Im not sure it's meant for anyone to give up their current program of choice, Pior. When I see this, I think of it as a great doodle app for 3d artists. Instead of bringing a sketch book somewhere like most illustrators would do, like say on a trip somewhere, or even just on the train to work, 3d artists could use this to "doodle" in their preferred medium.
Now, if this was paired with a node-based game engine for android, that would be amazing. Node-based in that it doesnt require programming. But if you had an engine on your tablet that said import model or create new, and when you select it, it would pop up spacedraw for you to create the model... I think it would bring a whole new level of game development. Rapid prototyping, on the go.
Of course yeah ... But still, the models that have been shown in this thread are much more than just doodles - they show accurate edge control, proper vertex snapping, and so on. Which is what make me curious : I'd love to hear more about how this has been achieved on a mere touch device in the first place. Was it a tedious and convoluted process (similar, to say, attempting to make a painting in MSPaint rather than in Photoshop) ? Or is something much more clever going on, with smart guides allowing for fast yet accurate touch input ?
And then of course, if Spacedraw also offers cleverly designed tools to doodle things straight in 3d as you mentioned (without much precision, but with a fast and robust interaction model) then I'd be curious to hear more about that too, because surely enough such clever UX paradigms could be ported to other (not touch-enabled) devices for everyone to benefit from. Is it similar to, say, Sketchup ? Is it indeed smooth and fast to use ? Would it be faster than just dynameshing something in Zbrush on a laptop ? And so on.
So yeah, I am not saying that Spacedraw is being marketed as a replacement for a full 3d app, since it obviously isn't. My point is that since most of us *do* use full 3d apps, and since only a fraction of us have access to an Android device, very few of us will be in a position to even try the program in the first place ... even though most of us might be curious to learn more about how it actually works.
Oooh, I see what you`re saying. Ya, it would be nice to see how it all works, for sure.
And when I say doodles, I just mean a pass-time. Doodle doesnt have to mean fast, or bad quality. If you spend your hour commute working on it each day, the same piece, im sure it would turn out nicely. And gives you more practice to improve your skills. It's all about the techniques you learn, rather than the tools you use, right? skills are transferable.
Used to Max and Maya I just couldn't think my way through the UI made out of texts, and get the logic of many tools. But I got used to it faster than I thought, modeling became surprisingly fast and the UI, if not nicely designed, is damn efficient for a Touch app.
The biggest challenge for a new user is to use this app without trying to compare it with other PC softs. Spacedraw is a serious piece of coding for such a recent operating system, with a .obj exporter that makes your meshes compatible with any other 3D soft.
Spacedraw miss tools if compared to the PC world with softs updated for more than 25 years but those existing are well thought and good enough to produce any kind of mesh.
"I'd personally love a little 3d texture painting on the note 3, but I don't expect that to happen though."
There actually is a 3D painting tool in Spacedraw. And as all the tools in the app, it's amazing the amount of work the coders put in there. Blendings, tons of default or personalized (png) brushes that also work on the eraser, color picker and so on. But I never managed to really use it as the pen weirdly draw where we want but also on other faces, even on properly unwrapped objects. I prefer to draw with 2D softs personnaly.
P.S : I can hardly access internet atm and the GPU of my Note3 seems to be faulty. I'll upload more tutos and finished scenes asap.
I won't be able to post for a while. My Note3 is dead :poly127:. Screenshots here of the Robot I did a while ago. But painted this time. Only head and shield are quiet advanced, the rest ... well whenever I'll be able to work again
And a new racing track scene that I just had time to begin...
Im thinking about getting a tablet.. Can I export it to .blend or .fbx?
not yet, but soon!
however, you can yet export to .obj, incl. UVs and materials; these .obj's are correctly read by Blender, 3ds Max and Maya (although splines, patches etc. are lost this way of course).
I really want to know how you manually unwrap.
I didn't find any file with the image you posted before
To unwrap manually (but really, use a PC unwrapping tool, I came up with this method because there is no PC around for me atm) :
- make a copy of the original model and try to explode it in rows of faces using the command detach (necessary when objects are curved to avoid deformations of the faces).
- Selecting the whole object, align one of its faces, here F1, to the world's axis. You want all the other faces aligned flat to this one.
- Select F2 and F3. Edit the Ref.CS and snap / orient it on the proper edge, here E1.
- Rotate F2 and F3 along the Ref.CS' s axis that is now aligned to the E1.
- Then select F3 and do the same but along E2.
- You can see the logic of different steps on the head and a screw in the image below. For the head, I first detach the faces in rows. Then align them flat to my (F1). Then I need to rotate faces again but along another axis and trying to respect the original mesh wireframe. I then weld back vertices and eventually move some. Careful moving vertices, it's the best way to have stretched pixels if you're not sure what you're doing.
Tip : 3D snap ("orient" turned ON) the Ref.CS to a face adjacent to the edge along which you'll rotate your selection. It often orients your Ref.CS properly and you just have then to snap it to the edge.
- when all your elements are unwrapped, organise them in the viewport and screenshot them.
- clean this screenshot in PSTouch. Export as png.
- import the png in Artflow and paint it, or just top layer a B&W checker for the moment.
- planar map this painted screenshot on the unwrapped elements in spacedraw.
- wrap back the now textured unwrapped version onto the original model by snapping the vertices back in place.
- Mistakes you'd have done while unwrapping can be fixed later using the UVs tools.
Most important : each face of the flattened model needs to have the same shape (as much as possible) as the corresponding face in the original model. Square objects won't be an issue, very simple to do. Rounded objects like the face in the screenshot below are trickier.
It takes some time but it sure works fine and definitely gives an idea of how professional unwrapping tools work. This method is pure "artisanal" unwrapping and can be done in any 3D soft with wire editing tools and planar mapping.
Nice to try a bit of editing at vertex level.
Between the two halves, one can see the seam that makes the red surface appear sharp.
If you want to get rid of that and smooth the final result :
- select your two halves. In the ribbon modifier, tap "make unique" : no more instance.
- in the ribbon modifier, tap "combine" : two objects become one.
- in Menu V, tap "Orthogr.projection" : no more perspective. Not really necessary in this case, but isometric view is more precise for some lasso selections. Especially for vertices like those of your halves : all aligned and flat along one axis.
- Go in FRONT view (slide to the left on the bottom right white thin line). If you have issues to center your object : menu V, tap "Default View", rotate manually the camera and zoom a bit to be nearly in front view. Then tap on the right-down menu "FRONT" again.
Tip : Tap anywhere with two fingers in the lower area of the screen to center the view on your current selection or on the whole scene if nothing is selected.
- activate in the left menu D : "X-Ray" : you can now see through everything and can select any vertex/face/edge, etcetera in the scene.
- activate in the left menu D : "backface culling". You see the color or texture of each face only on the normals side. This is just to be sure that the normals' orientation is fine, or the smoothing won't work properly.
- select all the vertices at the seam between your copies. Then tap in modifier ribbon "auto-weld". Choosing a proper value of auto-weld, you should see on the top right something like "weld : vertices 18-> 9" or 32->16, etc.
- Now go in modifier Ribbon : select all your faces and tap "Normals" "Smooth". Then, selecting other faces, you can define more smoothing groups.
I explained here all the steps because I don't have your scene and don't know how much you know. But in short it is :
Cool thread and thanks for the share! This sounds like a fun way to pass the time while on the train, now I just need to get a tablet
I'm wondering how the interface actually feels myself, is it all touch screen or can you plug in a usb mouse? I have no idea about how specific tablets work, except that when I borrow my sisters I end up pressing the wrong button 100s of times.
I'm wondering how the interface actually feels myself
Instead of pop-up / drop-down menus, Spacedraw's interface is composed of menus made of texts that open horizontally sub-text menus. It's hard to get used to it as sub-menus change the position of other buttons. So you have always everything you need quickly accessible but not always at the same position. Tricky at first, not intuitive enough, but efficient.
is it all touch screen or can you plug in a usb mouse?
Many interesting actions can be made with multiple fingers, a mouse to use Spacedraw would force Scalisoft to code a very different way to use the app.
I think multitouch apps have to be used as they are. The mouse is a desktop thing. But it's also true that one finger actions are numerous in Spacedraw, so maybe they'll come up with a mouse recognition, don't think it would be better though.
when I borrow my sisters I end up pressing the wrong button 100s of times.
On the s3 mini, it was tricky just to tap a menu in a webpage. But with a Note3 or a tablet, resolution is so high that all thumb taps are damn precise. NB : nearly everything in the interface can be resized, thickened, etc. to fit your fingers and screen resolution as much as possible. I see many "too tiny, can't tap, uninstalled" on the Play Store reviews of people who don't spend a second in the preferences of an app...
When I first had my Note 3 (CPU burnt after five months only ! shame...) I couldn't use Spacedraw, all my taps felt really unprecise. I contacted Scalisoft and as always they've been responsive and posted soon after on the store an update for high res screens.
Turntable of the Anti-Air Gun. Made with :
- 5° rotations screenshots from Spacedraw's viewport.
- Bulk Renamer to organize screenshots.
- Gif Creator to compile them.
Uploaded using Solid Explorer, THE solution to FTP uploads issues on Android. This file manager is better than any FTP client and by far the best file manager, as far as I'm concerned.
WOW - you're a real perfectionist! ...CAD quality, like the tank.
Your work always again amazes me - and makes me feel guilty for not having updated Spacedraw so long ... but soon now, I promise
Hehe thanks Spacedraw is perfect now for pure modeling. The only thing that limitates me is the absence of an unwrapper. But I'll have access to computers hopefully in march next year so this won't be an issue much longer. Then I'll work on character designs, more organic scenes.
N.B : Test 28 ShadowGun and Test30 this last canon, are on your FTP.
I just made this tutorial for someone who asked me a few questions about Spacedraw. If you struggle using a tool, even after checking the manual (Menu "F" on the left), just ask here and I'll make a tuto when I have some free time.
Replies
Now, if this was paired with a node-based game engine for android, that would be amazing. Node-based in that it doesnt require programming. But if you had an engine on your tablet that said import model or create new, and when you select it, it would pop up spacedraw for you to create the model... I think it would bring a whole new level of game development. Rapid prototyping, on the go.
And then of course, if Spacedraw also offers cleverly designed tools to doodle things straight in 3d as you mentioned (without much precision, but with a fast and robust interaction model) then I'd be curious to hear more about that too, because surely enough such clever UX paradigms could be ported to other (not touch-enabled) devices for everyone to benefit from. Is it similar to, say, Sketchup ? Is it indeed smooth and fast to use ? Would it be faster than just dynameshing something in Zbrush on a laptop ? And so on.
So yeah, I am not saying that Spacedraw is being marketed as a replacement for a full 3d app, since it obviously isn't. My point is that since most of us *do* use full 3d apps, and since only a fraction of us have access to an Android device, very few of us will be in a position to even try the program in the first place ... even though most of us might be curious to learn more about how it actually works.
Scalisoft, hansolocambo : tell us more !
And when I say doodles, I just mean a pass-time. Doodle doesnt have to mean fast, or bad quality. If you spend your hour commute working on it each day, the same piece, im sure it would turn out nicely. And gives you more practice to improve your skills. It's all about the techniques you learn, rather than the tools you use, right? skills are transferable.
I'd personally love a little 3d texture painting on the note 3
I don't expect that to happen though.
Used to Max and Maya I just couldn't think my way through the UI made out of texts, and get the logic of many tools. But I got used to it faster than I thought, modeling became surprisingly fast and the UI, if not nicely designed, is damn efficient for a Touch app.
The biggest challenge for a new user is to use this app without trying to compare it with other PC softs. Spacedraw is a serious piece of coding for such a recent operating system, with a .obj exporter that makes your meshes compatible with any other 3D soft.
Spacedraw miss tools if compared to the PC world with softs updated for more than 25 years but those existing are well thought and good enough to produce any kind of mesh.
There actually is a 3D painting tool in Spacedraw. And as all the tools in the app, it's amazing the amount of work the coders put in there. Blendings, tons of default or personalized (png) brushes that also work on the eraser, color picker and so on. But I never managed to really use it as the pen weirdly draw where we want but also on other faces, even on properly unwrapped objects. I prefer to draw with 2D softs personnaly.
P.S : I can hardly access internet atm and the GPU of my Note3 seems to be faulty. I'll upload more tutos and finished scenes asap.
And a new racing track scene that I just had time to begin...
I really want to know how you manually unwrap.
I didn't find any file with the image you posted before..
not yet, but soon!
however, you can yet export to .obj, incl. UVs and materials; these .obj's are correctly read by Blender, 3ds Max and Maya (although splines, patches etc. are lost this way of course).
((your image-link was not correct))
nice atmosphere!
To unwrap manually (but really, use a PC unwrapping tool, I came up with this method because there is no PC around for me atm) :
- make a copy of the original model and try to explode it in rows of faces using the command detach (necessary when objects are curved to avoid deformations of the faces).
- Selecting the whole object, align one of its faces, here F1, to the world's axis. You want all the other faces aligned flat to this one.
- Select F2 and F3. Edit the Ref.CS and snap / orient it on the proper edge, here E1.
- Rotate F2 and F3 along the Ref.CS' s axis that is now aligned to the E1.
- Then select F3 and do the same but along E2.
- You can see the logic of different steps on the head and a screw in the image below. For the head, I first detach the faces in rows. Then align them flat to my (F1). Then I need to rotate faces again but along another axis and trying to respect the original mesh wireframe. I then weld back vertices and eventually move some. Careful moving vertices, it's the best way to have stretched pixels if you're not sure what you're doing.
Tip : 3D snap ("orient" turned ON) the Ref.CS to a face adjacent to the edge along which you'll rotate your selection. It often orients your Ref.CS properly and you just have then to snap it to the edge.
- when all your elements are unwrapped, organise them in the viewport and screenshot them.
- clean this screenshot in PSTouch. Export as png.
- import the png in Artflow and paint it, or just top layer a B&W checker for the moment.
- planar map this painted screenshot on the unwrapped elements in spacedraw.
- wrap back the now textured unwrapped version onto the original model by snapping the vertices back in place.
- Mistakes you'd have done while unwrapping can be fixed later using the UVs tools.
Most important : each face of the flattened model needs to have the same shape (as much as possible) as the corresponding face in the original model. Square objects won't be an issue, very simple to do. Rounded objects like the face in the screenshot below are trickier.
It takes some time but it sure works fine and definitely gives an idea of how professional unwrapping tools work. This method is pure "artisanal" unwrapping and can be done in any 3D soft with wire editing tools and planar mapping.
[img]http://mcassar.free.fr/spacedraw/LowJpg/Spacedraw Unwrap.jpg[/img]
Nice to try a bit of editing at vertex level.
Between the two halves, one can see the seam that makes the red surface appear sharp.
If you want to get rid of that and smooth the final result :
- select your two halves. In the ribbon modifier, tap "make unique" : no more instance.
- in the ribbon modifier, tap "combine" : two objects become one.
- in Menu V, tap "Orthogr.projection" : no more perspective. Not really necessary in this case, but isometric view is more precise for some lasso selections. Especially for vertices like those of your halves : all aligned and flat along one axis.
- Go in FRONT view (slide to the left on the bottom right white thin line). If you have issues to center your object : menu V, tap "Default View", rotate manually the camera and zoom a bit to be nearly in front view. Then tap on the right-down menu "FRONT" again.
Tip : Tap anywhere with two fingers in the lower area of the screen to center the view on your current selection or on the whole scene if nothing is selected.
- activate in the left menu D : "X-Ray" : you can now see through everything and can select any vertex/face/edge, etcetera in the scene.
- activate in the left menu D : "backface culling". You see the color or texture of each face only on the normals side. This is just to be sure that the normals' orientation is fine, or the smoothing won't work properly.
- select all the vertices at the seam between your copies. Then tap in modifier ribbon "auto-weld". Choosing a proper value of auto-weld, you should see on the top right something like "weld : vertices 18-> 9" or 32->16, etc.
- Now go in modifier Ribbon : select all your faces and tap "Normals" "Smooth". Then, selecting other faces, you can define more smoothing groups.
I explained here all the steps because I don't have your scene and don't know how much you know. But in short it is :
1) Select your instances. Make unique. Combine.
2) x-ray, backface culling, Front, (ortho projection).
3) Auto-weld border vertices.
4) Define normals smoothing.
Glad that you begin to get an idea of how it works. It's simple and quick when you're used to the menus.
Good luck with that
I made this using instance and mirror optins. I'll try auto weld.Thank you again
I'm wondering how the interface actually feels myself, is it all touch screen or can you plug in a usb mouse? I have no idea about how specific tablets work, except that when I borrow my sisters I end up pressing the wrong button 100s of times.
Many interesting actions can be made with multiple fingers, a mouse to use Spacedraw would force Scalisoft to code a very different way to use the app.
I think multitouch apps have to be used as they are. The mouse is a desktop thing. But it's also true that one finger actions are numerous in Spacedraw, so maybe they'll come up with a mouse recognition, don't think it would be better though.
On the s3 mini, it was tricky just to tap a menu in a webpage. But with a Note3 or a tablet, resolution is so high that all thumb taps are damn precise.
NB : nearly everything in the interface can be resized, thickened, etc. to fit your fingers and screen resolution as much as possible. I see many "too tiny, can't tap, uninstalled" on the Play Store reviews of people who don't spend a second in the preferences of an app...
When I first had my Note 3 (CPU burnt after five months only ! shame...) I couldn't use Spacedraw, all my taps felt really unprecise. I contacted Scalisoft and as always they've been responsive and posted soon after on the store an update for high res screens.
- 5° rotations screenshots from Spacedraw's viewport.
- Bulk Renamer to organize screenshots.
- Gif Creator to compile them.
Uploaded using Solid Explorer, THE solution to FTP uploads issues on Android. This file manager is better than any FTP client and by far the best file manager, as far as I'm concerned.
Your work always again amazes me - and makes me feel guilty for not having updated Spacedraw so long ... but soon now, I promise
N.B : Test 28 ShadowGun and Test30 this last canon, are on your FTP.
Scene31 WIP
Not perfect, but i think it's ok.
Polygons=7869
Not completed yet Lol