New to polycount/Need help with poles!

ChrisHuddersfieldUni · Oct 2011

Hey everyone

I am new to polycount and I am currently in my second year at
University I am supposed to be modelling a character for animation but I am having issues with the amount of poles I have, I am requesting advice on how to get rid of them/if getting rid of them is necessary.
Also the head didn't actually take me that long to model so would like to know if remodelling the head would be quicker than fixing the problems.
Thanks in advance for any help.

[Edit] - I also would like to state that the character is not meant to be close to human realistic, more like pixar style.

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Psyk0 · Oct 2011

Even if you say this is Pixar style head, you should have strong anatomy knowledge behind it, the Pixar heads may have highly stylized forms and proportions, but are still rooted in human anatomy. Edgeloops exist to mimic a structure in 3d, in this case the human head, so what kind of mechanism deforms the human head?...muscles indeed!

For example:
Your model is missing the nasolabialfold (it's just a fancy term for the crease on each sides of the nose) So if your character needs to make crazy nose deformation (or even a simple smile), there won't be any support for it. How do i know that? That's right, anatomy!

This should give you some pointers:

First, the gold mine that is the polycount wiki:
http://wiki.polycount.com/FaceTopology?highlight=%28\bCategoryTopology\b%29

Then some step by step how-to
http://www.3dtotal.com/ffa/tutorials/max/joanofarc/head1.php
(don't follow it blindly, understand why you are doing it that way!)

Good vs. bad topology examples & more advanced topo but useful.
http://www.phungdinhdung.org/Studies_paper/Realistic_face_modeling.shtm

Also don't be afraid to destroy parts of the model and rebuild when needed, or start from scratch, modeling subd heads takes some practice to master.

ChrisHuddersfieldUni · Oct 2011

Thanks for the feedback, them links are very helpful to me

the only reason i mentioned human realisim was so I didn't get crit'd on that :P I understand the basics of topology.
I was more worried about the poles in my face and wether they would be an issue or not, (since ive spent to long trying to get rid of the but failing)
Thanks for everything though I really appraciate it

gsokol · Oct 2011

Do you have a Turbosmooth on that? Nobody can really critique your topology if you aren't displaying it correctly. Either remove the turbosmooth or convert to editable poly so we can see how it actually looks. Your non smoothed mesh might not even have those poles.

the only reason i mentioned human realisim was so I didn't get crit'd on that

Like Psyk0 said, realistic or not, anything cartoony is rooted in anatomy. We would be letting you down if we didn't critique the anatomy.

Michael Knubben · Oct 2011

gsokol: ...ofcourse the non-smoothed model would have those poles

! Think about it for a second, how could it not? And I'd say displaying the model as intended is a good idea, as it shows off whether the poles are problematic or not.

ChrisHuddersfieldUni · Oct 2011

Hey guys, nice to see people taking an interest

I have currently been working on a new head following the tutorial posted above, I am however a bit worried now that I have a tri in the eye on my model, here are 2 pictures (one smoothed one not) to show you what i mean, and I have also posted an image of my other head but unsmoothed.

Snader · Oct 2011

ChrisHuddersfieldUni wrote: »

the character is not meant to be close to human realistic

Well at least you've got that down pat.

Seriously though, do some anatomy research. You can't exaggerate if you don't know what you're exaggerating.

Elyaradine · Oct 2011

Regarding poles in general, I believe you're going to have poles, somewhere, any time the direction of the topo flow changes/splits. The goal is then only to have them when you actually need to; to move them to areas that aren't going to deform much; and to have them distributed in such a way that problems with poles don't compound one another. (With that image in the first post for example, having two poles neighbouring one another is usually a bad thing, both for deformation and for ease of loop/ring selections. Ignoring the bad form and topology elsewhere. :P)

Noors · Oct 2011

Again, we have now tools that give us more freedom with shapes and we're not forced to take care of shape and topology at the same time like 10 years ago.
I think it would be more clever to sculpt a basic shape with sculptris or even real clay (and drawing) then ask about topology.
I'm not saying topology isn't important, it's just easier to treat it once the shape is already here.

ChrisHuddersfieldUni · Oct 2011

Hey guys, again thanks for all the helpful feedback you've all been giving me, here is an up to date version of the head im creating, I again, seem to be getting worried over an area of my face, I have a 5 sided polygon, just wondering if this would cause me any issues later during animation?

Also here are some more images of my face, and a render, any other feedback on parts that need improving would be greatly appraciated

thanks again everyone!

Render :

This head has been made using the tutorial Psyk0 kindly posted earlier, with a few slight modifcations (just getting rid of certain tri's)

I am aware that I have a lot of tweaking to do, I am mainly posting here to try get the topology right before I start tweaking away and then getting told its all wrong.

New to polycount/Need help with poles!

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