Im thinking of eventually getting one of these engines, which would be best for a free roam fps and what do you believe are the pros and cons of each, and how are they art wise? Thanks!
did you tried to search, this thread kind of feels unnecessary. In the end the most smart and wise answer you might get in the end from someone will be:
Just try them out for yourself and see what fits best YOU.
did you tried to search, this thread kind of feels unnecessary. In the end the most smart and wise answer you might get in the end from someone will be:
Just try them out for yourself and see what fits best YOU.
Well I was just trying to see if anyone was experienced with them and knew how they were long term. And I probably should have searched, I was just in a hurry so i didnt bother.
I can only talk about unity as I had a couple of c# sessions the last few days - and I think that I can do with it what I want - but that's just me and I don't know what of this experience I have is relevant to you.
It's just your initial post is so vague and this thread would be more fruitful or meaningful if you could add some stuff yourself as well. Like:
- what do you want to archive, expectations,...
- what other software do you have or use (max, maya, xsi, modo,none,..)
- prior experience with other tools (unreadEd, radiant, Flash,...)
With more informations people can give meaningful aka non wasted directions, tips, links and resources to what you need.
For example today I got another newsletter from unity sadly skipping the most important news like the progress of the apple iOS4 blocking or not. But it looks like Unity3D is getting a more grown up platform that is more customizable at first as lets say your usual game engine (unreal, source, leadwerks,...). And that is because the editor was designed and developed as such from the beginning and not something barely good enough for the initial game studio to work with for a very specific game genre (shooting in most cases).
Wow Unity 3 looks really good! Id be using Blender most likely and coded in C#. Well since you have prior experience, do you know if it would be difficult to have large 3d environments (like in an open world) or would I be likely to have to have loading in between areas?
And sorry for being frustrating i joined this forum to try and learn more about 3d art, as Im a VERY new to 3d modeling and the like and Im just starting to learn the lingo and how t actually works, so basically Im a noobie. And also the reason I posted this was because online I had trouble finding any straight up comparisons of the 2 engines. though before I even touch the engines Im going to do some modding. but anyways thanks, I'll probably be going with Unity as it seems a lot more stable and developed than leadwerks
Well one big advantage with Unity is the community and documentation. There will be always someone available or some resource available that can help you further. Whereas with something like LeadWerks you depend more or less on your own because not that many people use it and offer free help, samples, answers and support on the internet.
As for scripting in Unity:
Go straight with C# and skip JavaScript because:
- on windows you'll get ms visual c# express for free with superior code completion and hinting. Code jumping, class inspection, highlighting, real time code checking,.. and lots of other advanced stuff.
- all the advanced stuff like networking has to be done in c# anyway
- more robust and feature advanced as the JS implementation
I have more a background in 3dsMax and maxScripting so many of the editor workflows in my case are still done within 3dsMax and exported with MaxScript to unity. Imo still many of unity editor tools are broken and incomplete - it feels like that and I can't help it at this point other than relying on max for editor capabilities.
Ill keep all that in mind thanks a lot! When Unity 3 comes out Ill research a bit more, but Unity definitely seems like the more stable choice as well as by that page you posted has a lot more features. Thank you!
I have to agree with renderhjs unity is very good. I havent used it to make anything yet just tutorials and such but compared to other engines(I havent checked those other engines but I'm betting) unity is very usable and straightforward.
It doesnt have cutting edge razor sharp potential visuals, but then thats becoming less of an issue, but still the graphics are perfectly adequate and getting better.
Things are layed out and organised really well, you dont need a degree to start figuring things, it has plenty of free assets and scripts to start off with. You could know nothing and put together a game really quickly just by dragging and dropping.
Unity will probably be a big part of the future, if they keep developing it the way they are.
I use Leadwerks for my projects at Pure3d Visualizations.
The workflow has improved a lot with the current version 2.32-R5 and people can code with several languages or just go straight forward with LUA.
Graphical Leadwerks is up to date with it#s deferred renderer.
The editor is simply but intuitive. There was heavy vegetation optimizing plus an octree implementation and shadow handling got also improved under the hood.
I really can suggest Leadwerks because its also updated o a regular basis and new feature requests make it in fast. As far as I can count 5-7 requests of mine are now in the editor.
You can take a look at the graphics at www.pure3d.de
Search for the "GDC2010" Demo within projects. You also can download the Viz-App and take a look at the interactive Demo from the GDC videos. I use the same application to download and test drive my game asset shop items.
Check the Pure3d Youtube channel too.
dave Lee is also working on a nice project using Leadwerks calles "The Zone". A huge dev-thread is right here on POlycount.
leadwerks has a lot of impressive features but in my experience so far unity is impressive.For knocking up quick prototypes its awesome.
I am not too impressed with the shaders right now, but that should improve.
To work with leadwerks I feel you would need to be a lot more of a coder than with unity.
To work with leadwerks I feel you would need to be a lot more of a coder than with unity.
Yes thats particulary true but improved with .lua support a lot.
Leadwerks develops in the right direction and even people which want to make games without beeing hardcore ocder will have fun with upcoming Leadwerks 3.0.
But you will need a coder if you want to make a game. I don't know any solution without coding except FPS GameCreator.
I'm another Leadwerks user. we are working for more than a year with this engine.
graphical way: I think you can hardly find other engine with Leadwerks quality.. and also with this price! (however and as you said unity3 "pro", it means you don't bother much with money!)
code way: it supports Lua scripting language and if you know programming, you probably know what this means.
check out these videos:
the only problem with leadweks is some version stability. how ever we are developing our game with leadwerks engine. and some other new games will be out soon using leadwerks too.
I didn't experienced much with unity. so the only thing I can tell is about rendering quality.. which you can simple compare them.
PS. unity materials flexibility seems to be more than leadwerks materials..
PPS. I'm still a Leadwerker
It's kinda weird comparing 'graphics' of both engines, because it is mostly the art YOU put into it that makes it looking good(or bad). But I guess you could compare the graphics-features, and if you do that, then Unity is showing ALOT of potential I think.
The way I made my decision:
-Unity 3.0 will have Beast Lightmapping, which is a great package ( used for Mirrors Edge I think)
-Deferred Rendering
-It runs in the browser, PC,Mac, iPad,iPhone and soon: Android ( It also run/will run on the Xbox360, Wii and PS3, but those are not my target platforms, so I just left them out)
-I can code in good old C#, the only language that I like( Perhaps too dumb to get used to c++ etc)
-Huge helpful community
-All the other stuff like PhysX, good terrain Painter,Networking etc.
because it is mostly the art YOU put into it that makes it looking good(or bad).
Really true, so we decided to do some nice demos which doesnt look like "coder art".
-Unity 3.0 will have Beast Lightmapping, which is a great package ( used for Mirrors Edge I think)
-Deferred Rendering
-It runs in the browser, PC,Mac, iPad,iPhone and soon: Android ( It also run/will run on the Xbox360, Wii and PS3, but those are not my target platforms, so I just left them out)
-I can code in good old C#, the only language that I like( Perhaps too dumb to get used to c++ etc)
-Huge helpful community
-All the other stuff like PhysX, good terrain Painter,Networking etc.
Leadwerks got them all too.
I'm not allowed to talk to much about the Lightmapping but keep an eye on the Leadwerks site in around two weeks. You can also code in C#, get Newton Physics, Networking, terrain painting with PoM and global sat-image support.
Deferred Rendering is there since some versions too.
If you are looking for multi-plattform you would like to stick with Unity but at least one game is in development for PS3 using Leadwerks. Plus I really like all the documentation in Unity and I guess the community is helpfull on both forums.
At least I think features are good in both engines and someone will choose the engine who he gets used to quickly.
Yeah don't get me wrong, Leadwerks is looking really good, that list I posted is just stuff that convinced me that Unity has what I need, not that Leadwerks is lacking them all or anything.
I'll keep an eye on Leadwerks for sure
One strong argument one might have in favour of Unity is, the Indy version is free, which makes making a decision much easier. Does Leadwerks have any plans for new licensing types?
I don't know.
Maybe its getting more expensive hehe.
You can download a 30 day evaluation version and then buy for 200 USD.
So it was enough for me to have full engine with tools and more important without royalities after that.
But I dont use it for Game-Creation so its a bit different maybe.
I use Leadwerks for my projects at Pure3d Visualizations.
The workflow has improved a lot with the current version 2.32-R5 and people can code with several languages or just go straight forward with LUA.
Graphical Leadwerks is up to date with it#s deferred renderer.
The editor is simply but intuitive. There was heavy vegetation optimizing plus an octree implementation and shadow handling got also improved under the hood.
I really can suggest Leadwerks because its also updated o a regular basis and new feature requests make it in fast. As far as I can count 5-7 requests of mine are now in the editor.
You can take a look at the graphics at www.pure3d.de
Search for the "GDC2010" Demo within projects. You also can download the Viz-App and take a look at the interactive Demo from the GDC videos. I use the same application to download and test drive my game asset shop items.
Check the Pure3d Youtube channel too.
dave Lee is also working on a nice project using Leadwerks calles "The Zone". A huge dev-thread is right here on POlycount.
Ive been tracking your stuff on there for quite a while your vegetation was amazing if I need to outsource your definetly at the top of the list, and the Zone is looking really nice.
Replies
Just try them out for yourself and see what fits best YOU.
Well I was just trying to see if anyone was experienced with them and knew how they were long term. And I probably should have searched, I was just in a hurry so i didnt bother.
It's just your initial post is so vague and this thread would be more fruitful or meaningful if you could add some stuff yourself as well. Like:
- what do you want to archive, expectations,...
- what other software do you have or use (max, maya, xsi, modo,none,..)
- prior experience with other tools (unreadEd, radiant, Flash,...)
With more informations people can give meaningful aka non wasted directions, tips, links and resources to what you need.
For example today I got another newsletter from unity sadly skipping the most important news like the progress of the apple iOS4 blocking or not. But it looks like Unity3D is getting a more grown up platform that is more customizable at first as lets say your usual game engine (unreal, source, leadwerks,...). And that is because the editor was designed and developed as such from the beginning and not something barely good enough for the initial game studio to work with for a very specific game genre (shooting in most cases).
There is a link that was linked in the eMail:
http://unity3d.com/unity/coming-soon/unity-3?mkt_tok=3RkMMJWWfF9wsRonu6jJZKXonjHpfsX66uwqW6eg38431UFwdcjKPmjr1YIASsA%3D
Asset management seems to be something they finally addressed as it is almost impossible with the current build to create comparable level complexity as in tools such as Max, Maya, Unreal and alike (like no selection box).
Anyway give this thread some direction
And sorry for being frustrating i joined this forum to try and learn more about 3d art, as Im a VERY new to 3d modeling and the like and Im just starting to learn the lingo and how t actually works, so basically Im a noobie. And also the reason I posted this was because online I had trouble finding any straight up comparisons of the 2 engines. though before I even touch the engines Im going to do some modding. but anyways thanks, I'll probably be going with Unity as it seems a lot more stable and developed than leadwerks
As for scripting in Unity:
Go straight with C# and skip JavaScript because:
- on windows you'll get ms visual c# express for free with superior code completion and hinting. Code jumping, class inspection, highlighting, real time code checking,.. and lots of other advanced stuff.
- all the advanced stuff like networking has to be done in c# anyway
- more robust and feature advanced as the JS implementation
you can download the c# express edition here:
http://www.microsoft.com/express/Downloads/#2010-Visual-CS
works just fine with the Indy and professional versions of Unity3D
I have more a background in 3dsMax and maxScripting so many of the editor workflows in my case are still done within 3dsMax and exported with MaxScript to unity. Imo still many of unity editor tools are broken and incomplete - it feels like that and I can't help it at this point other than relying on max for editor capabilities.
It doesnt have cutting edge razor sharp potential visuals, but then thats becoming less of an issue, but still the graphics are perfectly adequate and getting better.
Things are layed out and organised really well, you dont need a degree to start figuring things, it has plenty of free assets and scripts to start off with. You could know nothing and put together a game really quickly just by dragging and dropping.
Unity will probably be a big part of the future, if they keep developing it the way they are.
The workflow has improved a lot with the current version 2.32-R5 and people can code with several languages or just go straight forward with LUA.
Graphical Leadwerks is up to date with it#s deferred renderer.
The editor is simply but intuitive. There was heavy vegetation optimizing plus an octree implementation and shadow handling got also improved under the hood.
I really can suggest Leadwerks because its also updated o a regular basis and new feature requests make it in fast. As far as I can count 5-7 requests of mine are now in the editor.
You can take a look at the graphics at www.pure3d.de
Search for the "GDC2010" Demo within projects. You also can download the Viz-App and take a look at the interactive Demo from the GDC videos. I use the same application to download and test drive my game asset shop items.
Check the Pure3d Youtube channel too.
dave Lee is also working on a nice project using Leadwerks calles "The Zone". A huge dev-thread is right here on POlycount.
I am not too impressed with the shaders right now, but that should improve.
To work with leadwerks I feel you would need to be a lot more of a coder than with unity.
Leadwerks develops in the right direction and even people which want to make games without beeing hardcore ocder will have fun with upcoming Leadwerks 3.0.
But you will need a coder if you want to make a game. I don't know any solution without coding except FPS GameCreator.
graphical way: I think you can hardly find other engine with Leadwerks quality.. and also with this price! (however and as you said unity3 "pro", it means you don't bother much with money!)
code way: it supports Lua scripting language and if you know programming, you probably know what this means.
check out these videos:
http://www.vimeo.com/5700094
http://www.vimeo.com/7652935
http://www.vimeo.com/5249672
the only problem with leadweks is some version stability. how ever we are developing our game with leadwerks engine. and some other new games will be out soon using leadwerks too.
I didn't experienced much with unity. so the only thing I can tell is about rendering quality.. which you can simple compare them.
PS. unity materials flexibility seems to be more than leadwerks materials..
PPS. I'm still a Leadwerker
The way I made my decision:
-Unity 3.0 will have Beast Lightmapping, which is a great package ( used for Mirrors Edge I think)
-Deferred Rendering
-It runs in the browser, PC,Mac, iPad,iPhone and soon: Android ( It also run/will run on the Xbox360, Wii and PS3, but those are not my target platforms, so I just left them out)
-I can code in good old C#, the only language that I like( Perhaps too dumb to get used to c++ etc)
-Huge helpful community
-All the other stuff like PhysX, good terrain Painter,Networking etc.
Leadwerks got them all too.
I'm not allowed to talk to much about the Lightmapping but keep an eye on the Leadwerks site in around two weeks. You can also code in C#, get Newton Physics, Networking, terrain painting with PoM and global sat-image support.
Deferred Rendering is there since some versions too.
If you are looking for multi-plattform you would like to stick with Unity but at least one game is in development for PS3 using Leadwerks. Plus I really like all the documentation in Unity and I guess the community is helpfull on both forums.
At least I think features are good in both engines and someone will choose the engine who he gets used to quickly.
I'll keep an eye on Leadwerks for sure
One strong argument one might have in favour of Unity is, the Indy version is free, which makes making a decision much easier. Does Leadwerks have any plans for new licensing types?
Maybe its getting more expensive hehe.
You can download a 30 day evaluation version and then buy for 200 USD.
So it was enough for me to have full engine with tools and more important without royalities after that.
But I dont use it for Game-Creation so its a bit different maybe.
Ive been tracking your stuff on there for quite a while your vegetation was amazing if I need to outsource your definetly at the top of the list, and the Zone is looking really nice.