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Is this good enough a Concept Sheet for Game Production Pipeline?

tonberry
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tonberry polycounter lvl 5
If you are part of a game production studio, and these come to you from the Concept department, what do you think could be tweaked, added, improved, or removed? Can you work with them? What would you still need? Would prefer to have gotten? I'm asking everyone in a game studio, so I'd really love to hear back from the folks who build the actual 3D pieces, level designer, AD, lighting folks... everyone, from your unique perspective, please! Because I'm creating more concept sheets right now, and I'm hoping for feedbacks on what I have done, so I can improve these new ideas. Thank you so much! 

As for my goal, it's to branch out from doing only creatures, and be more of a T shape conceptor, which was the main feedback I got from conferences.

These sheet layouts are done based on the looks from BBC nature documentaries, and from Ryse, Son of Rome sheets I saw on conceptworld website. The ideas are not related to each other since they were done at different time. Sorry about all those name place holders in the forest one, I didn't settle on names there yet... .  :#

Environment example: 


Creature example: 


The rest of my stuff: https://www.artstation.com/artist/yensliao

Replies

  • lotet
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    lotet hero character
    Id say its OK. there is definitely a lot of work put into it. but this is kind of suffering from the "how I think concept art should look like" syndrome. 

    as a modeler, I really wouldn't care about the skeleton, or the references you used. your artwork should tell me everything I need. Its basically just random distracting info masquerading as useful.  the type of stuff you have here is more likely something a teacher would be impressed by rather then an art director. 

    Its great that your thinking though, keep it up!
    I like that you showed a size reference for the creature, thats something I would like to see for the environment as well, as well as breakdowns of the plants separately.

    I usually recommend looking at the concept art from warhammer online.
    This piece is probably my favorite example of useful information. first of the rendering isnt overwhelming, making it easy to read all the shapes.
    there are some good reminders about shape language, so a goblin isnt mixed up with an Orc. and then there are break offs for the feet so you can see the shoe under the skirt. there are turn-arounds for extra complex shapes like the shoulder pads and there is also a full back view of the character as well. 

    of course, thats just me, maybe others disagree with me here, but I see a lot of people doing breakdowns like these and I feel its well intended, but miss informed and in the end just waste a lot of pixel space and time.

  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    "....suffering from the "how I think concept art should look like" syndrome..." <-- Yes exactly! Getting perspective from different teams in the pipeline is the only way out of that spot I think. Thank you for your feedback! 
  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] insane polycounter
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  • JordanN
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    JordanN interpolator
    Glad I'm not going crazy when I believe concept art needs multiple angles to work with.
     
    I think lore/background information is fine, but as a modeling reference, I wouldn't want to ever work with just one picture unless it's a very predictable design (i.e soccer ball, or ceramic tiles).
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    "... even better if those materials are expressed in the concept..."
    Do you mean if the materials are painting photorealistically right on top of the concept, instead of having an excerpt of it in boxes on the side? 
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    JordanN said:
    "Glad I'm not going crazy when I believe concept art needs multiple angles to work with..."
    So definitely multiple angles for everything... thanks! Is it common to see a page like these, followed by more pages showing individual elements standalone and with multiple views?
  • Greg Westphal
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    Greg Westphal polycounter lvl 9
    Honestly, depends on what its used for.  Most of my in-house stuff is just quick sketches explaining something or photo collaged stuff really fast that gets taken away from me as soon as the 3d guys I work with understand.  If you're doing it for a concept portfolio I'd say the presentation is actually too high for the quality of work.  Keep in mind that when they are hiring you its not for how well you lay out a sheet or paint, its for whats in your brain so showing multiple variations with really interesting ideas will always sell you more as a designer than 1 "just ok" design cleaned up and graphically laid out super nice.
  • lotet
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    lotet hero character
    tonberry said:
    JordanN said:
    "Glad I'm not going crazy when I believe concept art needs multiple angles to work with..."
    So definitely multiple angles for everything... thanks! Is it common to see a page like these, followed by more pages showing individual elements standalone and with multiple views?
    personally Id like the main page to have mostly what you need to work on, so you can glance at your other monitor without having to flip though different images just to get the block out done. on the other hand, the stuff you have on your image could definitely be second page material.
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    Thanks Greg and Iotet for your feedbacks! So as far as I understand, I need to give the 3D folks front, side, top, etc., views preferably on page 1 so they can easily have all the info they need for modelling on page 1. Forgive me for having a rock for brains here, but what would that mean for an environment concept work? I don't think multiple views of a tree (or giant mushroom in my current project) are useful, are they? Perhaps separate out the mushroom cap for a top and bottom view? What would the rest of the studio want out of the concept team? I'm guessing level designer would want different sizes and color to populate their scene with? What else though?

    I'm making concept designs for a giant fungi forest zone, and so far I have thumbnails of a scene inside that forest, and sketches of the 'tree' units that make up the entire forest.



  • lotet
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    lotet hero character
    Looks cool! 

    well the basic rule is pretty much readability first, Its not like everything needs side, top, bottom, front view etc. something like a dragon might need a closed and open mouth view with details on how the tongue fire breathing mechanism and everything inside there works.

    unfortunately there are no hard rules for what needs what. Its something you need to develop a feeling for. 

    as for the environment, you might not need side and front view for a tree, but you might need a closeup and/or top view of leaves.
    for things like the mushrooms, I would recommend maybe top and bottom view of the cap, and a view of the stock without the cap.
  • Greg Westphal
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    Greg Westphal polycounter lvl 9
    The way I think about environments is a bit different depending on game vs movie.  With a movie you have to think about the graphical read and your areas of interest.  The shot might only be there for 5 seconds so what is it that you need to sell as an idea to the audience.  Also, camera angle and shot should be something the DP could use as a baseline.  For games, its a bit different.  I'm looking at how the character will interact with the room.  What are the points of interest and how does he approach them? Can you do LOS tricks, how much can be modular, how would the walking animation work with the small objects on the grounds?   Designing environments for games, for me, has been production and not preproduction so the big graphical compositions with just a few elements would never let me keep work.  

    With both really put yourself in that space and learn everything you can about what you're designing.  If you're doing some crazy forest like you've been showing watch documentaries on growth of mushrooms and the borean/rainforest.  Right now I'm working on a sci-fi personal project so I've been watching the old nasa files.  Do some quick studies just to mentally catalogue proportions and visual language and then when you need to draw on those ideas for an environmental piece they will just come up.
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5

    Here are some new work done based on the feedback I got here. … and I just realized I forgot to to bottom views of the mushroom caps!!! [facepalm] I have 1 more page of ground items and intractable, but as for what to draw to show the entire forest I’m still not sure. I think I also need to do a few ground tiles?


     

  • lotet
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    lotet hero character
    your presentation has definitely improved. keep it up!
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    Thanks lotet! 
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    Two more sheets. I think the next step will be to make better thumbnails of the actual scene, and design the ground. 

  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    This is what the forest zone could look like. Didn't quite fit every single asset piece in one setting. Just went with what looks good. 

  • EVF
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    EVF polycounter lvl 3
    that forest shot is really nice, and all the callout sheets look nice and detailed, good job I'd say!
  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    EVF said:
    that forest shot is really nice, and all the callout sheets look nice and detailed, good job I'd say!
    Thanks for your encouragement, EVF. :)

    Moving on to figuring out colors! Showing what the forest look like, and the mood. They might not look like much, but they were pretty difficult for me to get out, even with help from my environment artist girlfriend! It's been a while since I did a full scene. Next is to have it painted more clearly. 



  • tonberry
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    tonberry polycounter lvl 5
    Got too busy to post, and then I had to rush off to THU. Here are what I wrapped up this project with. Any feedback is appreciated! Any 3D artist peers, lighters, level designers, everybody, have any thoughts on these? 


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