What is (or was) your biggest problem or obstacle in becoming CG artist?

vojislavmilanovic · May 2016

Hello,

I'm on a fact finding mission on how to become a CG/3D/VFX artist. I'm wondering what is the biggest challenge people are facing to become one?

If you are in the industry and could spare some time to give me some insights in

1) What was your biggest challenge in becoming one and

2) What did you do to overcome it?

Can you please be detailed and specific as possible (go beyond just saying "staying motivated")

e. g. I didn't know how to draw, I didn't know how and where to begin, what school to start and simmilar.

Thank you very much in advance!

Eric Chadwick · May 2016

I think the biggest challenge in general is people are rarely persistent enough to make it. Many many people give up at various points along the way, because it's difficult and time-consuming to improve your craft. The persistent ones eventually end up making a living at it.

We have lots of threads about this. Great post by EarthQuake:
http://polycount.com/discussion/comment/2441245/#Comment_2441245

Also I've collected lots of insight here.
http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/Game_Industry

vojislavmilanovic · May 2016

Thanks for the links. I'm looking through them right now.

lefix · May 2016

It's all about the discipline for me.

slipsius · May 2016

So, for me, I wanted to be an animator since Warcraft 3 came out. I loved the cinematics and thought holy crap, someone gets paid to make this. For me, my biggest challenge was overcoming my thoughts that I had to do something more acceptable to my family or society. I entered college in an electrical engineering program, trying to become an electrician. Within the first week, I switched to graphic design. After a bit of fumbling around, and some soul searching, I did some research, found a game design program close to my house and said F it. Im gonna try and apply, even though I was MONTHS past the deadline. Literally a month before class was suppose to start. I got a call from the college the next day saying they had 1 spot left and if i was serious. I said yes, and that was that. It's also worth noting that my parents never pressured me to do anything. They supported me with everything I've ever chosen to do. But I wanted to make them proud, and 3d art didn't seem like something that would do that. I was so wrong. They`re proud with what I've done and where I've ended up. They see my passion, and they see how happy my job makes me.

For me, I became a 3d artist that first day of class. I wasn't a professional yet, but I took that leap and started on that path. All these posts about staying motivated, and not giving up... To me, that's how you become a SUCCESSFUL 3d artist. Not how you become a 3d artist. The moment I started training to become a professional animator, in my mind, I was an animator. Motivation, and discipline, are just byproducts of your desire to further your career. If you do clay sculpting as a hobby, would you not still call yourself a sculptor? You sculpt, therefore you are.

So I guess it comes down to, how did I overcome it all? Well, I had enough with being unhappy. I didn't like what I was in school for. I didn't like the jobs I was doing to put food on the table. I decided to go after happiness, not wealth or acceptance. Nothing you do will make every person happy, so I chose to do what makes ME happy.

When it comes down to it, the only thing that will make you a 3d artist is spending time doing 3d art. Full Stop. The more time you spend doing it, the better you`ll be.

Fansub · May 2016

I started doing 3D back in 2013 but only got serious with it in 2014.
My biggest challenges are quite odd.I've already done five art tests and 4 of them turned successful,but companies always rejected my applications because i have no diploma and live far away in Africa.
When i started doing 3d modeling i had the crappiest computer you could think of on this earth and no internet,so every time i had a problem i would wait for a few days to have some money,go to the cybercafé and take a ticket for an hour,or 30 minutes depending on how much my mother gave me.

Downloads of files over 25mb were forbidden,and the internet in Mauritania was as fast as what most of you got...in 2000.

Most people who saw that i spent a lot of my time on a computer always told me to be "realistic",that this job wasn't for "third-world people like us" and so on,but i never gave a shit,so long as my mother supported me,which she always did.I am now "lucky" enough to live in Cameroun,which is a lot better than Mauritania for people like me.There is no industry,but it's still better.

In 2014-2015 i managed to make a few freelance contracts,mostly about architecture or tv with softwares like After Effects.I had to stop doing them because we have dozens of light shortages a day here and you just can't fully respect deadlines and upload huge files to send with this issue.
Just to give you an idea about the internet here,it can take me up to a day to upload a video and a gif of Quick Pipe,sometimes even three days !

It is only recently that i finally earned my first "big" income with Quick Pipe,and hopefully i will be able to earn enough money with it to afford a game art school program in Africa next year.

IMHO as long as you have basic stuff like electricity,food,health and a computer there shouldn't really be an excuse to not become a cg artist.Some people in this world live in a hell that we can hardly imagine,and I'm grateful to not be in there.

PS : I also need to do more 3D stuff beside scripting

valuemeal · May 2016

Information, equipment backlash, and securing the position
Back when I was in school information wasn't as abundant as it is today and asking folks about was neigh impossible.
There were many faux sites offering information that wasn't valid or was outright harmful to one's progress.
Due to that I was always on the lookout and feared being given the wrong information; and may have said some hurtful things
to people who I thought were trying to mislead me.

Also knowing what sort of work was viable played a part as well , during school and when I graduated I geared most of portfolio towards kids shows because I lived near NYC. Needless to say the hyper real dudes gave me quite a bit of backlash. They said I wouldn't find anything with such a portfolio, and insisted it had to be their way. I wasn't sure if they were correct though, but I did get hired at VFX house doing all sorts of things; even while employed hyper-real fellows claimed I wouldn't find anything. ( Truth be told, they still hold this sentiment)

Simultaneously, while the real fellows were saying this, low poly people were telling me that I was too high poly or not efficient. While in school I saw people do poorly while trying to do the low-poly, so I avoided it altogether. People here told me to be more "WOW" like , I thought that they were trying to mislead me again, because this was before the update of 2013 and it looked out of sorts.

Inversely there are folks saying that I am too low poly and I need to get with the times.

You say why not just go with my gut?
For a long time I did, I even gained fruitful results, however they were short lived; thus I started taking more people's comments into consideration.

Despite this, if I take into consideration one's person's advice over another there will be an outrage and threads will expand with pages with outright vitriol and if I encounter them on this forum or anywhere else on the web they will continue to spout their beliefs in regard to what direction I should go in. Worst case scenario an angry mob will appear and act as yes men for the instigators.

Why do I care you say?
At first it really got to me, and made me question the direction I was going in.
I couldn't listen to them all.

A wide array of comments from folks claiming I am a revolutionary mind to people saying I am outright garbage and I should give up.
You cant' draw you should only stick to 3D if you want to work
You can't do 3D you should be a concept artist instead
You should do both,
You should only do scuplts
Scuplts won't help you, only finished pieces
You should only do hyper real
You should only do what's popular
You should make things that stand out instead of what is poplular
You should make props instead
You should only be a vfx guy
You should only make Blizzard things and apply to Blizzard ( despite the fact that everyone wants to go there, people have spent their entire careers trying to get there and I only played one of their titles once) even if I did (which I have) people will still say it looks similar
You should know how to do everything
You should just specialize
That country won't except you (people llook at my work with open arms and give me comissions at their parties, yet I've got gun nuts and woodlanders making rude comments in every thred I make here)
You should should be an animation fellow because everyone else animates
The list goes on for miles.

A wise fellow once said

"Don't be a thinking fellow, be a doing fellow"
But how could I be when there are so many directions, I still make things but I don't post them as much.

At one point there are six people trying to pull me in different directions each one contradicting the last.

I don' t give a rats tail what any detractor has to say now, it's more so irksome than anything.

After my job let out, and the VFX jobs weren't appearing despite going to various networking events , I thought I would try this "low poly" approach. Needless to say things weren't turning out at all, I never knew that work flow or how things of that nature were created so I made things that looked no good so to speak. It took awhile but I figured out the problem was, my lab top was absolute garbage; I invested in a PC shortly after and the quality of my work improved quite a bit.

Right now my biggest hurdle right now is getting through Office politics and recruiting process
So many times I have heard
"Guess we didn't get the project we hired you on for, SEE YA"
"We are not sure if we will have the position"
"Your work is good but we are only hiring seniors from this point on with 10 years of exp"
"You did well on the test, but we aren't hiring 3D people at this time"
"Your entry was sound technically, but we need someone with more empathy for younger viewers"
A company advertises a 3D position, but expect one to be a concept artist as well, I don't get the position because I only drew 8 characters without variants of them during a week long dual 2D/3D test, without being told that I had to make variants upon those variants.
"We will hire you in six months,for a month long trial": They say that they are full and don't have position available within a month of the supposed position being promised.
"You are more than qualified to work here and we feel as though you are an amazing artist
but you must improve your conversational foreign language skills because I am the only one who speaks English"

Despite all this people still think the reason is because I supposedly am unfocused and suck at everything or the fact that I don't make realistic things

Furthermore, there are people in certain positions,
who can get away with pulling lack luster jobs due to seniority or location,
and still hold steady careers without any turbulence. No one is on them for anything, but if I make one mistake someone will say I don't know anything about anything.

Steppenwolf · May 2016

The biggest hurdle was to find the time to learn. In my early days i actualy only had time because i was on the dole and i was abusing the system a bit by avoiding shitty job offers from the job center and rather worked on some mods.
Then later, when i already was in the games industry and made the jump from level designer to environment artist i got lucky with working for the right guy who let me spent a lot of time with learning yet still paid me.

Ged · May 2016

The years and perseverance it took before an opportunity to actually work in games came my way. First I moved country then I did a degree for 3 years, then worked in marketing and design for 3 years while also improving my portfolio and skills, before I actually got a foot in the door. I took a chance on a little 4 man startup where I was the only artist ( we now have a whole team of artists and about 30 staff! )

0xffff · May 2016

Being motivated and creative, on tap / on demand. It isn't so bad when you're learning because there isn't so much time pressure, though you still need to switch on/off when you can only put in an hour or two a day. But when you start working and you literally have to clock in / clock out 9-5 every day and do productive, creative, imaginative work day in day out for years ... that takes some adjustment. There is literally no room for "oh I just don't feel inspired today". It changes you.

Alemja · May 2016

Forgetting that it's a marathon, not a sprint. It gets frustrating when you aren't in the situation you want to be in, and doing it everyday is adding inches, not miles... it may not feel like progress but it does add up over time.

Kwramm · May 2016

Persistence and not giving up. Getting that first job was a big hurdle. Another hurdle was finding the type of work that I both enjoyed and was good at.

Justin Meisse · May 2016

Yup, the persistance thing, it's rough because you have to suck to get better. The ability to handle critique is also a tough hurdle to overcome, I remember being a teen and getting my first critique from a mod I joined "he looks like an old man in a sweat suit!" it was devastating. The gut reaction is to defend yourself and act like people are attacking you.

leilei · May 2016

Early on, it was about the limited choice of free software (being cool in the industry owning/ or napstering 3dsmax/maya weren't viable options on just ambitions for hobbyist game addons). I was bashing cylinders in Milkshape/Breeze together until something of substance arrived for free in which I started doing things by the face immediately. That something was Blender. But before Blender, I couldn't apply crits like cut edgeloop here, flip there., smooth edges here,..because Milkshape3d was shitty and is a vile limitation on gaining new knowledge. Blender may be love it or hate it for its interface and bugs, and goddammit it got me out of the hole i'd never thought to get out of.

and now my current obstacle? ARMS and HANDS! and the worst of all..... TIME!

ysalex · May 2016

For some people, the biggest obstacle they face is themselves. Especially in art, introspection and personal responsibility can go a long ways.
I wish I had thought more clearly and correctly about myself and my development when I started out. The better you know yourself and your weaknesses, and take responsibility for them and work to make them your strengths, the faster you'll get where you're going. Ignoring them, willfully or unconsciously, the longer it will take to get off the ground.

Ruz · May 2016

My biggest problem was where to store the huge amounts of money I made when i finally got a job.
I ended up lighting my cigars with it:/

Joopson · May 2016

My biggest obstacle was/is getting sidetracked with learning instead of doing. I think a balance is super important of the two.

Don't let theory get in the way of reality. The knowledge is largely useless if you don't then use it to make.

Blaizer · May 2016

My big obstacle was the hardware and the money. I needed to waste too much money to work decently... but well the time-frame was 1995-2007. Nowadays with just 600€ i can buy the PC i need.

Being old sucks.

Ruz · May 2016

Blaizer, you are not even old man:)

Amaury · May 2016

My problem is myself and my frequent motivation drops/call into question.

At first I was super excited about learning CG and drawing, as I come from no artistic background, usual geek low-grades highschooler playing counter strike all night. Discovering all the softwares and possibilities in first year of CG school was a blast as I did not really care yet about the industry's harsh competition, and drawing really made me realize how progress can be real and even quick if you put the efforts into it.

Well, my first sculpts were terrible but at least I was happy each time I finished one of them because it was significantly better than the previous ones, and I learned new tools/softwares each time. Then soon came Polycount and a massive source of knowledge and inspiration. A few """production ready""" characters later, while the quality improved I felt the progression drastically slowing down and internships still very hard to get.

But now making a speedsculpt bust isn't going to top my previous works and I need a shitload of physical/mental energy to force myself to keep producing full polished characters. Another problem : since I have Artstation/Polycount, school is now useless and is sucking all of that energy I could spend on such characters for student game projects that never serve me any purpose other than having good grades which don't represent anything either to me. So I'm currently focusing more on my personal art despite my teachers/classmates getting mad at me but I know stuff I'm doing in a positive mindset is the stuff that can get me potentially hired and nothing else. But the more progression I get, the more my mistakes become subtle to my eyes and I know I'm getting closer but I feel like my characters are always like "hm, that's kinda good, but there's this thing that looks meh, and this..." and not "that's great !" and it's getting more and more difficult to cross that line.

I guess I'm currently in stage 5-6 from EarthQuake's post about learning art. I need to stop being a thinking fellow and a "spam polycount with threads about characters that never get finished" fellow.

Melazee · Jun 2016

My biggest challenge to this day is anything technical. I'm a character artist in a studio, and whilst I love the concepting and modelling side of things, I also had to learn about rigging/skinning, exporting things correctly, setting things up in certain ways for animation to use, editing code, yadda yadda. Anything even remotely technical takes me a very long time to understand.

When I first began 3D, I started as an animator. I could work in 2D fine, it was pretty straightforward. Draw, next frame, draw. However when I moved to 3D, it was a much more technical way of animating which involved tweaking splines, and my brain just could not translate between the spline curve and what it was doing to the animation.

When I decided the right path for me was character art, I had to learn 3D modelling, and simple things such as UV unwrapping took an extremely long time to understand fully. I still struggle with understanding more technical concepts.

How did/ do I deal with this?

I found I am a visual learner (I think there are three types of learner?). I can't learn by someone just telling me stuff, I have to have them show me. I also have to write everything down so I can refer back to, maybe even with little visual doodles or screen grabs to jog my memory. I learn so much quicker from videos too, so I watch video tutorials as much as I can. It's important to find out what sort of learner you are to overcome this (I think there is auditory, visual and something else?). Also, when I had to learn rigging and skinning for work, I spent a lot of my free time at home practicing it too so it would sink in easier.

I also can't learn from books whatsoever, or written tutorials (unless it has a LOT of visual aid). I can read the same line 100 times, and it will not sink in, if its a new concept I am trying to learn. The process has to be shown to me visually.

I would like like to learn MEL/ Python to make tools in Maya, but that has proved a great challenge for me this far!

TLDR: I'm stupid!

EDIT: Here is a bit about the different types of learners, it's very interesting: http://lyceumbooks.com/pdf/howtoteacheffectively_typesoflearners.pdf

fdfxd2 · Jun 2016

I don't overcome problems...
Problems overcome me!

But srsly though,

My biggest problem is well...
I know for a fact that I can model,
I mean, believe me when I say I can model hard surface objects because, well... I got nothing to proof my claims! So you just have to believe me.
There's no project that I have worked on that I can just point at and say "Yes, yes this is what I'm capable of, bow down to my magnificence!"

As a result, getting freelance jobs is harder than it has to be(Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong places)
And the jobs I do get often involve people who really don't know what a 3D Model is,
Which is a shame because I really want to get in the game industry...

LaurentiuN · Jun 2016

fdfxd2 said:

I don't overcome problems...
Problems overcome me!

But srsly though,

My biggest problem is well...
I know for a fact that I can model,
I mean, believe me when I say I can model hard surface objects because, well... I got nothing to proof my claims! So you just have to believe me.
There's no project that I have worked on that I can just point at and say "Yes, yes this is what I'm capable of, bow down to my magnificence!"

As a result, getting freelance jobs is harder than it has to be(Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong places)
And the jobs I do get often involve people who really don't know what a 3D Model is,
Which is a shame because I really want to get in the game industry...

Same like you, i know i can model awesome stuff but i don`t know why i can`t finish them ...i start something and i can`t finish them....at work i finish everything, but for my personal projects i get stuck.

Burpee · Jun 2016

Having only 24 hours in a day is probably my biggest probleme atm

maatin · Jun 2016

For me it has always been lack of time.
I had my first kid about the same time I started my journey to become a 3d artist, this made it a bit harder to find the time to practice. But with a supportive GF and discipline I think it worked out anyway. Actually I think it kinda made me use the time I had more efficiently.

I still struggle to make time to practice on top of everything else that needs to be done with house/family. But I´m not alone with this problem I guess

Talix · Jun 2016

For me my biggest problem was my work ethic and discipline. Im still constantly working on it but its a much more minor problem compared to before - working crappy jobs and a few extra years of maturity has certainly helped.

I was always an avid gamer and i did really enjoy 3d work when i began my degree but i would find myself opening a game client instead of maya/photoshop more and more (so easy to do when your working at home).

I scraped through my degree as a result and was really down and lost with no 3d prospects afterwards. Fast forward a few years later of having to do regular day jobs, some serious self reflection and now i am sure this is what i want to do and am alot more disciplined for it. Currently doing my personal 3d work on a daily basis outside of my day job and getting closer to where i want to be.

Stuart Campbell · Jun 2016

Sorry to hijack this thread with a question, but to those that are struggling to finish work...

At which point do you hit a wall?

Is it during the modelling stage, when you reach UV work?, problems with texturing or materials?, etc?
Is it a presentation thing, not knowing how best to showcase the work?
Is it is simply a case of not being confident or happy enough with it to progress to the next stage and then it just sort of rots until you stop working on it?

Would love to hear your thoughts on this as its something you hear a lot of.

lefix · Jun 2016

It wasn't easy. I think the only reason I made it was that I was extremely lazy when it came to doing anything else/didn't know what else to do with my life. So I sat at home through periods of unemployment instead of getting a real job. And I got a bit lucky, I think.

fdfxd2 · Jun 2016

Stuart Campbell said:

Sorry to hijack this thread with a question, but to those that are struggling to finish work...

At which point do you hit a wall?

Is it during the modelling stage, when you reach UV work?, problems with texturing or materials?, etc?
Is it a presentation thing, not knowing how best to showcase the work?
Is it is simply a case of not being confident or happy enough with it to progress to the next stage and then it just sort of rots until you stop working on it?

Would love to hear your thoughts on this as its something you hear a lot of.

Modelling stage,
Sometimes you just can't see how something is going to work or even look remotely good.
Honestly I should just lrn2blockin before starting a project.

It's never in the texturing stage.

In fact the texturing/materials stage is what motivates me to keep on going.

Stuart Campbell · Jun 2016

fdfxd2 said:
Modelling stage,
Sometimes you just can't see how something is going to work or even look remotely good.
Honestly I should just lrn2blockin before starting a project.

It's never in the texturing stage.

In fact the texturing/materials stage is what motivates me to keep on going.

You said previously that you know you can model, but now it sounds like this is where you are struggling? Can you clarify? You want to get into the games industry, which aspect interests you most?

fdfxd2 · Jun 2016

Oh yeah I do know how to model,

I know what a good and bad topology looks like,
I know how to smooth an object perfectly,
know how to add detail in cylinders
etc

but motivation,
some parts where you feel like you need to do a bit more research on what you are doing..
yeah thats where I fail.

But materials,
yeah materials are just awesome,
just pick whatever looks good.

What is (or was) your biggest problem or obstacle in becoming CG artist?

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