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Snake Plissken - Game Character


  • low odor
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    low odor polycounter lvl 17
    Welcome to Polycount David

    Fisrt things first...your model needs some work . I cant tackle the whole thing, but I am sure you will get a full critique..So you came to the right place.

    I'll take the easy one and say your anatomy is way off. It looks like you used zero refrences. The most striking anatomical anamolies are the arms and the head. They look malformed and sloppy. But Malformed and sloppy become defined and beautiful with a little work. Reference is a must, and there is a whole wealth of it here on the internet.

    Also...pasting your character into HL2 screenshots is kinda silly....why not actually put him in the game?
  • Delaney King
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    Delaney King polycounter lvl 18
    Man, I thought he weas dead.
  • struve
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    struve polycounter lvl 18
    That elbow is way off man, haha, you should study some wire frames, some anatomy and first try to make a good base anatomical model.
  • Mark Dygert
    Welcome to polycount =)

    I'm about to rip your model apart in the hopes that you can put it back together and have it be better. Or at least you can walk away having learned something you can take to work on your next model. This is going to take up a good chunk of my free time this morning. Recognize the fact that I don't do this for everyone (I don't have the time) and this is designed to help you as an artist not hurt you personally.

    There is a lot to cover and I'm not sure I can get to it all. Let me be clear this model will not land you a job. Some of the other work in your portfolio might sway someone to grant you an internship but I don't see this as game ready art and I doubt any Art Director will either. I don't say this to be mean but to make sure you are ready for the hard work that is to come. You graduated, that's good but it doesn't stop there you have much much work ahead of you.

    Cool site design BTW =)

    Use it. I applaud the attempt to use your own drawing of Snake as reference and a base for the model. BUT There is soo much actual photo reference of Snake you should have used first. Its like making a photocopy of a photocopy of a photocopy of a rubbing someone made. Cut out the middle men and go right to the source and use the best images possible. Sometimes your own drawing will be the best, but with high profile actors you can always find images to use. Them's camera whores those Hollywood types.
    - compare your model to photos of Snake. Maybe even take both into photoshop and overlay one onto the other and see where they are off.

    - Kurt Russell is a man with a strong jaw and a stronger chin its a trademark of Hollywood heroes. Your model has a mouth where his chin should be. The mouth is also too wide and is straight across. Mouths can contort into many shapes but the least pose you will see a tough guy mouth in is straight across.
    - The face has many anatomical errors and I'm pretty sure that is because the reference you used wasn't Kurt Russell but your own drawing which has none of the detail that would help you nail Kurt Russell’s distinct look.
    - Simply put his face is too big for his head. I would strongly urge you to take some time and check out some books on anatomy but make sure they are geared toward the artist. I'm away from my recommended reading list but one I have here at work is "human anatomy made amazing easy" by Christopher Hart. I wouldn't say he gets it 100% right but some of his rules are interesting and he makes something complex as the face easier to understand. He gets you thinking about it in simple terms that translate well to 3D and 2D.
    - You drew or traced the concept with his head tilted down in a classic tough guy stare down pose, which put his mouth much lower than it should have been. Then it looks like you modeled it flat off of that pose as if he was looking straight ahead, bad idea. You should have modeled the head based on photos of Kurt Russell.
    - The concept has some of the hair volume snake has, but that didn't translate into the 3D at all. Snake has wavy curls of hair and it is meant to look like the shape of a King Cobra. Get it? His name is snake… They make sublet snake references with the character? These are things you need to be doing. You sucked that hint of character right out of him by making it a plane jane, flat, mullet.
    - Your final model stands about 1-2 heads taller than your concept. The thighs and torso are longer than the concept and since I'm not sure how accurate the concept is to the actual reference it could be miles away from the actual Snake Plissken.
    - The hands are flat and lack even the character of the concept. Hands are more than extruded cylinders they give character, attitude emotion, to your model. What your characters hands are saying to me right now is: I'm in pain I was just run over by a truck and can't move them. I suspect this is because while you have hands you don't pay much attention to them, or they where run over by a truck. If that is the case you need to find other hand reference. The concept hands have a touch of character and are roughly depicting the right shape, you need to mimic this more accurately on the model.
    - Torso and thighs are too long according to the concept model comparison.
    - The crotch is too tiny, snake is a man's man. Big many men have big packages. Right now his crotch is shaped more like a womans...
    - Start looking at proportions, how many heads tall is he, does size of his feet match the length of his forearm? Do some research on "the golden ratio" or "Da Vinci's divine proportions" it will blow your mind how mathematical the "organic" human body is. Example the human head is roughly 5 eyes across. Learn to tweak and bend these rules to achieve archetypal characters.

    The texture:
    Shows promise, but needs much work. For a while I couldn't figure out if you tried to make the jeans that where wet in places or if it was some kind of a pattern? Only after seeing the concept did I realize it should be the cammo pattern. This needs to be addressed. The pattern needs to more closely resemble the concept in shapes and colors. But before you get started on that check your concept against actual photos, make sure the colors and patterns are correct, because they aren't.
    - The unwrap job wastes a lot of space and you could put the entire character on 1 sheet. There is a lot of mirroring going on but you didn't mirror the pieces. I suspect this is because of the normal maps? If you have unique texture space make the textures unique. The cammo pattern on the legs stands out by far the most. This pattern needs to be different for each leg. It's just lazy texture work if you don't.

    I hope that helps, I'm sure there is more but I don't want to overwhelm you all in one post. Heh, I bet I already have, sorry if I did, its a habit I can't break.
  • John Warner
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    John Warner polycounter lvl 18
    hey man. good to hear from you. welcome aboard.

    it looks as if you're a very confident artist. that's really cool. the comments here are pretty bang on. in general, the model is pretty un-appealing anatomically, when it comes to the expression of form, color wise, etc. I'm just guessing, but it might be helpful for you to understand that just because you know what it is that you're looking at, doesn't mean you've made a clear representation of what you're trying to express. we all do this art stuff and look for evidence that we've done a good job.. we identify what must be there in order for an area to look correct, and that criteria gets updated as you go (gotta learn somehow, right?)

    -It's absolutely necessary that you learn the ability to set aside your own personal attachment to the art you're making and step back, to describe the model from a more detached, literal perspective. both viewing modes are important.

    in order for a character to have a lot of depth in it's vibe, it needs to make sense, on my levels. how the character feels is a direct reflection on how well you can understand it. again, this is where the above point comes in. disassociate a tad. is this anatomically accurate? does it need to be? what am i expressing? is his anatomy/form appealing? (haha there's infinite depth in that one), what kind of clothing is he wearing? what are those shin-guards for? would he wear that type of thing? what feel to they have? does it match with the overall feel i'm trying to describe? what does this guy do? is the level of wear-and-tear/dirt/grime on his clothing reflective of his character? every single detail needs to tell a story. each little detail has understanding in it because it has a story behind it. it is in fact the sum total of those understandings and how they work together that make a quality piece of art (at least at my level of understanding)

    anyway i hope that helps. i mention it because i get the feeling that you're very confident, that is, you have the ability to understand what it is that you're doing. obviously my perceptions could be inaccurate..

    ever have those friends who smoke weed, do a drawing, and then think it's the best thing in the world, when really, it's.. heh.. not? same process going on there.

    (oh, and don't forget to re-associate deeply, or it'll be no goddamn fun. I've certainly fucked that up before crazy.gif )
  • David Torelli
    Hi guys
    First of all I would like to say thanks to all your comments. You guys take some time to really give me help and I'm glad for that.
    I agree with all that you said specially Vig and John, that's what I call a real class eheh
    This was the first time that I ever try to make a full body model, in my project I study the development process of a game character from the concept to animation and in the end I didn't have time and knowledge sufficient to test it on a a engine, that's why I just paste it on Half-Life backgrounds, but this is no excuse I'm just telling you how was the process.
    I'm new in 3D and I really think that I can achieve something in that field specially in games (that I like the most), and I'm aware that I have a LOT work to improve my skills enough to get a job. Once again I'm glad that I can count with your help to do that, I definitely posted in the right place.

    Thanx and hope to keep in touch
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