Questions oh questions...
polycounter lvl 8
I've been trying to avoid asking questions on this forums, figuring that I can probably just search for the answers I need. Also helps me look less foolish. But sometimes you don't get the answer you seek for or you're just incompetent at finding those answers. Either way, I'm a naive guy with a lot of questions who recently graduated from a 3D course, but I'll just bring forth the most pressing questions.
As someone who is fairly still incompetent at making art assets, I want to keep working at it because I know nobody is going to hire someone they have to teach. Unfortunately I have doubting concerns that even if I did make quality art, my lack of work experience will hold me back, never mind the constant +2 years of experience requirement in the industry. I literally have no work experience. I know its a silly question, but would working as a freelance qualify as work experience? Or should I just suck it up and work at something like McDonalds?
I want to work as an environment artist having switched over from the animation side of things thinking of how easy it would be (how wrong I was), but I really adore the idea of making beautiful and cool characters. What's the likelihood of getting in as an environment artist and then slowly transitioning into character modelling as say a side project, 2-3 years down the road? Its funny, I'm literally a headless chicken with no directions on what I want to really do. My primary concern is landing myself a job first.
Lately I've been exploring other 3D software to expand my competency outside of Maya. I've only been working in Maya for one year, I feel fairly comfortable working in it (have been for a while). Is it better if I just kept sticking to it, despite feeling fairly well versed in it? I'm fairly sure I don't know much in the grand scheme of things however. I did feel like I was one of the quickest software learners in my class, but hey what do I know?
I guess the last question is it a terribly good idea to even try to get a job when my wrists are already suffering from pain? Yes I mean carpel tunnel. I visited two doctors and they say there's nothing wrong, but I know very well I have it. I'm pretty sure someone is screaming at their monitor saying I'm an idiot, especially when I paid my tuitions to learn 3D when I had this injury. I can't imagine myself doing anything outside the arts on the computer. Making art is one of my only hobbies since I was a kid. I don't want to drop my dreams, but being partially disabled doesn't help in this hyper competitive industry.
Thanks in advance.
As someone who is fairly still incompetent at making art assets, I want to keep working at it because I know nobody is going to hire someone they have to teach. Unfortunately I have doubting concerns that even if I did make quality art, my lack of work experience will hold me back, never mind the constant +2 years of experience requirement in the industry. I literally have no work experience. I know its a silly question, but would working as a freelance qualify as work experience? Or should I just suck it up and work at something like McDonalds?
I want to work as an environment artist having switched over from the animation side of things thinking of how easy it would be (how wrong I was), but I really adore the idea of making beautiful and cool characters. What's the likelihood of getting in as an environment artist and then slowly transitioning into character modelling as say a side project, 2-3 years down the road? Its funny, I'm literally a headless chicken with no directions on what I want to really do. My primary concern is landing myself a job first.
Lately I've been exploring other 3D software to expand my competency outside of Maya. I've only been working in Maya for one year, I feel fairly comfortable working in it (have been for a while). Is it better if I just kept sticking to it, despite feeling fairly well versed in it? I'm fairly sure I don't know much in the grand scheme of things however. I did feel like I was one of the quickest software learners in my class, but hey what do I know?
I guess the last question is it a terribly good idea to even try to get a job when my wrists are already suffering from pain? Yes I mean carpel tunnel. I visited two doctors and they say there's nothing wrong, but I know very well I have it. I'm pretty sure someone is screaming at their monitor saying I'm an idiot, especially when I paid my tuitions to learn 3D when I had this injury. I can't imagine myself doing anything outside the arts on the computer. Making art is one of my only hobbies since I was a kid. I don't want to drop my dreams, but being partially disabled doesn't help in this hyper competitive industry.
Thanks in advance.
Replies
Game art is pretty egalitarian. If your portfolio rocks, and you're not a complete failure at communication, then you can get work.
Freelance doesn't really count as work experience, unless you're onsite. What they're really looking for with this is an understanding of the game dev process, from pre-production to shipping, and what it's like working in a team environment. And if you're going for a Senior or Lead role, it's that plus management skills and some other stuff.
Env vs characters... focus on one role and get good at it. If your heart isn't in environments, it will show in the interview (and in your portfolio). If you want a Character Artist job, get any old job just to pay the bills, and work on your art after hours. It will take a couple years to get good enough to be hire-able. If you want it, stick with it!
Maya is fine.
Fix your wrist NOW. Learn about ergonomics before it's too late. Adjust your seat, desk, monitors, keyboard, mouse, etc. to avoid stressing out your body. Eat healthy, decent sleep, regular exercise. Take care of the core.
So basically my advice is to enjoy it, don't force it. Let it come naturally, and it will be a lot more pleasant. Do it because you want to, not because you need to get X job in X amount of time. I'm doing a really crappy job to keep myself going at the moment, but I don't worry about it because I'm doing 3D in my spare time and hopefully I will eventually get good enough to get a 3D career.
You sound really divided and unsure of what you really want to do. I'd play around with all of it a whole bunch, and I'm sure you will find what your forte is. You don't want to end up doing X and really wishing you had done Y. That being said there is no reason you can't do X at work and learn Y at home.
I know for myself I get on and off about doing 3D work. Sometimes I feel like I'm on a roll and will keep working without skipping a beat. Other times I don't feel like doing anything. At home I'm not particularly disciplined at working compare to doing it at school or outside of the comfort of my house. So trying to fill in a quota every day, at least trying to fulfill that quota will probably help me slowly to becoming a better artist. You could argue that, if an artist loses or doesn't have any passion that he probably shouldn't be in the industry to begin with. I do have some concerns about me being motivated enough to keep doing this for the rest of my life, despite the fact that I cannot imagine me doing anything else with my life outside of computer graphics.
And you have a point. Despite my apparent desperation to get a job, I probably should think carefully on what I exactly want to do. I only decided to do environment modelling because I know I'm not up to par with character modelling, especially when I put my focus on animation. I don't mind environment/prop modelling. But it feels kinda boring compare to making cool characters. Maybe I'll try to juggle between the two, I'm not a terribly great animator despite an additional love for storytelling.
Sigh decisions, decisions.
If you really want to do characters, work at it. Even if you don't think you are making much progress, sometimes it takes a while for things to really click into place. Characters are really different from general hard surface modelling, so it's expected that you would be below par if you haven't been doing them as long. With characters, from what I hear generally it's extremely useful to be able to draw and to have a good understanding of anatomy. So I'd look into learning those if you haven't already. Personally I'd give it my all until I met my personal "dead end" scenario. This is, for me, the theoretical situation that I find myself having not improved in a large span of time. This is my reality check. I'll keep working to get into the industry until I either have a job or I reach my limit.
Anyway. I'm no expert fyi. Just another budding 3D artist like yourself, sharing my personal thoughts and views
Oh and by the way, asking questions is not a bad thing. Asking questions is how people learn. It seems to me that the general view on polycount is people are very willing to help, assuming it's not something that could be found on google, and that you've put in a decent amount of time trying to solve it yourself.
I've been working in games as an artist for 20+ years, and I still love it. It's been an awesome career.
But also I struggle with motivation at home on my side projects, so I'm with you there Meteora. I find I have boundless motivation when I'm in a team situation. But it's very different when it's just me, I have to really push to stick with things. You're not alone there.
Keep at it, and post your work for critique. Having other eyes on your work can be very helpful.
Appreciate the thoughts ghaztehschmexeh.
Glad I'm not alone with my issues on motivation. Its funny because I want to become really good but I can't be arsed to do anything on my own. But when I'm working in team projects I can get really involved. Must be some weird psychology. Thanks for the encouragement and I'll post my work for critique very shortly.
As for the feeling more motivated in a team, why not join a game mod team or something?
Studios look for a level of performance not necessarily titles under your belt. If you portfolio looks like someone who has 2 years of experience then you will get noticed even if you haven't worked a day in your life on a title. There maybe some questions about your speed or workflow but if the work is solid they will notice you.
You really should pick one and stick to it.
You really need to be a rockstar to land a character gig, the positions are few per team so competition is fierce. A lot of beginners are intimidated by the scope and tech knowledge involved in environment art so they shy away. It is also viewed as a lower priority by many people to characters and beginers tend to want the fame and glory, be the alpha male on the team, have everyone pick them up on their shoulders and take them out to lunch while chanting their name... lol.
Character art also has a lot of responsibility for the look and feel of the game and are used to drive the marketing which is another reason why they won't hire just anyone.
You're best bet is to go through the credits of games, find the character artists and check out their stuff and then do better than them because those are the people you will be competing with. You could possibly scratch out an existence doing characters for social mobile games but often those end up being 2D positions.
Animation is a little easier to get into but you still need to be a rockstar, often that means taking some online classes and putting together an amazing reel. With the next generation of games fully in production and the line between film and games blurred heavily they will be looking for top notch talent. Also keep in mind that there are a lot of VFX guys looking for a stable paycheck.
Environment artist and prop artist positions are more plentiful and often the bar for entry is a little lower, this also means you're more likely to be let go when the project ends.
As for wrist pain, there are some options. I get it from time to time here are some things I do to fend it off and get them back in working order.
1) Exercise and do other motions besides gripping a mouse. You don't need to work out your wrists or put pressure on them, you don't want to weaken or thin out the squishy padding between the joints. But just about any kind of exercise will help.
2) Don't use braces or wraps for me they make my wrists weaker and end up hurting more. Time away from the mouse and other activity should get them back in order.
3) Switch to using a wacom pen instead of a mouse. This is huge for me and really really helps. I'm left handed which is normally my keyboard shortcut hand so its a little weird, but I have ways of dealing with it.
4) if you're a wrist drawer/mouser try using your arm more, don't rest your hand or forearm on the surface, the only thing that should touch is the tip of the pen or the bottom of the mouse. For me this was really hard and I ended up with neck pain at first but exercise helped with that and now its much easier to do and has saved my wrists.
I have definitely gone through periods of low motivation (and always will, I'm sure). Just remember that its something you build up. At first, you may struggle to make a basic face in 3 hours. Keep at it, and eventually you'll be making something better in 30 minutes. Don't try to force yourself to do something because that's what you "should" do. You will find resistance, yes, and it is good to break through that to get into "the zone", but choose the kind of work you do based primarily on how much you enjoy it. Then, when you realise you're lacking in some area, you can pursue it even if it isn't all that fun, for the sake of adding tools to your arsenal for more creative freedom.
And regarding working a job like McDonalds, this is actually something I'd highly recommend if you've never done it before. Working in a soul-draining environment with a bunch of burnouts is SUPER motivational (was for me, at least) to get working and get the hell out of there. As a bonus, you'll have cash for training, software and hardware.
Just don't do a job that makes you hate your life too much :poly142:
@Eric: Makes sense. I guess I really enjoy doing characters the most and I get most focused on it, other than always continually having derpy looking faces/anatomy. That breaks my momentum.
@Mark: Thanks for the advice. I'm definitely not going to do animation, its something I fantasize about doing, but the actual workflow isn't suited for me (though its terrific saving my wrists). They also say animators usually need to be good actors, I'm a terrible actor so that's a big no from me.
I may just have to do characters on the side or something. I'm not really good at it. I don't know, I'll see in maybe a month or two. I would have considered your last bullet point (4) but I'm left-handed. I only use my right hand for my mouse and chopsticks. But you bring an interesting point... just that my lazy and have my hand on the tablet anyways.
@arcitecht: Yeah I may have to find a job, ideally part-time. I'll keep working on characters if possible and see where to go from there. Thanks.
So yes animators do need to think and observe like actors but if they aren't comfortable getting up and acting then it doesn't really matter as long as they can deliver the performance needed.