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[WIP] First Asset Critique

ChrisLambert
polycounter lvl 5
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ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
Hello all, 

I've been trying to learn as much as I can from tutorials, but I thought the best/fastest way to learn would be to try and get some advice and feedback from you good people.
Anything you have to help would be greatly appreciated.

The goal is a low poly mesh for a game asset in UE4 (not animated). It was made in Blender.
Next steps would be taking this to ZBrush and creating a normal map.




Thank you!

Replies

  • Brian "Panda" Choi
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    Brian "Panda" Choi high dynamic range
    Looks likea decent start.  You might find  the biggest issues come baking time, but we'll let that happen as it comes.

    I'd move on to sculpting
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Thank you, I'll keep an eye out for that baking issue!
  • Ashervisalis
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    Ashervisalis grand marshal polycounter
    Do you understand hard and soft edges? I see a bunch of edges which should be soft. What program are you using?
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Could you explain a little more please? I'm using Blender.

    Next I'm going to create a normal map from sculpting in ZBrush. Would that fix the hard edges that should be soft?
  • Doxturtle
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    Doxturtle polycounter lvl 8
    I think Ashervisalis is referring to hard and soft edges like smoothing groups (as they are called in max) or soften/harden edge in maya. 

    This video seems to cover it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTJ-pryZFQk

    It basically just controls whether an edge will produce a hard seam or whether it will smoothly shade. This is important when it comes to baking and having your edges not smoothed properly on your low poly can cause baking artefacts. In general I just use the rule that where ever you have a UV split you have a hard edge, there are probably blender scripts which automate this process.  
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Haha that's the video I just watched to find out! Thank you for clarifying, which edges stand out most as incorrect, if you don't mind me asking? (Only the first picture has smooth shading enabled).

    I'll make sure to go back and edit it to better those edges!
  • Doxturtle
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    Doxturtle polycounter lvl 8
    I usually just do my hard edges based on the UV's so I would say that you don't really need to worry about it until that point. If this is your base mesh for sculpting you don't need to worry about smooth edges yet, just whether or not it subdivides properly for sculpting. 

    The easiest way I find is to make your base mesh, sculpt it, build your low poly from your reduced base mesh (or start from scratch and build over your HP), UV and then do smoothing groups before exporting for bake. 

    Sometimes its nice to have your smoothing roughly set up whilst doing your low poly to get any idea of how stuff is looking but it doesn't matter too much at that point
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    That's great, thank you!

    I played around a bit, is this a little better? Like you said, I could move on from here and look at this again once I'm further along in the process, but it's always nice to have a rough idea haha


  • Doxturtle
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    Doxturtle polycounter lvl 8
    Should be fine for now. With those big chips and stuff I find its usually easier to start your mesh in a kind of 'clean' state and then add in the bigger deformations and stuff in the sculpt, it gives you more control and you will probably get nicer results. After that you can then build your mesh to fit your high poly. 

    Arrimus did a similar series with a wooden box, it gives a good overview of the process up to the baking stage. I'd really recommend it :)

    Its in 6 parts:

    Youtube doesn't seem to want to autoplay it in the right order so you might have to click through the suggested links. 

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfHYIPPmtms

  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Ahh that's a good tip! I really enjoyed that tutorial, makes me wish I had 3ds Max haha. 
    Thanks again!
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Here's my sculpt attempt.

    Any thoughts and critiques would be very welcome!


  • Alex_J
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    Alex_J grand marshal polycounter
    One thing I've learned recently as a somewhat further along beginner is that it can be a time sink to spend too long on the sculpt. Reason is because, lacking experience making complete game models, you won't have a good idea of what to do with the sculpt and what to do with the textures, and how they can complement and/or detract from each other. 

    So, as a beginner, if you spend like two weeks making this masterpiece sculpt, inevitably you'll find that, going through the filters of baking and then by simply applying different colros and surface qualities, much of what you painstakingly crafted will be lost, or muted, or changed in some way... So I just say this to caution against spending very long on the sculpt -- trying to make it perfect -- before moving into texturing. Once you've completed a dozen models or so, then you'll know how to get the most out of each phase of the process, but in the beginning it's better to just keep moving to get a sense of the overall process.
  • Ashervisalis
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    Ashervisalis grand marshal polycounter
    @Doxturtle I'm a little confused. You choose your hard edges based on UV's? Shouldn't you do your UV's based on your hard edges? I always make my edges soft or hard as I work on the model. If it's a round surface, it'll be a soft edge. Then when UV mapping, I make sure to dice up all my hard edges.

    @ChrisLambert The sculpt looks good man. Keep it up.
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    @BIGTIMEMASTER
    Thanks for the advice, it's definitely something that has been in the back of my mind! I've spent most of the past 2 weeks researching workflows, baking, Painter... and also just studying lots of other peoples assets haha. A lot of that sculpt is using brushes I found. But I also wanted to spend the time just learning the software the best I could and playing around with different things. 

    If I remember correctly, Painter allows you to re-import altered meshes whilst keeping textures, you just need to re-bake (I really hope that's right) that way if I find areas I really messed up, I should be able to go back a fix it without toooo much headache - finger's crossed!

    @Ashervisalis
    Thank you!
  • Alex_J
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    Alex_J grand marshal polycounter
    Exactly. Once you start learning how you can work in a non-linear way, then you can really start getting creative. I suffered a lot and see other beginners suffer a lot because they've learned how to use like, 1% of the apps they are using and are focused on making a masterpiece.

    Painter is pretty smart about reprojecting from 3d space, but it does have limits. Like, if you completely change the UV's, sometimes it will have trouble if you have complicated layers and masking. But anyway, you'll see. 

    Oh, and I forgot to mention in the previous post, nice sculpt!
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    @BIGTIMEMASTER
    Yeah, trying to get my head around everything is very confusing at times, hoping correcting all the mistakes won't be too complex haha and thanks!
  • Doxturtle
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    Doxturtle polycounter lvl 8
    @Ashervisalis I ignore smoothing groups mostly while I am building the low poly. To be clear I mean, I cut the UVs where needed on hard edges and angle changes, I then use a script which makes hard edges (smoothing groups in max) based on where I've cut the UV's :)
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Here's the low poly with baked maps in Painter:



    Any more thoughts or advice would be very helpful :)
  • Alex_J
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    Alex_J grand marshal polycounter
    Nice job. 

    I may be misreading some things, but notice the harsh shading on the metal bracket on the lower right side? That may be due to having a smoothing angle that is too great. I think you are using max, sorry I don't know the jargon for that program, but basically if you decrease the angle threshold that recieves smoothing, that harsh black spot should look better.
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    Ahh I see, I'll have a look around the mesh again and see what's up. I've got some pretty harsh angles on the high poly, and the light is hitting that side quite strongly... I shall investigate!

    I use Blender, and I have actually set that as a hard edge where it connects to the wood body, maybe I shouldn't do that?
  • Alex_J
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    Alex_J grand marshal polycounter
    Not sure how smoothing works in blender either. In maya you can set a threshold at which angles will recieve smoothing. So you may say, angles up to 85 degrees get smoothed, but anything over doesn't. This will keep your 90 degree angles from getting that bad shading.
  • ChrisLambert
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    ChrisLambert polycounter lvl 5
    I think I got it, I'll go back in and fiddle around with the shading angles and see if I can fix that edge - and any others that might be hiding. Thanks!
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