly.
If you were to write this by hand, you have to write a page of code.
And that code has to be in a Maya specific format.
So you have to learn not only shader coding, but also Maya specific shader semantics.
That kind of thing we want to make easier for you.
Our goal isn't so much that you make your shaders in ShaderFX and then export them to another game engine. That is often difficult, like you pointed out, because game engines have their own preferences and requirements for shaders.
Another goal is to build up a library of materials.
For example, we ship with only a traditional surface shader, which is like an Uber Shader for game materials.
But we also want to add Physical based shaders.
Or even game/engine specific materials.
An example of that is the Valve DOTA2 material we made in ShaderFX.
So in short, our goal is to provide you a more modern way to work with real-time materials inside the Maya viewport. Not to replace what your graphics programmers do in your game engine.
In fact I came to prototyping shaders in Blender with its nodes realtime capabilities. Not as many nodes to chose from as in Shader FX plugin but much more close to the game lighting and specular rendering. Probably gamma corrected viewport or something or maybe just similar lighting setup. Also Blender have a nice tool to paint or bake node branches into the textures.
Not to detract too far from the topic of this thread, but if you feel the node system of blender is either not polished enough or incomplete, then please contribute to the development with your opinions or needs via developer.blender.org. It only grows when people contribute, often times the developers are not game artist like ourselves so they can only rely on feed back from their own personal perspective.
That said, I agree blender is turning into a very "nice" application for us game artist. By nice I mean that continues to surprise with developments that can actually compete with thousdand+ dollar software. Pretty cool in my opinion, it needs game artist to contribute though...any contribution helps.
Love the plugin and whats in Maya LT, problem is that it feels...at least from my perspective (could be wrong) that as usual 3DS Max gets the shaft. I would hope there wouldnt be a "drastic difference" between the two. It's kind of a shame really.
@Bellsey
So I have been following Frank's twitter page, following the development of Maya LT. While you say you cant confirm the development direction, do you have any solid info that a maya LT 2015 will be coming our way or is it still unknown?
@Bellsey
So I have been following Frank's twitter page, following the development of Maya LT. While you say you cant confirm the development direction, do you have any solid info that a maya LT 2015 will be coming our way or is it still unknown?
Sorry (and I know this sounds like a broken record), but we're unable to make and statements or confirm anything regarding any future releases or products.
People are happy the wave their finger and say this type of thing is a deliberate Autodesk cop-out, but it's not. Autodesk is a public company and there are certain business rules that we must adhere to.
Love the plugin and whats in Maya LT, problem is that it feels...at least from my perspective (could be wrong) that as usual 3DS Max gets the shaft.
Nah don't worry. 3dsMax is definitely not forgotten.
We just cannot yet share what is coming from 3dsMax 2015.
I am sure early 2014 Autodesk will start sharing.
Not to detract too far from the topic of this thread, but if you feel the node system of blender is either not polished enough or incomplete, then please contribute to the development with your opinions or needs via developer.blender.org. It only grows when people contribute, often times the developers are not game artist like ourselves so they can only rely on feed back from their own personal perspective.
Looks like Blender developers do not concerned about games a lot . I write about lack of vertex normal editing tools wherever I can for many years already. So any useful thing comes rather by a surprise.
I had no idea that it allows to do realtime shaders with its node network until recently . Sometimes it needs workarounds to do basic things. For example for glossiness variations it needs to mix two material nodes. And I still don't know how to get lighting vector there for a few ideas I want to test.
Replies
I don't print out any instruction count info at the moment.
But I believe I could do this.
At least in DX11 mode. Not sure if the info is available in OpenGL.
No. As of right now is only in Maya LT.
My pipe-dream would be some sort of shaderfx export to marmoset 2.
Also, lets not forget that we released an Extension for Maya 2014 in September. The continued improvements to modelling from that also went into the first MayaLT Extension.
Tried to urge company management to use it in pipeline somehow but have not succeed. It worked pretty differently from what the game shaders/lighting produced.
In fact I came to prototyping shaders in Blender with its nodes realtime capabilities. Not as many nodes to chose from as in Shader FX plugin but much more close to the game lighting and specular rendering. Probably gamma corrected viewport or something or maybe just similar lighting setup. Also Blender have a nice tool to paint or bake node branches into the textures.
Great question.
The improvements over the old 3dsMax plugin are quite a lot.
For example, you can visually debug each step in the shader, which is nice.
You also have a lot more control over what happens in the shader graph, if you are interested in a deep technical dive.
If you have the technical knowledge, you can write new shader graphs with completely different lighting algorithms that match your game engine more closely.
The main objective is to allow you to work with real-time materials inside the Maya viewport more like you would in a game engine like Unreal without needing to know as many of the manual shader writing bits and pieces.
For example, you can enable tessellation (in DX11) just by connecting a node into the tessellation factor socket.
Or use normal maps by connecting a Normal Map node, without needing to knwo the exact math Maya requires to do this correctly.
If you were to write this by hand, you have to write a page of code.
And that code has to be in a Maya specific format.
So you have to learn not only shader coding, but also Maya specific shader semantics.
That kind of thing we want to make easier for you.
Our goal isn't so much that you make your shaders in ShaderFX and then export them to another game engine. That is often difficult, like you pointed out, because game engines have their own preferences and requirements for shaders.
Another goal is to build up a library of materials.
For example, we ship with only a traditional surface shader, which is like an Uber Shader for game materials.
But we also want to add Physical based shaders.
Or even game/engine specific materials.
An example of that is the Valve DOTA2 material we made in ShaderFX.
So in short, our goal is to provide you a more modern way to work with real-time materials inside the Maya viewport. Not to replace what your graphics programmers do in your game engine.
Not to detract too far from the topic of this thread, but if you feel the node system of blender is either not polished enough or incomplete, then please contribute to the development with your opinions or needs via developer.blender.org. It only grows when people contribute, often times the developers are not game artist like ourselves so they can only rely on feed back from their own personal perspective.
That said, I agree blender is turning into a very "nice" application for us game artist. By nice I mean that continues to surprise with developments that can actually compete with thousdand+ dollar software. Pretty cool in my opinion, it needs game artist to contribute though...any contribution helps.
@shaderFX,
Love the plugin and whats in Maya LT, problem is that it feels...at least from my perspective (could be wrong) that as usual 3DS Max gets the shaft. I would hope there wouldnt be a "drastic difference" between the two. It's kind of a shame really.
@Bellsey
So I have been following Frank's twitter page, following the development of Maya LT. While you say you cant confirm the development direction, do you have any solid info that a maya LT 2015 will be coming our way or is it still unknown?
Sorry (and I know this sounds like a broken record), but we're unable to make and statements or confirm anything regarding any future releases or products.
People are happy the wave their finger and say this type of thing is a deliberate Autodesk cop-out, but it's not. Autodesk is a public company and there are certain business rules that we must adhere to.
Nah don't worry. 3dsMax is definitely not forgotten.
We just cannot yet share what is coming from 3dsMax 2015.
I am sure early 2014 Autodesk will start sharing.
Like Cars, I think he means the 2015 model will come out in 2014 (since the current is 2014).
I mean, early 2014 I am sure Autodesk will start to share information about 3dsMax 2015.
It is confusing! Some times I don't even remember what year it is any more
Looks like Blender developers do not concerned about games a lot . I write about lack of vertex normal editing tools wherever I can for many years already. So any useful thing comes rather by a surprise.
I had no idea that it allows to do realtime shaders with its node network until recently . Sometimes it needs workarounds to do basic things. For example for glossiness variations it needs to mix two material nodes. And I still don't know how to get lighting vector there for a few ideas I want to test.
or better a maya node graph for download..?
im looking for something like that...
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